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I actually think this would result in the opposite effect, with all due respect to your friend. I have taught at both public and magnet schools in several states and at a variety of socioeconomic levels, and from my experience -- limited though it is -- it is clear to me that the magnet schools, despite the fact that the kids who go there are by no means rich, are far better than their "zoned school" counterparts. The difference? The ability to choose. People tend to have far more invested in a system (or a school) when they themselves have had the choice to go there or to participate in it. Giving them that power enables them to feel (and genuinely so) as if they have a stake in their own education.
You can choose to want to send your kids to a magnet school. Thing is, at least in Chicago, your child has to test and score high enough for your child to get on the list. Then, your child has to be selected to attend through a lottery system. Your child can test high enough, but even then it's not a guarantee he/she will be accepted. And if your child is not accepted, that usually means either parochial/private schools or a move to the suburbs.
Most magnet schools are the highest scoring schools, and it's clear they attract the some of the best teachers and the most involved parents. It's just discouraging seeing most neighborhood schools go to crap. I thought it was our collective responsibility that all schools were supposed to be of quality.
I am very disheartened at hearing so many teachers blame parents for practically everything wrong with the educational system today. I work with kids, too, in a pedicatrics office. We have to deal with the parents right there, up close and personal. Our guiding principle is always that parents want what's best for their kids.
There is a far greater weight of legal and social responsiblity on parents to see to their children's medical wellbeing, too, than there is to responsibly steward their educational wellbeing.
Parents are charged with neglect if they neglect their children's healthcare. Nothing happens to them if they fail to support their children's academic experience.
Do you truly believe that teachers have more influence on children than parents? Or that they should?
When these students are surrounded by students who are working hard or they spend at least two years in the military-style schools I propose, they might have a change of heart.
I believe I saw it on the news about ones in the Chicago area, this article is about on in the Philadelphia area.
This is not a bad idea, although there were critics because the schools are associated with the military.
Anyway, in various other countries teachers are highly respected, the fact that that isn't the case here is part of the problem. So adding more discipline could help.
Location: Jonquil City (aka Smyrna) Georgia- by Atlanta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KardoulaMou
You can choose to want to send your kids to a magnet school. Thing is, at least in Chicago, your child has to test and score high enough for your child to get on the list. Then, your child has to be selected to attend through a lottery system. Your child can test high enough, but even then it's not a guarantee he/she will be accepted. And if your child is not accepted, that usually means either parochial/private schools or a move to the suburbs.
Most magnet schools are the highest scoring schools, and it's clear they attract the some of the best teachers and the most involved parents. It's just discouraging seeing most neighborhood schools go to crap. I thought it was our collective responsibility that all schools were supposed to be of quality.
But it does not have to be like that. We can have magnet schools for LOW scorers that perhaps need more structure and more help- and strong teachers and a principal who is a real leader. You can have magnet and charter schools for different situations and for different types of students. They don't all have to be for only the high scores. And I do not for a fact that Walter Payton High in Chicago does have some "average" students because I know a few that go there.
Schools really have'nt evolved past the point of being a place to put kids while their parents slave away for industry. That's where they got they 40 hour week, elementary schools still have the same work day, 2hrs then break -time, 2hrs then lunch, 2hrs then break-time, 2hrs and punch -out.
students by and large are being taught only to pass tests, Music and art classes come the closest to really educating kids in those subject areas, because they are learnig and doing at the same time, which covers alot of learning styles and teaching styles. In my experince practically 100% of kids who took band in high school were prepared to take it at the college level
There is a far greater weight of legal and social responsiblity on parents to see to their children's medical wellbeing, too, than there is to responsibly steward their educational wellbeing.
Parents are charged with neglect if they neglect their children's healthcare. Nothing happens to them if they fail to support their children's academic experience.
Do you truly believe that teachers have more influence on children than parents? Or that they should?
No, I do not believe that. Nor did I say it. Though you do hear stories of teachers who were extremely influtential in some people's lives. What disturbs me is that some teachers apparently assume that the parents, all parents, are "the enemy". I'm glad I didn't know that when my kids were in school.
We do deal with some very similar issues as you do. Parents who want to do thier own diagnosing (do you have any idea how many kids we test for diseases we are virtually certain they don't have?), want antibiotics prescribed over the phone w/o seeing the child, much more. But we do stop to remind ourselves that through all this, parents DO want the best for their kids. We don't always agree with what they think is best, but we try not to lose sight of that. When their kids are sick, parents are frequently angry, snappish, and much more. We don't like that, and there are limits, but we don't assume that ALL parents are fighting us.
I don't feel that all parents are the enemy. I have known some wonderful parents that do their best, despite hard circumstances. I've also known parents who DO NOT CARE. I don't even have the time to go into details. The most extreme case was when we found out a child (in elementary school) was cutting. We had no idea where he was. The mother thought he was at school. He never showed up. When she found this out, she said she didn't want to be bothered, she was at the beauty salon. I am not kidding. When you hear and see these things, it makes you think why did this person decide to have children.
^^^I don't want to turn this into "tit for tat", but we hear stories like that, too. Parents who call the "nurse line", then don't want to bring their kids in when we recommend it b/c they have plans to go to the zoo, etc. I actually kept a list for a while and compiled them into a little book I gave out at our annual Christmas party. What you have to keep in mind is that examples like you gave are pretty extreme, though I would admit, not unheard of in health care as well.
the only way to kill the black hole is voucher system. they will not will not reform.
destruction of a bad system is sometimes the only way out.
voucher sooner the better
my personal issue---
aside from the danger to kids little innocenet children---
lots of unreported assaults and rapes of teachers in the public school system
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