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Old 11-28-2014, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Pluto's Home Town
9,995 posts, read 11,644,428 times
Reputation: 5579

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
I'm sure you know that the repeal of Glass Steagall was entirely bipartisan, pushed by Robert Rubin, and signed into law by Bill Clinton.
Yes, I know that. But we both know the energy for that came from the GOP. Clinton compromised. They share culpability for what followed. But my point is the laissez faire governance style the Tea Party types want has been proven in the 1920s and 2000s to be very dangerous. That is the reason for the meltdown, not Democratic policies in general. Democrats don't generally tend to rail on about regulations and market oversight. That is right wing territory.
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Old 11-29-2014, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,794 posts, read 14,227,278 times
Reputation: 7950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddlehead View Post
Yes, I know that. But we both know the energy for that came from the GOP. Clinton compromised. They share culpability for what followed. But my point is the laissez faire governance style the Tea Party types want has been proven in the 1920s and 2000s to be very dangerous. That is the reason for the meltdown, not Democratic policies in general. Democrats don't generally tend to rail on about regulations and market oversight. That is right wing territory.
The energy for repeal of Glass Steagal came from both sides. Robert Rubin, Tres. Sec'y under Pres. Clinton, was a major proponent. Much of the impetus of the 2000's housing bubble and 2008 crash came not from 'laissez faire governance style,' but from just the reverse. Gov't and the housing market were joined at the hip via Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The 'implicit guarantee' that the federal gov't would bail out Fannie and Freddie (as they eventually had to do) led to risk taking that fomented the crash of 2008. There were warnings from the CBO and from John Snow but they were batted down by people like Barney Frank and Maxine Waters, friends of Fannie.

Snow: Tighten Control of Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac | Fox News
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Old 11-29-2014, 09:21 PM
 
Location: Pluto's Home Town
9,995 posts, read 11,644,428 times
Reputation: 5579
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
The energy for repeal of Glass Steagal came from both sides. Robert Rubin, Tres. Sec'y under Pres. Clinton, was a major proponent. Much of the impetus of the 2000's housing bubble and 2008 crash came not from 'laissez faire governance style,' but from just the reverse. Gov't and the housing market were joined at the hip via Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The 'implicit guarantee' that the federal gov't would bail out Fannie and Freddie (as they eventually had to do) led to risk taking that fomented the crash of 2008. There were warnings from the CBO and from John Snow but they were batted down by people like Barney Frank and Maxine Waters, friends of Fannie.

Snow: Tighten Control of Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac | Fox News
The bolded is a good point, and noted. The loan guarantees were certainly part of the recipe.
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Old 11-30-2014, 05:43 AM
Status: "Elect a clown? Expect a circus!" (set 7 days ago)
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
58,064 posts, read 40,838,272 times
Reputation: 29746
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
I don't think they're backing NSA spying (where are you getting this?), and Keystone is a good thing (even Hillary said so, way back when). We're transporting the oil by rail at present, which is very dangerous.

I think you are mistaken ... it is the Democrat Party that is the anti-Liberty party, and have been for decades (the party of the Administrative State and regulation). Republicans are the Party of Liberty, and if it weren't for business, you wouldn't have a job. You'd better hope they support business, because it is businesses that create jobs. Doing as the Democrats do, and making life difficult (and expensive) for business, stifles business expansion (and job creation) and everybody is poorer for it. Why do you think we have such massive unemployment right now (and don't give me the administrations B.S. about a 6.something % unemployment rate, when nearly half of the labor force is unemployed!).

Get a clue.
IF Republicans really were the party of liberty they wouldn't be so damned concerned with who someone sleeps with, who someone marries, or what medical procedures a woman chooses as right for herself, eh?

The truth is Republicans are happy to grow government with MORE people and MORE regulation when it suits their agenda as well as spend like drunken sailors for the same reason.

Get a clue yourself.
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Old 11-30-2014, 10:27 AM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,794 posts, read 14,227,278 times
Reputation: 7950
Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
IF Republicans really were the party of liberty they wouldn't be so damned concerned with who someone sleeps with, who someone marries, or what medical procedures a woman chooses as right for herself, eh?

The truth is Republicans are happy to grow government with MORE people and MORE regulation when it suits their agenda as well as spend like drunken sailors for the same reason.

Get a clue yourself.
We've been over this so many times on CD....

No republicans are talking about bringing back anti-sodomy laws. In my neck of the woods (Seattle area) it is all liberal-controlled, and there are continual efforts to ramp up the war on prostitution. So to the extent that there is gov't regulation of who sleeps with whom, it is coming mostly from the left.

Tougher police tactics stinging sex buyers | Local News | The Seattle Times

The debate about gay marriage comes down to a debate over the definition of an English word. Most Republicans would have been happy with 'civil union' legislation so that gay couples would have hospital visitation rights etc. But the left stamped it's feet and said no, we demand that the word be redefined.

Abortion is a fundamentally different debate even though you fallaciously lump it in with the others. I am pro-choice, but I can see the argument that the gov't has an interest in protecting the unborn child. Are you so dense that you cannot see it?

As far as spending, it spiked from 2008-2010 under Obama-Reid-Pelosi, and remember that the US House controls the purse strings. From 2010 to 2014, spending not only stopped rising, it has actually fallen the past two years.

You're seeing the world through a fun-house mirror.
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Old 11-30-2014, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Los Awesome, CA
8,520 posts, read 4,989,968 times
Reputation: 3304
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
Well, were are talking about Webb, not McCain. McCain is a war hero and for years was known for a cool and calm demeanor and a very concillatory approach in Washington. Never seen much of this fabled temper.

But hey, if Webb uses it against Hillary in a debate, it should be highly amusing.
Did you watch McCain debate Obama at all?
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Old 11-30-2014, 05:41 PM
 
5,556 posts, read 5,031,196 times
Reputation: 3943
Quote:
Originally Posted by SHABAZZ310 View Post
Did you watch McCain debate Obama at all?
They had a debate?
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Old 12-01-2014, 01:38 AM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
23,236 posts, read 11,483,700 times
Reputation: 4305
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
The energy for repeal of Glass Steagal came from both sides. Robert Rubin, Tres. Sec'y under Pres. Clinton, was a major proponent. Much of the impetus of the 2000's housing bubble and 2008 crash came not from 'laissez faire governance style,' but from just the reverse. Gov't and the housing market were joined at the hip via Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The 'implicit guarantee' that the federal gov't would bail out Fannie and Freddie (as they eventually had to do) led to risk taking that fomented the crash of 2008. There were warnings from the CBO and from John Snow but they were batted down by people like Barney Frank and Maxine Waters, friends of Fannie.

Snow: Tighten Control of Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac | Fox News
Please stop.


Republicans controlled the House and Senate when Glass Steagal was repealed. Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act Is named after 3 Republicans who pushed it, not 3 Democrats.

all but 6 Republicans in the House and Senate voted for it. Thats 269-6



You cant blame Barney Frank and Maxine Waters for diddly squat so stop trying.
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Old 12-01-2014, 01:51 AM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
23,236 posts, read 11,483,700 times
Reputation: 4305
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
We've been over this so many times on CD....

No republicans are talking about bringing back anti-sodomy laws. In my neck of the woods (Seattle area) it is all liberal-controlled, and there are continual efforts to ramp up the war on prostitution. So to the extent that there is gov't regulation of who sleeps with whom, it is coming mostly from the left.

Tougher police tactics stinging sex buyers | Local News | The Seattle Times
Prostitution is illegal in all 50 states,so your argument comparing it to anal sex and oral sex would only be comparable in the 1950's when being gay(or performing those acts) was in and of itself still a crime in all 50 states.



Quote:
The debate about gay marriage comes down to a debate over the definition of an English word. Most Republicans would have been happy with 'civil union' legislation so that gay couples would have hospital visitation rights etc. But the left stamped it's feet and said no, we demand that the word be redefined.
I dont understand your need to lie to yourself. Gay people are not allowed the same rights as straight people in about 26 of our 50 states.

If the debate was really over the word as you say, then those 26 states would all have "Civil Unions", but they dont.


Quote:
Abortion is a fundamentally different debate even though you fallaciously lump it in with the others. I am pro-choice, but I can see the argument that the gov't has an interest in protecting the unborn child. Are you so dense that you cannot see it?
late term abortions are already illegal. While abortion is a hot topic, what you are debating here is Political Optics ( meaning you agree with Democrats but dont want to say so because you are a Republican).

Quote:
As far as spending, it spiked from 2008-2010 under Obama-Reid-Pelosi, and remember that the US House controls the purse strings. From 2010 to 2014, spending not only stopped rising, it has actually fallen the past two years.
Spending Spiked in 2008, before President Obama took office(meaning you should be saying Bush-Reid-Pelosi), it has gone down every year since.

Also, colloquially, Spending is a term associated with an actual increase in activity meaning(for example) you purposefully went over budget.

That didnt happen in 2008(2009 fiscal year) We had budget shortfalls because of a recession. We had almost a trillion dollars less in revenue in 2008 than we thought we would when that year started off.

Quote:
You're seeing the world through a fun-house mirror.
Thats what i thought when i read your post.
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Old 12-01-2014, 02:04 AM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
23,236 posts, read 11,483,700 times
Reputation: 4305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guamanians View Post
it wasn't just that military spending wasn't high enough. Both Webb and senator Mark Warner are "moderates" in a conservative state. I lived there for 11 years, and followed VA politics a little bit. Look at Warner... he was a popular governor, and had no problem winning a senate seat as a democrat (in 2008) But, now in 2014 he barely scraped by and won re-election. I'm sure he is waking up to his party and ready to fight back if necessary. I think that Webb just didn't want to deal with all the bs.
2008 was a Presidential year and Barack Obama has his infrastructure in place in Virginia doing GOTV.

its dumb to compare that to 2014, a mid term year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
I don't think they're backing NSA spying (where are you getting this?), and Keystone is a good thing (even Hillary said so, way back when). We're transporting the oil by rail at present, which is very dangerous.

I think you are mistaken ... it is the Democrat Party that is the anti-Liberty party, and have been for decades (the party of the Administrative State and regulation). Republicans are the Party of Liberty, and if it weren't for business, you wouldn't have a job. You'd better hope they support business, because it is businesses that create jobs. Doing as the Democrats do, and making life difficult (and expensive) for business, stifles business expansion (and job creation) and everybody is poorer for it. Why do you think we have such massive unemployment right now (and don't give me the administrations B.S. about a 6.something % unemployment rate, when nearly half of the labor force is unemployed!).

Get a clue.
1. Liberty is defined by the individual, so it doesnt matter who you think stands for liberty.

2. The unemployment rate has been calculated the same way since the 1970's. It is 5.8%

If you want to go by the "real Unemployment" rate then your argument is still wrong because that rate is still lower than it was 6 years ago.

Also, the LPR is 62%, that means those who are in the age group to work, but dont have a job is at 38%, thats not half as you claimed.

You also need to realize that that percentage includes high schoolers and college students who dont need to work as well as stay at home parents.

remember LPR has nothing to do with whether or not someone wants a job, its just a raw number. so maybe its you who needs to get a clue.
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