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Old 09-11-2023, 08:10 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,973 posts, read 23,693,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GiveMeCoffee View Post
Um, no, it can't. You know what would solve the teacher shortage?

Living wages. Educators in my area are paid comparatively well, but that is not true in other parts of the nation. Professionals deserve a professional salary.

Autonomy. Not saying teaching should be a free-for-all, but a local admin and/or government that micromanages every single detail of a classroom lesson is going to cause a problem.

Respect. The teacher bashing that happens across the country is alarming.

Try those things before replacing us with robots or jamming 50 students in a classroom.
Well... the bolded is another of those things that is 'in the eye of the beholder'. So I think you're going to have to define that a bit.
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Old 09-12-2023, 10:47 AM
 
7,138 posts, read 3,412,115 times
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Most parents say teachers are underpaid in their schools, putting aside the grossly overpaid in a handful of places such as NYC.
Most schools are funded by property taxes (a pernicious wealth tax) and property owners say they are way overtaxed.

School districts are burdened by excess governmental regulation, just as the entire private sector economy is overburdened by governmental regulation. Several posts in this thread point to the administrative burden being excessive just so some government bureaucrats in state capitols & in Washington DC have data to summarize & include in PowerPoint presentations to other government bureaucrats.

From the point of view of the people who receive paychecks for collecting & reporting data, such excess regulation is good, for without it they wouldn't have data & their jobs would no longer be necessary.
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Old 09-12-2023, 04:19 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,973 posts, read 23,693,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moguldreamer View Post
Most parents say teachers are underpaid in their schools, putting aside the grossly overpaid in a handful of places such as NYC.
Most schools are funded by property taxes (a pernicious wealth tax) and property owners say they are way overtaxed.

School districts are burdened by excess governmental regulation, just as the entire private sector economy is overburdened by governmental regulation. Several posts in this thread point to the administrative burden being excessive just so some government bureaucrats in state capitols & in Washington DC have data to summarize & include in PowerPoint presentations to other government bureaucrats.

From the point of view of the people who receive paychecks for collecting & reporting data, such excess regulation is good, for without it they wouldn't have data & their jobs would no longer be necessary.
Although teacher pay varies by which site is reporting it, it appears that teachers in NYC make somewhere around $56,010 - $81,809. However, the cost of living in NYC "will require an annual salary of anywhere between 40K-100K" ... after taxes. I can't see how anyone would consider that "grossly overpaid".

Your comments about "governmental regulation" are so vague that it's impossible to respond. But to think that the purpose of the regulations is to make Powerpoints in absurd.
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Old 09-12-2023, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Shawnee-on-Delaware, PA
7,908 posts, read 7,245,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Although teacher pay varies by which site is reporting it, it appears that teachers in NYC make somewhere around $56,010 - $81,809...
That's the starting salary for a fresh-faced 22-year-old girl out of 4-year teacher's college. Throw a few more years and a few more college credits, and you're getting well into 6 figures.

I'm not saying NYC teachers or any teachers are overpaid. Just saying they are not as poverty-stricken as the unions want us to think. And I will reiterate that I am against "virtual teachers" and I would have to think the union is, too.

https://www.uft.org/sites/default/fi...dules-2023.pdf
https://www.teachercatalina.com/new-...eacher-salary/
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Old 09-12-2023, 06:09 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,973 posts, read 23,693,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtab4994 View Post
That's the starting salary for a fresh-faced 22-year-old girl out of 4-year teacher's college. Throw a few more years and a few more college credits, and you're getting well into 6 figures.

I'm not saying NYC teachers or any teachers are overpaid. Just saying they are not as poverty-stricken as the unions want us to think. And I will reiterate that I am against "virtual teachers" and I would have to think the union is, too.

https://www.uft.org/sites/default/fi...dules-2023.pdf
https://www.teachercatalina.com/new-...eacher-salary/
But I will go back to pay versus cost of living in a particular area.
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Old 09-12-2023, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Sydney Australia
2,131 posts, read 1,398,256 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moguldreamer View Post
American classrooms need more educators. Can virtual teachers step in to bridge the gap?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...e/70712191007/

The article cites some progress in using virtual/remote teachers. While not ideal, it seems to add some value sometimes.
All public school teachers in our state, the most populous in Australia, have just received a $10,000pa pay rise. The starting salary will be $A85,000 and go to $120,000 without promotion.

This will hopefully encourage some more high quality students to become teachers.

Nobody here is contemplating using virtual teachers nor returning to remote teaching, which caused all sorts of problems in the places where it happened during the pandemic.
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Old 09-12-2023, 07:35 PM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
9,999 posts, read 7,121,215 times
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Raise teacher pay by 20k per year and watch the magic happen. Teacher recruitment will turn around in a heartbeat after that, I guarantee it.
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Old 09-12-2023, 08:40 PM
 
12,552 posts, read 8,767,237 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57 View Post
Raise teacher pay by 20k per year and watch the magic happen. Teacher recruitment will turn around in a heartbeat after that, I guarantee it.
What do we get for the extra $20K? I just looked up the salaries of our local teachers. Those at the top end are over a hundred K per year and I'm not convinced we're getting that much value out of them. The typical teachers seemed to be in the $70K - $90K range.
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Old 09-13-2023, 12:08 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
49,973 posts, read 23,693,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
What do we get for the extra $20K? I just looked up the salaries of our local teachers. Those at the top end are over a hundred K per year and I'm not convinced we're getting that much value out of them. The typical teachers seemed to be in the $70K - $90K range.
I can say something similar for most professions.
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Old 09-13-2023, 07:49 AM
 
9,691 posts, read 7,494,108 times
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I always assumed that as technology improved, the traditional high school and college models would change. There would be more self directed learning in terms of students being able to choose their educators from anywhere and build their unique educational resume. For example, a top notch biology professor would be able to enroll as many students online in her courses as possible and would be compensated accordingly. A high school math teacher, known for his sense of humor and skills in teaching his challenging subject, could attract many students who had troubles learning with their local mediocre math teacher.

HR professionals would be looking for graduates who studied under A, B & C versus attending a particular university. Certain fields would start building lists of recommended educators.

So, not just school choice, but educator choice.
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