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I am a fan of the Singapore math system, but the reason is because it gives a solid base upon which to learn "math thinking". In my opinion, you need several things to be successful in math - a solid base of basic math facts, the ability to understand math logic, and the persistence to think through math problems. Singapore gives you these skills in a logical way.
I cringed when my 3rd grader came home with a calculator for math. 3rd grade should be all about learning those facts in and out. The only way to do that is repetition.
Then there is a logic to math - if a student can understand that 100 + 100 = 200 mentally. Singapore teaches them that they also can "mentally" add 98 + 98 by mentally figuring out 100 + 100 = 200 - 4 for an answer of 196. Kids need to be taught this skill - it does not come naturally for most. Mental math is a large component of Singapore Math.
And last, it teaches math logic. It is very heavy with word problems that make kids think (thus solving algebra problems without knowing algebraic formulas yet...) Most Singapore word problems from about 4th grade on need several steps to solve the problem which also encourages persistence. (I don't remember where I saw this, but someone did a research study about how long students will work at a problem until they give up. American students were at something dismal like a minute or two....) Comparable "US curriculum" word problems that I have seen are not as challenging. So again, Singapore is teaching math logic in a systematic way and teaches children persistence in getting to the answer.
We keep trying to reinvent the wheel, but get away from the basics that I feel make students successful in math.
Research shows that schools using Singapore math do score higher on standardized test, but I'm guessing any curriculum that stressed the same math foundation would also see higher scores.
Now don't get me started about elementary math teachers and lack of enthusiasm for teaching math.... That's a whole other topic to discuss when looking at why students are not successful at math....
Consistency itself has great benefits, so one should always think twice about abandoning what works.
Thanks for the link. I will check it out.
There is nothing "bad" about Singapore. It is a place close to my heart. Rather, the other countries produce the finest mathematicians and scientists in the world by a country mile. Also, I see no leadership with Singapore on mathematical methods. In fact, SM itself was created as a hybrid of other systems with its own local twist.
I think whether SM is right for one will depend on what game is to be played. If it is excellence, rigour and competition, then I would not advocate for SM. If it is to get involved with algebra where previously it was "all greek," then one should always consider alternatives. In the case of the latter, if the teacher is excited about SM, then the student will be too.
Final comment. Take my advice. Do not assign too much meaning to an "A" in a class. Too many schools have low standards or grade on curves. What ultimately matters is the ability to tackle problems that her peers around the world can tackle. Use the Lial/Hornsby problems as a global benchmark. Your daughters will thank you when they are able to keep their jobs from being exported to those who eat Lial/Hornsby for breakfast.
S.
I've looked at what she's doing in math and it's sound. What she's doing now will prepare her for calculus at a local community college during her senior year. Whether she passes any one test is neither here nor there. What matters is she's ready for the next step in education. I'm confident she will be. My math background is stronger than most and she's heading down a path that will take her, at least, as far as I went if she wants. As to the tests you suggest, unfortunately, a hand full of people able to pass such tests wouldn't keep jobs here. We'd have to show that our students do so as a matter of routine.
Thanks for the info. I'll have to look up Lial/Hornsby. I'm not familiar with it.
This is the first thing I came up with googling and both of my kids can do any of this. Dd#1 (9th grade) has already had all of this. Dd#2 (7th grade) covered material identical to this in the first weeks of the school year. The only part she struggled with was the variable in the denominator but she got that fast enough once she realized it was ok to treat the variable like a number so you could isolate it. For some reason kids don't like to multiply by a variable to get it out of the denominator (and they forget to declare that said variable can not be zero when they do). Looking at what dd was doing six weeks into the school year, I'm going to say she's on the right track.
I've looked at what she's doing in math and it's sound. What she's doing now will prepare her for calculus at a local community college during her senior year.
Good. It is often better for high school students to learn the same subject material in a college/uni.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler
Whether she passes any one test is neither here nor there. What matters is she's ready for the next step in education. I'm confident she will be.
Well, well-designed tests, as opposed to aptitude tests like the SAT, should help you. Otherwise, how to determine objectively her preparedness?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler
As to the tests you suggest, unfortunately, a hand full of people able to pass such tests wouldn't keep jobs here. We'd have to show that our students do so as a matter of routine.
I do not follow. In any case, there are tests and there are tests. The exams I am thinking of are designed by you as diagnostics. They need not be standardized tests.
Note: The link you gave is NOT Algebra II, but pre-algebra or the level beneath! These are probably the easiest of all problems one can find in Lial and not close to fair representation. Do yourself a favor, try these Algebra I problems...these are closer to what the global standard would be. These are taken from an exam for Honours Algebra.
I hope that most people are not considering the merits to Singapore math versus classes that teach calculators! Heaven forbid!
Quote:
Originally Posted by littlefamily
Then there is a logic to math - if a student can understand that 100 + 100 = 200 mentally. Singapore teaches them that they also can "mentally" add 98 + 98 by mentally figuring out 100 + 100 = 200 - 4 for an answer of 196. Kids need to be taught this skill - it does not come naturally for most. Mental math is a large component of Singapore Math.
This skill is not just Singapore Maths.
When one looks at multiplication, the hardest numbers are those ending in 6, 7, 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by littlefamily
And last, it teaches math logic. It is very heavy with word problems that make kids think (thus solving algebra problems without knowing algebraic formulas yet...) Most Singapore word problems from about 4th grade on need several steps to solve the problem which also encourages persistence. (I don't remember where I saw this, but someone did a research study about how long students will work at a problem until they give up. American students were at something dismal like a minute or two....) Comparable "US curriculum" word problems that I have seen are not as challenging. So again, Singapore is teaching math logic in a systematic way and teaches children persistence in getting to the answer.
The word problems on the attached are not from Singapore Maths. Since when are word problems tantamount to Singapore Maths.
Quote:
Originally Posted by littlefamily
Research shows that schools using Singapore math do score higher on standardized test, but I'm guessing any curriculum that stressed the same math foundation would also see higher scores.
Singapore is infamous for teaching to the test, so I would not pay much attention to such comparisons. There are more real world comparisons one can make that indicate the excellence of one;s math education. The countries I listed before are well known for math excellence and do not bother with gimmickry.
But let me say this. If the math education in the US over the past 40 years has deteriorated (under whose tutleage?) such that teachers and parents really do believe that the US "needs" Singapore maths, then we are in more trouble than I could have ever imagined.
On the other hand, if the visual nature of SM (as presented) can help grab kids who seem unreachable by more conventional approaches, then that is certainly nothing to discount.
But let me say this. If the math education in the US over the past 40 years has deteriorated (under whose tutleage?) such that teachers and parents really do believe that the US "needs" Singapore maths, then we are in more trouble than I could have ever imagined.
On the other hand, if the visual nature of SM (as presented) can help grab kids who seem unreachable by more conventional approaches, then that is certainly nothing to discount.
But that it has come to edutainment is very sad.
S.
I don't feel that Singapore math is the "the best". What I do feel is that when taught properly, it encompasses skills that I feel are important in a solid math education. Any curriculum that stresses mastery through repitition, number logic and persistence through multi-step word problems would do just as well.
I also homeschool with Singapore, so I also am able to use the other resources in the program such as the Challenging Word Problems to compliment our math curriculum. But once we have completed level 6, we will switch to Lial's.
Now my other child who is in public school, but started in Singapore at home, is in a district that uses Everyday Math. I can tell you that she far better prepared for upper maths by having that solid base. She is in 6th grade and has classmates that cannot multiply using the tradional algorithms. What those kids will do when they start higher maths I am not sure. (Everyday Math is also the program that introduces calculators in 3rd grade - but that daughter came back home after a few months! )
Now my other child who is in public school, but started in Singapore at home, is in a district that uses Everyday Math. I can tell you that she far better prepared for upper maths by having that solid base. She is in 6th grade and has classmates that cannot multiply using the tradional algorithms. What those kids will do when they start higher maths I am not sure. (Everyday Math is also the program that introduces calculators in 3rd grade - but that daughter came back home after a few months! )
I would probably benefit by sitting in on EDM just to see what they are doing. It just sounds so horrible to have 6th graders unable to multiply and using calculators. With years of this, perhaps it is no surprise that SM is seen as a saviour. That I cannot say, although SM's supporters are impressive in their consistent enthusiasm. However, I would go back to my original post on this thread to reiterate that there are many math curricula that generate great results and that are homegrown. Above all else, what is need is a great teacher.
I would probably benefit by sitting in on EDM just to see what they are doing. It just sounds so horrible to have 6th graders unable to multiply and using calculators. With years of this, perhaps it is no surprise that SM is seen as a saviour. That I cannot say, although SM's supporters are impressive in their consistent enthusiasm. However, I would go back to my original post on this thread to reiterate that there are many math curricula that generate great results and that are homegrown. Above all else, what is need is a great teacher.
S.
I'm not sure where this misconception comes from. EDM most certainly teaches multiplication. By the time my daughter was done with third grade, she and her schoolmates had all their math facts down pat.
I would probably benefit by sitting in on EDM just to see what they are doing. It just sounds so horrible to have 6th graders unable to multiply and using calculators. With years of this, perhaps it is no surprise that SM is seen as a saviour. That I cannot say, although SM's supporters are impressive in their consistent enthusiasm. However, I would go back to my original post on this thread to reiterate that there are many math curricula that generate great results and that are homegrown. Above all else, what is need is a great teacher.
S.
Why does it matter where the math program is grown? Singapore math works. There is no need to reinvent something that already works.
What I love about Singapore math is how little time it took to teach math to my kids. The NEVER had homework yet they learned math very well. Given that the support a child has at home is hit or miss, IMO, a program that doesn't require parental support would be a good thing.
We went from EDM which had my daughters doing homework every night and me on line every day trying to figure out the many mehods of EDM to never seeing a math book for years yet my daughters are now years ahead of their peers in math. I speak for most of the parents at my dd's old school when I say this is a program that works. I don't need to look at home grown when I already have something that works and works well.
I don't care what country my children's math program was written in as long as it works. We really need to get over ourselves. We're not the the only game in the education market. In fact, we're not even contenders if you look at our rankings. We could stand to learn a thing or two from countries that teach better than we do.
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