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Old 03-07-2012, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Charlotte
12,642 posts, read 15,543,056 times
Reputation: 1680

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Quote:
Originally Posted by dixiegirl7 View Post
I don't believe most LDS would say that is exactly accurate.
On Mike Huckabee’s Question : “Is the Mormon Jesus the Brother of Satan?”
By Ronald V. Huggins, Th.D.

Quote:
"Indeed, then, the answer to Huckabee’s question should have been yes, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, actually does teach that Jesus and Satan were brothers. In truth then the media statement issued by the LDS Church was both misleading and evasive. Such evasiveness is typical of the hyper image-conscious LDS Church, an organization that has turned NOT telling people the particulars of its gospel into one of its most effective strategies for winning converts and quelling opposition."
Since it doesn't matter why not just answer the question and move on?
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:09 PM
 
15,047 posts, read 8,820,093 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dixiegirl7 View Post
For the second time this week we agree...I am scared...lol. I agree with your earlier post in this thread also. My thoughts exactly on the religion issue.
LOL. Come on over to the other side!
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:19 PM
 
8,754 posts, read 10,123,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyJude514 View Post
LOL. Come on over to the other side!


Can't promise that but I am registering Independent after our primary...lol.
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:34 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,225,145 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyJude514 View Post
This. ^^ I'm sorry, but it's hard to feel sorry for the moderates in the GOP who are complaining that the Evangelicals won't get behind Romney. The GOP fostered this bigotry--they used it to get votes and it worked for them for many election cycles. They can't cry about how bigoted their base is now that it's not working for them any longer.

Conservative Republicans have insisted on a religious litmus test for all GOP candidates. Now they have to live with that, and Romney, unfortunately for him, will suffer for it.
Ain't THAT the truth. Same thing is true regarding Illegal Immigration - in the process of trying to fire-up their base they've managed to PO Hispanics in general - which is the fastest-growing demographic wave in the nation.


Ken
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:40 PM
 
Location: Charlotte
12,642 posts, read 15,543,056 times
Reputation: 1680
Lightbulb hmm...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dixiegirl7 View Post
Jindal's religion scares you. Did you get a look at Obama's pastor and his religion? Now that should have scared you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dixiegirl7 View Post
Why does someone's religion, as long as it is not harmful to others, matter when selecting a leader of the US, which is a country of very diverse beliefs. No one can represent all faiths and really shouldn't even try. That is not what the position is there for really.

I guess it depends on who you're discussing or supporting at the moment huh?
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:45 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
27,892 posts, read 29,695,346 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walidm View Post
On Mike Huckabee’s Question : “Is the Mormon Jesus the Brother of Satan?”
By Ronald V. Huggins, Th.D.

Since it doesn't matter why not just answer the question and move on?
Here's what Mormons believe...

Like Christians anciently, Mormons believe that all human beings are the offspring of God and that He is the Father of our spirits. (See Acts 17:29 and Hebrews 12:9 if you doubt these doctrines to be biblical.) Unlike traditional Christians, we believe that all of us lived in God's presence prior to being born. We were spirit beings at that time, without bodies of flesh and bones. As the spirit sons and daughters of God, we were all brothers and sisters to each other.

Unique among all the sons of God was the one we know as Jesus Christ. Unlike the rest of us, He was with His Father in the beginning. Unlike us, He was perfect in every conceivable way and had all of the divine attributes and qualities His Father had. The shared a unity of will and purpose to such an extent that together, they were known (along with the Holy Ghost) both individually and collectively, as God. Finally, even though we were all the spirit offspring of our Father in Heaven, Jesus Christ was also His Father's "Only Begotten" Son. Under His Father's direction, Jesus Christ created our universe. He was chosen prior to His birth in Bethlehem to be the lamb who would be slain for our sins.

Another of the spirit sons of God was one named Lucifer. He was a proud and rebellious son who sought to exalt himself above his Father and who was cast out of Heaven for attempting to do so. When Lucifer was cast out of Heaven, he was disowned by his Father, and lost his right to ever again be known as a son of God (or a brother to the greatest of God's sons, Jesus Christ). If Jesus and Satan were sons of the same Father, they were spirit brothers, a fact which in no way reflects positively on Satan or negatively on the Savior of the world.

Mormons, incidentally, did not invent this doctrine. Not by a long shot. In the third century, the Christian writer, Lactantius, wrote:

“Before creating the world, God produced a spirit like himself, replete with the virtues of the Father. Later He made another, in whom the mark of divine origin was erased, because this one was besmirched by the poison of jealousy and turned therefore from good to evil. He was jealous of his older brother who, remaining united with the Father, insured his affection unto himself. This being who from good became bad is called devil by the Greeks.

I don't think most Mormons actually care one way or the other whether other Christians accept this doctrine or not. They would just like people to stop trying to make it look like something its not -- like Mormons somehow see Jesus Christ and Lucifer as equals, when nothing could possibly be further from the truth.
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:47 PM
 
Location: Chicago Area
12,688 posts, read 6,682,066 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkane2 View Post
I'd say it's hurting him with some Christians.

In Mormonism Jesus is believed to be the brother of Lucifer.....we all know who Lucifer is.... Satan....The Devil....etc

That's a big hurdle for a lot of belivers.

That's why they are considered a cult by mainstream Christianity.

The Jesus of the Mormon Church : Apologetics research resources

Many don't know this fact and they don't talk about it much ....if at all.

http://www.equip.org/bible_answers/d...other-of-satan-
It's one of the many things that makes perfect sense to a Mormon but no sense to a more traditional Christian. Traditional Christianity, especially Catholicism, sees angels as a nohuman species that work for God and do his will.

Mormonism has a completely different take on angels. They view angels as the great prophets and mortal messengers of God after they are dead. From the Mormon point of view, such people as Noah, Moses, Elijah, etc can and do return to earth to deliver the messages God sends them to deliver. In short, humans and angels are one and the same. The only difference is that one is mortal and the other is not.

The second difference to understand: Mormonism views humankind as the literal spirit children of God the Father and that all of us have always existed and always will exist. I'm unclear on how that's supposed to work exactly -- but Mormons believe we all became sons and daughters of God before this life. From their point of view, the firstborn of God the Father is Jesus and Mormons believe that he alone was made Omnipotent and Omniscient, just as the Father is Omnipotent and Omniscient. [EDIT: I don't know when and how it happens but they also believe that the Holy Spirit also becomes Omnipotent and Omniscient, though I've no idea where the particulars go from there.]

Now we come around to the whole "Satan is the brother of Jesus" bit. If all angels are just humans that either haven't been born yet or who have lived, died and sometimes return at God's command, then all angels are literal children of God.

All of Christianity already acknowledges that Lucifer was an angel of God before he rebelled and was cast out. The difference for Mormonism: Since he would literally be a spirit child of God the Father (just like everyone) then logically he is a very distant younger brother of Jesus just like the rest of us would be. So at some point before the creation of the earth, the angel Lucifer rebels and is cast out along with those who sided with him. So Lucifer, the fallen angel becomes the Satan or the Devil.

The only reason this whole "Satan is the brother of Jesus" scpheel is scandalous is if you say that and nothing else. If you don't bother really digging in and understanding Mormon theology, then there's all sorts of things that can be made out to be scandalous just by not bothering to explain why and how their unconventional theology gets them to that conclusion. From the Mormon point of view, Satan was once an angel of God, therefore he was a son of God.

Mormonism and Traditional Christianity agree that Satan was once the angel Lucifer and that he is a fallen angel. But the understanding of what an angel is makes a huge difference.
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Old 03-07-2012, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Greater Washington, DC
1,347 posts, read 1,082,975 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraC View Post
Where did the exit poll say "religion of their candidate?" Have a link?
I'm sorry, it said "candidate's religious views"
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Old 03-07-2012, 05:04 PM
 
Location: Charlotte
12,642 posts, read 15,543,056 times
Reputation: 1680
Thank you Katzpur!

While that made some sense as I've tried to understand the religion and sort through what's been said, this simply got right to the point a whole lot quicker.

Quote:
On Saturday December 15, Mormon curmudgeon/editorialist, Robert Kirby addressed the issue more honestly than the Church PR department and with a sense of humor: "The question was perceived by some as an opportunity to hold an element of Mormon theology up for ridicule" Kirby writes. "As a Mormon, I wasn't bothered because, well, it's true. It gets weirder. Not only is Satan our brother as well, he looks exactly like KSL meteorologist Kevin Eubank, only redder. OK, I made that part up. But Mormons do believe a lot of things that seem pretty strange, if not downright crazy. So do you." (Robert Kirby, "No one is fair when it comes to religion," Salt Lake Tribune [Dec 15, 2007] C1 []Utah Local News - Salt Lake City News, Sports, Archive - The Salt Lake Tribune. Kirby makes the point that it is easy to speak of another person's religion in a way that makes it sounds bad.)
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Old 03-07-2012, 05:07 PM
 
Location: Greater Washington, DC
1,347 posts, read 1,082,975 times
Reputation: 235
Quote:
Originally Posted by walidm View Post
lol...How many conservatives do you know?

The vast majority eh? Not saying much from the diminished pool of enthusiasm...
Huh? What makes you think I do not know any conservatives? Sure I live in Maryland, but look at the gallup tracking poll - Conservatives outnumber liberals in Maryland, just as they do in nearly every state I believe. I've also spent a lot of time living in a county in Maryland that votes roughly 70% GOP. Better question - do you know any conservatives? because I rarely meet any that hate Romney with such a passion that they would bitterly sit home and let Obama win. Actually I've only met one that says that, but he's focused on the senate race here big time (which, IMO will never be competitive, but whatever), so I know he's going to vote.
Do you know what vast majority means? It means nearly all. Which is pretty typical, in every election you have some people that will just be bitter because their guy lost. Plenty of evidence supporting my claim has been posted.
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