My view (community college, degree, school, paying)

[okaydorothy]

I jsut returned to college in my mid 40's I absolutely love it. But cannot believe what I see in the classroom.

There are 26 of us ; mostly those in the under 25 year old group. They are constantly on facebook, typing away, chatting away and just not paying attention.

Last night a few older students actually had to stand up and ask the students who had major chats going on to be quiet. We are trying to learn and it is so distracting when we cannot even hear the professor.

Talk about a lack of respect for the teacher. Gosh when I went to school there was no way you spoke ; even in a whisper while the teacher was talking. Yes I may be old fashioned, but maybe this is a reason why students are failing.

d

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by okaydorothy

I jsut returned to college in my mid 40's I absolutely love it. But cannot believe what I see in the classroom.

There are 26 of us ; mostly those in the under 25 year old group. They are constantly on facebook, typing away, chatting away and just not paying attention.

Last night a few older students actually had to stand up and ask the students who had major chats going on to be quiet. We are trying to learn and it is so distracting when we cannot even hear the professor.

Talk about a lack of respect for the teacher. Gosh when I went to school there was no way you spoke ; even in a whisper while the teacher was talking. Yes I may be old fashioned, but maybe this is a reason why students are failing.

d

What's surprising is they're not failing. I, recently, finished my second masters degree after being out of school for a while. I too am stunned by both the lack of respect and lack of effort on the part of most students and yet they PASS???? No wonder employers want to see a masters degree before they'll believe you have anything to offer. We've dummied down education to the point you can spend the lecture on facebook and still pass.

Old fashioned or not, I consider it rude to talk or be on line while a teacher is teaching. Cell phones should be off. Computers closed unless you're taking notes on them and the only thing you should be asking your neighbor is for clarification of a point you missed. You'd think paying for education would make it worth something to these kids but it doesn't. They just want their ticket punched so they can move on and, sadly, that's all college has become.

[lisdol]

I have heard the same thing, sadly. Makes me wonder what it will be like when I finally go back.

As long ago as 1998, I was in a class where someone's phone rang and the instructor got huffy and said - no cell phones in my class. I know when I am looking at programs (in health professions) they have specific rules about no phones, etc...in class and it can get you sent home for the day in clinicals (I think part of that is many of these devices have cameras and violating HIPAA can happen if someone takes a photo) but I am sure a big part of it is the need to text constantly that some people have. They also have a formal process set up for contacting the student in an emergency so no one can say they need their phone in case there is an emergency with their kids/family.

My experience in 1998 was that the younger students (I was out of college and went back for a vocational program) - meaning the ones out of HS for no more than a few yrs - wanted the information spoon-fed. When there was a test coming up (the first test)- someone asked the instructor what would be on it, and the instructor said "Every chapter we have covered up until now" (which was about 3 chapters). So many people balked that she was not going to do a test review or give them a study sheet specifying what would be on the test. Granted, this was a technical college (GAs version of community college) and these were, for the most part, not the students that were in the honors classes in HS, but still, I was amazed at how upset they were about her teaching style.

[reloop]

Originally Posted by okaydorothy

There are 26 of us ; mostly those in the under 25 year old group. They are constantly on facebook, typing away, chatting away and just not paying attention.

Ahhhhh...welcome to the wonderful world of today's ADHD education/world. I honestly feel like a crusty ole poop when I think that some of the ilk that's say, in the under 25 group, are so self-centered and self-involved that they wouldn't know if the classroom was on fire. It makes me wonder if the technology that they were raised on has somehow trampled any learning of human face-to-face interaction skills.

The chatters ought to be tossed out on their ears, but of course, they won't be.

[reloop]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

What's surprising is they're not failing. I, recently, finished my second masters degree after being out of school for a while. I too am stunned by both the lack of respect and lack of effort on the part of most students and yet they PASS???? No wonder employers want to see a masters degree before they'll believe you have anything to offer. We've dummied down education to the point you can spend the lecture on facebook and still pass.

Old fashioned or not, I consider it rude to talk or be on line while a teacher is teaching. Cell phones should be off. Computers closed unless you're taking notes on them and the only thing you should be asking your neighbor is for clarification of a point you missed. You'd think paying for education would make it worth something to these kids but it doesn't. They just want their ticket punched so they can move on and, sadly, that's all college has become.

Amen.

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by reloop

Ahhhhh...welcome to the wonderful world of today's ADHD education/world. I honestly feel like a crusty ole poop when I think that some of the ilk that's say, in the under 25 group, are so self-centered and self-involved that they wouldn't know if the classroom was on fire. It makes me wonder if the technology that they were raised on has somehow trampled any learning of human face-to-face interaction skills.

The chatters ought to be tossed out on their ears, but of course, they won't be.

This is kind of off topic, but I see today's kids as self centered too. I'm wondering why that is?

They also think they're GREAT because they grew up with technology. Sometimes I have to remind them that my generation didn't grow up with it, we invented it.

Here's my take. I think that somewhere about the 1970's parenting becamse child centered. The family started revolving around the child. Now they're adults and think the world should revolve around them. What do you think?

[mm_mary73]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

...Here's my take. I think that somewhere about the 1970's parenting becamse child centered. The family started revolving around the child. Now they're adults and think the world should revolve around them. What do you think?

and heaven forbid you ask them to volunteer for projects without "extra credit"

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by mm_mary73

and heaven forbid you ask them to volunteer for projects without "extra credit"

I wanted to do a lab that involved making S'Mores last year. I asked the kids to bring in candy bars and I'd get the rest. Without fail, they asked "Do we get extra credit?". I'm like, um, no, you get to eat S'mores in chemistry class.

The kids expect me to have things like kleenex, hand sanitizer, pencils and paper in class for them but if I ask them to bring some in, they want extra credit. Since when is bringing in kleenex that you use worthy of extra credit?

I think I should quit giving credit at all and just make everything extra credit. I could start the kids out at minus 1000 points and make everything extra credit . Do you think that would work? Do 800 points "extra credit" and get a B- . I wonder if they'd do more work that way.

[anadyr21]

Originally Posted by Ivorytickler

What's surprising is they're not failing. I, recently, finished my second masters degree after being out of school for a while. I too am stunned by both the lack of respect and lack of effort on the part of most students and yet they PASS???? No wonder employers want to see a masters degree before they'll believe you have anything to offer. We've dummied down education to the point you can spend the lecture on facebook and still pass.

Old fashioned or not, I consider it rude to talk or be on line while a teacher is teaching. Cell phones should be off. Computers closed unless you're taking notes on them and the only thing you should be asking your neighbor is for clarification of a point you missed. You'd think paying for education would make it worth something to these kids but it doesn't. They just want their ticket punched so they can move on and, sadly, that's all college has become.

Depending on the school, the rubric for determining the final grade is standardized and makes it almost impossible to fail a student. I taught at one school where you could fail the midterm and final with grades in the 50s and still pass with a C if you came to class and did the work. Some departments will look at you funny if too many of your students are failing, and professors want their tenure.

My experience in 1998 was that the younger students (I was out of college and went back for a vocational program) - meaning the ones out of HS for no more than a few yrs - wanted the information spoon-fed. When there was a test coming up (the first test)- someone asked the instructor what would be on it, and the instructor said "Every chapter we have covered up until now" (which was about 3 chapters). So many people balked that she was not going to do a test review or give them a study sheet specifying what would be on the test. Granted, this was a technical college (GAs version of community college) and these were, for the most part, not the students that were in the honors classes in HS, but still, I was amazed at how upset they were about her teaching style.

Sadly, this is the standard for a class these days. Powerpoints and notes available online, study guides, review sessions, etc. It is spoon fed to the point where if I were in college now, I'd see no reason to go to class. Everything I need is online. What do I need the professor for? And ghod forbid the professor talks about anything not in the book or not on the test. I actually had a complaint on my student evaluation sheet that I talk about things that won't be covered on the test. And then they complain about having to take (write) notes because it should all be in a powerpoint they can just download.

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by anadyr21

Depending on the school, the rubric for determining the final grade is standardized and makes it almost impossible to fail a student. I taught at one school where you could fail the midterm and final with grades in the 50s and still pass with a C if you came to class and did the work. Some departments will look at you funny if too many of your students are failing, and professors want their tenure.


Sadly, this is the standard for a class these days. Powerpoints and notes available online, study guides, review sessions, etc. It is spoon fed to the point where if I were in college now, I'd see no reason to go to class. Everything I need is online. What do I need the professor for? And ghod forbid the professor talks about anything not in the book or not on the test. I actually had a complaint on my student evaluation sheet that I talk about things that won't be covered on the test. And then they complain about having to take (write) notes because it should all be in a powerpoint they can just download.

I've been told that I have to have everything on line next year. I sympathize with students not wanting to talk about anything not on the test. I can't tell you how many times a day I'm asked "Will this be on the test?". As if only stuff that will be tested is important. It's a real issue for me. Many of the introductory activities I do in chemistry don't lend themselves to being graded but they help a lot with the concepts but many of my students simply won't do them if it's not being graded. I grade way more than I care to but if I didn't, my failure rate would be twice what it is.

I'm going to give participation points this year. It goes against my nature to just give points for doing what you were supposed to without grading something but I'm tired of dealing with students who think participation is optional if it's not being graded. I write them up, send them to the office and call their parents but nothing changes. If it's not graded, they're not doing it....well, unless it involves blowing something up. THAT they'd do.

So far, I haven't let them blow anything up.