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Old 08-31-2011, 06:53 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExcuses View Post
It isn't right, is it.

Teens get all those accommodations in school, then go to college. Can't be too terribly 'disabled'. Some even get propped up during college. What happens when they go out into the workforce? They will have jobs to do and employers won't be holding their hands. They will be expected to tow the line all by themselves.

Parents do their children no favors by finding the least little things wrong with their kids and having them specially taught all through school. Those kids never learn how to stand on their own and make something of themselves.

Some parents do it to give their kids a boost above and beyond what everyone else gets, others do it for the check.
Here's Jeremy Sicile-Kira at his high school graduation. He took an extra two years in high school because he wanted to get a regular diploma.


Jeremy Sicile-Kira's High School Commencement Speech - YouTube

He's now in college. He uses power point and his letter board. Do you think that the accommodations that were made so he could get there were not needed? Do you truly believe that he should not be in college?
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:05 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExcuses View Post
When a student is in honors classes and has an aide to help him because of an IEP, I'd question the label of disabled. It happens all the time.

Funny how a huge amount of students suddenly became disabled these past few years with things that didn't even exist years ago.

In the past, parents didn't use the word disability as an excuse for junior's normal behavior and lack of interest in academics.
I have actually never seen a one on one aide in a high school classroom for a learning disability. In general, the aides have been for teens who have physical disabilities. I can't get a one on one aide for my 7 year old autistic grandson and he actually needs one.
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:09 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tough Questions View Post
So what happens to the kids who got accommodations in High School when they go to college? Are they still given extra time to complete the tests? How about when they get a good job as an adult, is the boss going to give them a break because they tested for ADHD or dyslexia?
In general, colleges do make accommodations. In the workplace, things will depend on what the job is. There are jobs where deadlines are NOT important. The thing is that people with ADHD learn to make their own accommodations so that they can meet the requirements of a good job.
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by filihok View Post
The proof here should be in the pudding.

If individuals with disabilities are finding and retaining work that was unavailable to the them before these interventions were begun then it is absolutely the right thing to do.
Yes, and some companies are finding that people with disabilities do a fantastic job. Just look at Walgreen's distribution center. They include all kinds of disabilities both physical and mental.

Walgreens Hiring Disabled on NBC Nightly News - Digg (http://digg.com/news/business/walgreens_hiring_disabled_on_nbc_nightly_news - broken link)

Program puts the

Quote:
For Walgreens, the outreach is no charity. Disabled workers must meet the same performance standards as their non-disabled colleagues, Lewis said, and the company expects its new distribution center to be fully as efficient and cost-effective as its traditional facilities.
Logistics News: Walgreens on How to Make a Program for Disabled Workers in the DC Work

Quote:
Scarbrough said that in the Anderson DC, “Every department in the building has someone with a disclosed disability working successfully, and across shifts.”

That even includes fork truck drivers.
Quote:
In the end, Lewis says the program has had a neutral impact on productivity (it has remained the same), and that the benefits overall have far outweighed the investment, which has mostly been in management time and attention to the program, plus the software modifications.

“We have better teamwork, fewer accidents, less turnover, and management that is much more engaged,” Lewis said. “Just as important, we have a sense of purpose, and there is a halo effect around the whole logistics division in terms of what we are accomplishing.”
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:32 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExcuses View Post
I do not believe in any 'spectrum'. Autism is severe, I used to work with an autistic teen.
It does happen every day, you posted the statistics yourself in the bolded in above quote.

I think a huge amount of so called disabilities is manufactured. I have worked in education for a lot of years and worked with children even longer. No one can convince me that because every child isn't going to sit in a chair for X amount of hours a day has something wrong with him; because every child is not the best reader that there is some disability behind it.

It isn't at all about your child taking anything away from my child. It's all about the fact that some kids have to just plain work harder, and these kids don't because they get all these extra allowances.

If time isn't a factor in tests, then ALL kids should have all the time it takes them to finish.

If reading isn't what comes easy, then they should work harder and focus on doing better in reading.

Things like that.
Working with one autistic teenager gives you NO insight into autism and the spectrum.

My grandson is autistic and severely affected in some ways - he struggles to speak, struggles with fine and gross motor activities, yet he is not below average in his intelligence. Socially he struggles too. He is being mainstreamed though we are not sure that will continue after first grade because he struggles with the noise, the florescent lights and he needs individual help with his handwriting for academics.

My granddaughter, otoh, is in 4th grade, and is definitely on the spectrum. We have chosen not to have an IEP for her because she does well academically and her teachers have been helpful up until now by simply working with her to keep her focused. She gets straight As and does well on the state tests, but she is obviously autistic in terms of being socially clueless and the kids think she is weird, so they tease her. She is, luckily, pretty oblivious to the teasing and thinks that kids are her friends when they are not really.

If you could be on our special needs boards, you would hear parents who wish that their children did not need accommodations. We get so tired of all the therapy and the IEP meetings and having to get an advocate just to get the services our children need. I don't know of any parent (though I am sure there are a few) who wants a child labeled when he does not need it.
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:41 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExcuses View Post
How many disabled people would you hire to work with high voltage? Surgeons take their time to do things right as well, but how many surgeons are there who are labeled 'disabled' and can't read? Or who are truely disabled.
Perhaps not surgeons, but there are many doctors with various disabilities, including ADHD.

amednews: Able to practice: Physicians with disabilities do what it takes to thrive :: Jan. 17, 2005 ... American Medical News

Are doctors with ADHD better suited to primary care?
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:58 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyway31 View Post
You're comparing apples to oranges. Eyesight is:
1) Specifically measurable
2) Completely out of the control of the person in question.

To be diagnosed as "learning disabled", a kid needs to have a normal "inteligence" rating but poor school performance. Now, can ya think of reasons why school performance might be low? Is it all out of the student's control??? Hardly. There are A LOT of reasons why a kid may not learn the material and have low grades and not master grade-level material. How about not paying attention in class? Not doing homework? If a kid consistently decides not to pay attention to lessons and not put much effort into schoolwork, guess what? They aren't going to learn much of anything. Do that over the course of a couple of years of school and guess what? The kid is going to test a couple of years below grade level. Really, the combination of "average intelligence" with below-grade level performance is all that is needed to justify a SPED diagnosis. Far too many times, the kid having test scores below grade level is a product of the scenario descirbed above. That's not to say that there aren't kids with disabilities that need accomodations. But, the reality is, in many districts, SPED is littered with kids that don't belong there.
Just because you cannot see the difference in the child's brain does NOT mean that it isn't there. Learning disabilities *are* specific.


Learning Disabilities in Children: Symptoms, Types, and Testing

[/quote]
Common Types of Learning Disabilities

Dyslexia
Difficulty processing language
Problems reading, writing, spelling, speaking

Dyscalculia
Difficulty with math
Problems doing math problems, understanding time, using money

Dysgraphia
Difficulty with writing
Problems with handwriting, spelling, organizing ideas

Dyspraxia (Sensory Integration Disorder)
Difficulty with fine motor skills
Problems with hand–eye coordination, balance, manual dexterity

Auditory Processing Disorder
Difficulty hearing differences between sounds
Problems with reading, comprehension, language

Visual Processing Disorder
Difficulty interpreting visual information
Problems with reading, math, maps, charts, symbols, pictures[/quote]

[quote]
By third grade, suspect a problem when your child:

Does not connect letters and sounds;
Cannot read grade-level text;
Cannot understand what he reads;
Cannot understand number concepts;
Does not understand that numerals represent quantities;
Cannot form letters or remember which letters stand for which sounds;
Has difficulty following directions, even with help;
Has poor memory;
Has difficulty communicating with peers and adults;
Cannot repeat information or copy items;
Has difficulty following lines when cutting; and
Has difficulty with attention or behavior. [quote]
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Old 09-01-2011, 04:29 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,466,787 times
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I don't think it matters. In the end, it's what you know and what you can do that matters not what score you got on the ACT no matter how much time you were given.
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Old 09-01-2011, 09:48 AM
 
912 posts, read 1,329,721 times
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[quote=artsyguy;14029682]I also believe that parents should teach their kids to mind their own business and focus on their own grade. Stop sticking your nose into other kids' issues and concerns.

If your child is excellent at exam taking and is well prepared. Then why should you be concerned with the other students who get extra time because of their mild disability?

School is to learn. Focus on your own learning. Stop focusing on everyone else.[/quote

I know many adults that could learn that lesson of minding one's own business.
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Old 09-01-2011, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Eastern time zone
4,469 posts, read 7,181,651 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardianlady View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by artsyguy View Post
I also believe that parents should teach their kids to mind their own business and focus on their own grade. Stop sticking your nose into other kids' issues and concerns.

If your child is excellent at exam taking and is well prepared. Then why should you be concerned with the other students who get extra time because of their mild disability?

School is to learn. Focus on your own learning. Stop focusing on everyone else.
I know many adults that could learn that lesson of minding one's own business.
Indeed, but then where would internet forums be?
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