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Old 02-27-2012, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
22,697 posts, read 16,176,460 times
Reputation: 12699

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
What the hell is the matter with him? Not only is he crazy, but he's not even making political sense. Does he not realize that most Americans are NOT religious fanatics??? Most of us send our kids to private schools, expect our kids to go to college, use contraception and are religiously moderate, if at all. These comments not only will be used against him if he's nominated this fall, but they'll be used to destroy the GOP's standing with mainstream voters.

I'm also irritated because as an evangelical, I know he's affecting how non-Christians see us. They already think we're a little off as it is, but after this guy's through. I won't be able to say that I'm a Christian without people wondering if I'm as nutty as he is. He's doing so much damage to Christianity in America I don't know where to begin.

ARGH!!!!
Excellent points.

He just totally brought the crazy this weekend.
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:34 AM
 
39,995 posts, read 24,249,026 times
Reputation: 12580
Quote:
Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
What the hell is the matter with him? Not only is he crazy, but he's not even making political sense. Does he not realize that most Americans are NOT religious fanatics??? Most of us send our kids to private schools, expect our kids to go to college, use contraception and are religiously moderate, if at all. These comments not only will be used against him if he's nominated this fall, but they'll be used to destroy the GOP's standing with mainstream voters.

I'm also irritated because as an evangelical, I know he's affecting how non-Christians see us. They already think we're a little off as it is, but after this guy's through. I won't be able to say that I'm a Christian without people wondering if I'm as nutty as he is. He's doing so much damage to Christianity in America I don't know where to begin.

ARGH!!!!
During the nomination process, potential nominees move towards the extreme positions to capture the votes of the people who are most passionate about getting a nominee who represents them. Conservatives move further to the right, liberals move further to the left. Because within the parties, the people who are most vocal and most active during the primaries are the people who are most dissatisfied with the current political status quo, who feel the most disenfranchised. And those people are the people who are more extreme in their political viewpoint. That's why the Republican nominees haven't been screaming, "I'm the more moderate candidate, I'm willing to make political compromises, I'm an insider!" They want to appeal to the people who are going to vote in the primaries, and that's the people who are unhappy because their position isn't reflected in mainstream politics. Democratic candidates do the same thing, pandering to the more liberal, more radical parts of the party to secure nomination.

The dance comes after nomination, when you have to start stumping as a moderate, middle-of-the-road, reasonable candidate to appeal to the most voters in the general public. Because you don't want to make your core support from you party feel betrayed, but you've got to betray them. You can't win election appealing to a core base. You have to appeal to the general electorate.
And you have to do it and still maintain an impression of integrity. There's a reason Santorum is winning and yet the same people are acknowledging that he can't win the general election. People aren't stupid. They understand how the process works. But this is an important part of the conversation, of the political discourse that is the real point of elections. If Santorum just maintains his current level of support, whether he wins the nomination of his party or not, it tells his party and it tells our political leaders on all point of the political spectrum, that there are a lot of people who agree with Santorum, and those people not only need to be heard, but, in a democracy, have a right to be heard. That's why we have elections, not just to select our leaders, but so the people have a forum to let the leaders know what's important to the people, to keep the leaders in touch. Santorum is an important part of the conversation, just as Ron Paul is an important part of the conversation, just as Romney is an important part of the conversation. The supporters of each are using the forum of an election to express their concerns and goals with the government and with the general electorate. I wish the media didn't focus so much on the candidates, and focused more on what the voters are trying to tell the candidates.
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:09 PM
 
2,943 posts, read 2,994,596 times
Reputation: 1104
He has no idea what he is talking about. Instead of admitting he is wrong, he double down on it.
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,777 posts, read 24,821,962 times
Reputation: 12162
Quote:
Originally Posted by cw30000 View Post
He has no idea what he is talking about. Instead of admitting he is wrong, he double down on it.
He's counting on his base, and that it is large enough for him to make it on republican ticket. What he's not aware of is, that, he is allowing the GOP establishment to get people's eyes off Romney and focused on Santorumanity.
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Old 02-28-2012, 07:53 PM
 
5,527 posts, read 8,952,286 times
Reputation: 1860
Rick Santorum's answer to being questioned about the "Throw Up" quote is completely destroyed when you listen to the actual speech. No where does Kennedy state that someone who is religious is not allowed to hold office or be heard.

A politician is a politician and even if he is lying in order to turn America into a radical Christian state he would be doing so going against the teaching of the Bible he bases his faith on with all of his lies.
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Old 02-28-2012, 07:55 PM
 
5,527 posts, read 8,952,286 times
Reputation: 1860
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
During the nomination process, potential nominees move towards the extreme positions to capture the votes of the people who are most passionate about getting a nominee who represents them. Conservatives move further to the right, liberals move further to the left. Because within the parties, the people who are most vocal and most active during the primaries are the people who are most dissatisfied with the current political status quo, who feel the most disenfranchised. And those people are the people who are more extreme in their political viewpoint. That's why the Republican nominees haven't been screaming, "I'm the more moderate candidate, I'm willing to make political compromises, I'm an insider!" They want to appeal to the people who are going to vote in the primaries, and that's the people who are unhappy because their position isn't reflected in mainstream politics. Democratic candidates do the same thing, pandering to the more liberal, more radical parts of the party to secure nomination.

The dance comes after nomination, when you have to start stumping as a moderate, middle-of-the-road, reasonable candidate to appeal to the most voters in the general public. Because you don't want to make your core support from you party feel betrayed, but you've got to betray them. You can't win election appealing to a core base. You have to appeal to the general electorate.
And you have to do it and still maintain an impression of integrity. There's a reason Santorum is winning and yet the same people are acknowledging that he can't win the general election. People aren't stupid. They understand how the process works. But this is an important part of the conversation, of the political discourse that is the real point of elections. If Santorum just maintains his current level of support, whether he wins the nomination of his party or not, it tells his party and it tells our political leaders on all point of the political spectrum, that there are a lot of people who agree with Santorum, and those people not only need to be heard, but, in a democracy, have a right to be heard. That's why we have elections, not just to select our leaders, but so the people have a forum to let the leaders know what's important to the people, to keep the leaders in touch. Santorum is an important part of the conversation, just as Ron Paul is an important part of the conversation, just as Romney is an important part of the conversation. The supporters of each are using the forum of an election to express their concerns and goals with the government and with the general electorate. I wish the media didn't focus so much on the candidates, and focused more on what the voters are trying to tell the candidates.
Which is why you destroy the two party system and the electoral college. The person with the most votes is POTUS and number two is VP. Limit Congressional terms to two, two year terms and that's it. The longer people are in power the longer they have to be corrupted and well as spread the damage from that corruption. No one should be a lifetime congressman.
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Old 02-29-2012, 07:30 AM
 
39,995 posts, read 24,249,026 times
Reputation: 12580
Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
Which is why you destroy the two party system and the electoral college. The person with the most votes is POTUS and number two is VP. Limit Congressional terms to two, two year terms and that's it. The longer people are in power the longer they have to be corrupted and well as spread the damage from that corruption. No one should be a lifetime congressman.
I disagree. The electoral college serves a purpose as long as it furthers the purpose of elections, the conversation between candidates and the people. The popular vote argument does not advance the conversation, it limits it between candidates and urban centers. Which is one of the PROBLEMS of a democracy, that it inevitably favors the urban over the rural. That's a PROBLEM. And the problem with your VP selection strategy was so apparent right from the beginning that the Founding Fathers changed it. If you limit Congressional terms the way you've described, you'll never get a functioning government, you'll just have a crowd of newbies so busy learning the ropes that they won't learn to work together. If a Congressman does a wonderful job representing the people who elect him, such a wonderful job that those people continue to vote for him term after term after term, then the length of his tenure isn't a problem. He's doing the job.
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Old 02-29-2012, 10:35 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles, California
4,375 posts, read 2,747,253 times
Reputation: 1041
Back on point, Santorum obviously doesn't see the comparison between him and Osama Bin Laden.

People call Obama a terrorist and a domestic enemy?
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