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Old 09-30-2009, 12:52 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,979 posts, read 44,793,389 times
Reputation: 13684

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandpointian View Post
I almost do not mind passionate but wrong headed policy types. You beat them around the head with logic until (a) they come around or (b) they get embarrassed and shamed by their ignorance and they leave the scene.

However, what we see with Obama and friends is Utopian mumbo jumbo. Sadly, those that will suffer most are the brightest poor kids.

S.
The thing of it is, I honestly do think Obama and Ayers had good intentions. They probably really did want to increase opportunities for inner-city students, and for all students. The problem is, they go about it all wrong, and are so heavily invested in their perceived solutions that their egos will not allow them to recognize that their preferred methods are destined to be misguided failures and they need to, instead, try what has actually been proven to work.
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Old 09-30-2009, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Rocket City, U.S.A.
1,806 posts, read 5,705,121 times
Reputation: 865
Has anyone else mentioned this yet...if so, I missed it. My apologies.

What if the teaching day was reorganized in to fewer subjects for a longer period of time? Meaning instead of blips (of math, social studies, English, political science, PE, etc...) each day was structured to focus intensely on a more limited array of subjects, alternating through-out the week. The teachers would have more time to TEACH it, the kids would have more time to learn it. Homework would serve to reinforce the lessons instead of being work not completed in class.
Now, I'm trying to make a logical argument, but I understand staffing issues. Instructor vs. student ratio, classroom availability. And can all the required subjects and electives be worked in using such a system? I don't know. It's just something that seems to make sense, if modifications could be made.

I haven't been in HS since the mid 80's...how long is the school day now and what are the current core subjects?
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Old 09-30-2009, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,525,084 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458 View Post
Has anyone else mentioned this yet...if so, I missed it. My apologies.

What if the teaching day was reorganized in to fewer subjects for a longer period of time? Meaning instead of blips (of math, social studies, English, political science, PE, etc...) each day was structured to focus intensely on a more limited array of subjects, alternating through-out the week. The teachers would have more time to TEACH it, the kids would have more time to learn it. Homework would serve to reinforce the lessons instead of being work not completed in class.
Now, I'm trying to make a logical argument, but I understand staffing issues. Instructor vs. student ratio, classroom availability. And can all the required subjects and electives be worked in using such a system? I don't know. It's just something that seems to make sense, if modifications could be made.

I haven't been in HS since the mid 80's...how long is the school day now and what are the current core subjects?
You're talking about block scheduling and it does not work. While you can go more in depth, you end up teaching less in the course of a year. The problem arises in pacing. Comparing a class that meets tiwce for 60 minutes each to one meeting once for 120 minutes, after 60 minutes, it would normally be time to assign homework and let the kids go home and try before picking up and moving on the next day. Now I have a choice. I must either choose to move on without the class having had time to try the work themselves or take time in class to do what, otherwise would have been homework. If I do the former, I confuse my class because we haven't reinforced one concept before going on to the next. If I do the latter, I use class time I would otherwise use for teaching new material for what would have been homework and have less teaching time in the end.

Last year, I taught some classes on the block and some off. I tried to keep them on the same material. It was impossible. The classes I met with daily were capable of moving much faster simply because I could assign 20 minutes of homework a night without taking up 20 minutes of class time. To slow them down, I had to insert one class period of reinforcement a week. By Wednesday I had taught everything I was going to teach my block classes that only met twice a week.

I like longer class periods but it can't be at the expense of how many times a week you meet. The overall number of classes is what determines the pace not the number of minutes spent in class. It's hard on students when you have to teach two topics in one class period. It gives you a pace closer to a college class and most high schoolers are not ready for that.
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Old 09-30-2009, 02:08 PM
 
204 posts, read 635,104 times
Reputation: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by CollegeGuy9 View Post
I like these ideas from Obama, but many public school boards earn a "F" when it comes to educating today's children. It costs anywhere from $6,000 to $8,000 per year per student for a public education, and the results are usually horrid. I saw give each parent a $5,000 voucher so they can send their kids to any school they want. It would be a great kick in the ass for the public school board and would force them to improve the quality of education being delivered. The competition should result in better education.

Now before I get called nasty names, hear me out. It's the poor that would benefit most from this. The rich send their kids to the best schools anyway. The poor are basically ignored. A $5,000 voucher however would give them a loud voice. Tuition at private schools varies greatly, but the general range is approximately $3,000 to $4,000 a year. The potential to receive $5,000 per year per student will result in private sector schools competing against public sector schools. Parents will vote by choosing which school offers the superior education. Overcapacity schools in deteriorating condition in minority neighborhoods would no longer be ignored by the local school board. Parents would immediately jump ship to the better options. And better options will exist as any businessperson would make a fortune to invest in areas the school board neglects. A little competition can be a good thing!

Complete non-sense from a school board to prove my point: the school district bans walking and riding a bike to school.

School district could backpedal on policy

The biking debate started last spring, when school district officials told Kaddo Marino that Adam was violating school rules by biking to class. Walking to the school also is not permitted.
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Old 09-30-2009, 05:51 PM
 
Location: Central CT, sometimes FL and NH.
4,537 posts, read 6,797,775 times
Reputation: 5979
Today's WSJ reveals more of the plan, that is, charter schools and merit pay. Al Sharpton teaming up with Newt Gingrich.

Sharpton, Gingrich and Duncan: Today’s Lesson Is Bipartisanship - Washington Wire - WSJ
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Old 09-30-2009, 07:03 PM
 
Location: Suburbia
8,826 posts, read 15,314,403 times
Reputation: 4533
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
$75K? In my dreams. I won't make half of that when I retire if I stay in this job.
Again, it depends on where you are (cost of living differences).
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Old 09-30-2009, 07:12 PM
 
Location: Suburbia
8,826 posts, read 15,314,403 times
Reputation: 4533
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Wallace View Post
So your school does...(whispers very, very softly...) tracking?
I guess it could be considered that, but the groups are flexible. Students aren't necessarily stuck in a group once they are in it. It works well.
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Old 09-30-2009, 08:34 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,525,084 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgbwc View Post
Again, it depends on where you are (cost of living differences).
In my dreams. I'm in Michigan. COL is farily high. I WISH I was in a low COL area. My problem is the only jobs open to me are in charter schools and they do not pay their teachers.
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Old 10-01-2009, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Bend, OR
3,296 posts, read 9,686,764 times
Reputation: 3343
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Play is overrated.
This is really sad to me. Since when is play overrated? Play allows our children to grow their imagination, to explore, to understand the natural world. How can we not allow our children play time. I see this country as producing robots. I want freethinkers, inventors, not people who do well on tests.
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Old 10-01-2009, 12:16 PM
 
2,839 posts, read 9,980,752 times
Reputation: 2944
All I can say, is thank God I homeschool! No, I would not want my kids in school for 50 or 60 hours per week. Why not just send them off at age 5 to live at school? Who needs parents, families, free play, etc, anyway? Scary.
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