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Old 11-05-2015, 06:53 PM
 
4,044 posts, read 2,674,645 times
Reputation: 1197

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I'll keep this short and sweet: TRUMP CANNOT WIN. I say this as a lifelong Republican. While I appreciate his zeal, his negative qualities far outweigh the positives. Let's examine a big one:

1. It is utterly hypocritical for Trump fans to bash Hillary for being unlikable, and then chalking up a win for Trump. Hillary is extremely unlikable, yes, but Trump is the most unliked candidate running right now. Recent polling has Sanders winning against only one candidate in head-to-head polling. Freakin' Sanders is beating Trump in a head-to-head matchup! Why are you guys bashing Hillary, yet supporting the most unliked man in the field? You're doing a great disservice to the party by making utterly contrary statements.

Another one...

2. You guys are being duped by Trump. How many concrete plans has he put forth? None. Yes, he said he's going to build a wall and bring back jobs, but those require implementation. No, things just don't "happen" like he says they do. No other candidate would get away with such flimsy policy proposals. What would you guys say about Jeb Bush, someone else who I do not support, if he gave such vague statements on policy? I'm sure you would shout "RINO" from the rooftops and say that he is a disgrace to the party. What makes Trump any different? Once again, Trump fans are being hypocritical.

Lastly...

3. Trump has made outlandish statements that even Bernie Sanders would agree with. From taxing billionaires, to how socialized medicine is a viable solution here in the U.S., Trump has held some very liberal positions in the past. Why does he get a break? Trump fans are the same people that bash Jeb on immigration, Kasich on Medicare, Huckabee on Common Core, etc., but the man you guys are touting is continuing to say stuff like "hedge fund billionaires should pay more taxes" and "socialized medicine works in other countries"? Just because he shouts his views on immigration at every rally he attends does NOT make him a principled conservative. I find this funny considering most of Trump's support comes from people who label anyone a RINO for having even the slightest bit of cooperation across the aisle on any issue. I've got news for you: he's pulling the wool over your eyes, and you're letting in happen.

In conclusion, Trump fans are just as bad as Sanders fans. Both groups believe that a totally unelectable candidate is suddenly the second coming of Christ who can move the minds and hearts of millions. That simply will not happen. I have to give it to Sanders fans; at least they're supporting a candidate who has held the same views over his entire life. Trump fans ignore the fact that the man was an economic and social liberal until the past few years. Why don't you care about that? Why do you bash real lifelong Republicans (like Bush, Kasich, and Huckabee) for not holding your views only a handful of times in the past, yet Trump's past positions are the complete opposite of those of the Republican Party and conservative ideology as a whole? Trump is a joke; a carnival-barker if you will. Instead of falling for his rhetoric, do a bit of research on Trump. You've obviously done it for Bush, Huckabee, and Kasich, unless you're simply parroting talking points. In that case, once again, you're no better than Sanders fans.
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Old 11-05-2015, 06:57 PM
 
Location: Sweet Home Chicago!
5,155 posts, read 3,678,414 times
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Old 11-05-2015, 08:08 PM
 
1,676 posts, read 739,579 times
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Even if he loses, there's been a powerful message sent to the GOP. Their boring establishment candidates are too unlikeable, corrupt, and flip-floppity for anyone to want to vote for them. Dubya is regarded as one of (if not THE) worst presidents we've ever had. McCain and Romney were terrible candidates (mostly because of their VP picks, particularly Palin). Trump is refreshing. He's genuine, not bought-and-paid-for, and knows the game because he's been behind it himself.

I plan to vote for Hillary, but Trump is my second choice. Why? Because he is the Tory this country needs. There's nothing wrong with taxing the rich more and single-payer health care. I also like that Trump isn't one of the religious fanatics running, like Jeb, Huckabee, or Cruz. It's time for a Third Way Republican, because the homophobic, anti-abortion and for-the-rich GOP just won't win anymore in today's America. If they want a chance at getting independents and some democrats, they must compromise and adapt.
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Old 11-05-2015, 08:15 PM
 
4,044 posts, read 2,674,645 times
Reputation: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dmitri95 View Post
Even if he loses, there's been a powerful message sent to the GOP. Their boring establishment candidates are too unlikeable, corrupt, and flip-floppity for anyone to want to vote for them. Dubya is regarded as one of (if not THE) worst presidents we've ever had. McCain and Romney were terrible candidates (mostly because of their VP picks, particularly Palin). Trump is refreshing. He's genuine, not bought-and-paid-for, and knows the game because he's been behind it himself.

I plan to vote for Hillary, but Trump is my second choice. Why? Because he is the Tory this country needs. There's nothing wrong with taxing the rich more and single-payer health care. I also like that Trump isn't one of the religious fanatics running, like Jeb, Huckabee, or Cruz. It's time for a Third Way Republican, because the homophobic, anti-abortion and for-the-rich GOP just won't win anymore in today's America. If they want a chance at getting independents and some democrats, they must compromise and adapt.
1. Please explain to me how not supporting gay marriage is in any way homophobic.

2. Is Hillary not "for the rich"? Did she not make millions by public speaking engagements, peddling influence, and forming alliances with Wall Street during her tenure as New York Senator?

3. Trump doesn't even have the decency to stick to his guns on the socialized medicine thing. He backed off of that in order to gain Republican support.
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Old 11-05-2015, 09:19 PM
 
6,056 posts, read 3,085,878 times
Reputation: 4095
lol!! Classic!!!
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Old 11-05-2015, 09:20 PM
 
6,056 posts, read 3,085,878 times
Reputation: 4095
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dequindre View Post
I'll keep this short and sweet: TRUMP CANNOT WIN. I say this as a lifelong Republican. While I appreciate his zeal, his negative qualities far outweigh the positives. Let's examine a big one:

1. It is utterly hypocritical for Trump fans to bash Hillary for being unlikable, and then chalking up a win for Trump. Hillary is extremely unlikable, yes, but Trump is the most unliked candidate running right now. Recent polling has Sanders winning against only one candidate in head-to-head polling. Freakin' Sanders is beating Trump in a head-to-head matchup! Why are you guys bashing Hillary, yet supporting the most unliked man in the field? You're doing a great disservice to the party by making utterly contrary statements.

Another one...

2. You guys are being duped by Trump. How many concrete plans has he put forth? None. Yes, he said he's going to build a wall and bring back jobs, but those require implementation. No, things just don't "happen" like he says they do. No other candidate would get away with such flimsy policy proposals. What would you guys say about Jeb Bush, someone else who I do not support, if he gave such vague statements on policy? I'm sure you would shout "RINO" from the rooftops and say that he is a disgrace to the party. What makes Trump any different? Once again, Trump fans are being hypocritical.

Lastly...

3. Trump has made outlandish statements that even Bernie Sanders would agree with. From taxing billionaires, to how socialized medicine is a viable solution here in the U.S., Trump has held some very liberal positions in the past. Why does he get a break? Trump fans are the same people that bash Jeb on immigration, Kasich on Medicare, Huckabee on Common Core, etc., but the man you guys are touting is continuing to say stuff like "hedge fund billionaires should pay more taxes" and "socialized medicine works in other countries"? Just because he shouts his views on immigration at every rally he attends does NOT make him a principled conservative. I find this funny considering most of Trump's support comes from people who label anyone a RINO for having even the slightest bit of cooperation across the aisle on any issue. I've got news for you: he's pulling the wool over your eyes, and you're letting in happen.

In conclusion, Trump fans are just as bad as Sanders fans. Both groups believe that a totally unelectable candidate is suddenly the second coming of Christ who can move the minds and hearts of millions. That simply will not happen. I have to give it to Sanders fans; at least they're supporting a candidate who has held the same views over his entire life. Trump fans ignore the fact that the man was an economic and social liberal until the past few years. Why don't you care about that? Why do you bash real lifelong Republicans (like Bush, Kasich, and Huckabee) for not holding your views only a handful of times in the past, yet Trump's past positions are the complete opposite of those of the Republican Party and conservative ideology as a whole? Trump is a joke; a carnival-barker if you will. Instead of falling for his rhetoric, do a bit of research on Trump. You've obviously done it for Bush, Huckabee, and Kasich, unless you're simply parroting talking points. In that case, once again, you're no better than Sanders fans.
Huge failure on your part
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Old 11-05-2015, 09:26 PM
 
4,044 posts, read 2,674,645 times
Reputation: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by westcoastforme View Post
Huge failure on your part
Where? Why?
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Old 11-05-2015, 09:30 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,715 posts, read 11,523,903 times
Reputation: 5606
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dmitri95 View Post
Even if he loses, there's been a powerful message sent to the GOP.
...
Yes, the message will be the message Barry Goldwater sent to the GOP, move to the center and nominate mainstream candidates.
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Old 11-05-2015, 09:32 PM
 
4,044 posts, read 2,674,645 times
Reputation: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
Yes, the message will be the message Barry Goldwater sent to the GOP, move to the center and nominate mainstream candidates.
Your guy, Sanders, is mainstream? I think most of Bernie's support base would disagree with you there.
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Old 11-05-2015, 09:33 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,715 posts, read 11,523,903 times
Reputation: 5606
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dequindre View Post
1. Please explain to me how not supporting gay marriage is in any way homophobic.

2. Is Hillary not "for the rich"? Did she not make millions by public speaking engagements, peddling influence, and forming alliances with Wall Street during her tenure as New York Senator?

3. Trump doesn't even have the decency to stick to his guns on the socialized medicine thing. He backed off of that in order to gain Republican support.
Arguing that Hillary is for the rich because she personally makes millions, is like arguing that FDR and Kennedy were for the rich because they came from one of the wealthiest families in the nation.

Mrs. Clinton consistently favors raising taxes on the wealthy and supports the social safety net. Taking positions against your personal self-interest is not hypocrisy but civic virtue.
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