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Old 01-12-2016, 04:54 PM
 
16,376 posts, read 22,358,289 times
Reputation: 14391

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Quote:
Originally Posted by idr591 View Post
So did the person who makes $40,000 per year. So we can agree that the slice should be the same size as a percentage of the pie?
Are you volunteering to pay social security/medicare tax on the entire $1million, since the worker that earns $40k has to pay social security/medicare tax on 100% of their earnings? Agree that the percentage slice should be the same? That's an additional 7.5% tax from you and your employer would have to pay 7.5 % of employer's part too. Even up the playing field?
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Old 01-12-2016, 04:54 PM
 
79,900 posts, read 43,866,989 times
Reputation: 17184
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
yes I did..

Government picking winners and losers, is fascism, government allowing the free market to determine whats best is conservative.. The two are not even close to the same. Conservatives oppose subsidizing both corn, and other environmental policies given the free market will eventually figure out a way to make things like solar competitive..
No they do not as the government constantly does it. It's done it under Reagan, Bush, Bush ll and while the (R) held the House and Senate.

You will argue they arent Conservatives....Conservatives put them in office.

Bernie is arguing against favoring one business over the other. The position of the government not favoring either might be correct but since NO ONE will do it, the correct solution is no favoritism.

The conservative position is for the government to show no favoritism. No?
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Old 01-12-2016, 04:58 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 63,828,510 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Companies didnt go abroad in the past like they do today, because the policies were in place to make sure that the interests of America was priority no.1, not the interests of corporations with no allegiance to America or American workers. Sanders has been vehemently opposed to all these disastrous "trade" deals over the decades, precisely because they throw American workers out on the streets while shipping good paying jobs to Mexico, China and other places with even worse wages and environmental protections. These days, corporations want to have it all. Cheap labor, no taxes, tariff free exports, no unions and they get away with it because they have corrupt politicians in their pockets.
ooh please.. lets take a left wing kook extreme position in order to show you where you are wrong....

In the past, companies polluted like mad, they killed their employees, had unacceptable work conditions, blah blah blah...

We then initiated legislation to protect workers, and companies went over seas.. Yeah, its extreme but it makes the point.

So the lefts answer is even MORE legislation, and somehow these companies will magically return.

The one thing I have yet to hear the left kooks explain to me is HOW DO YOU PUNISH A COMPANY OVERSEAS? If they are NOT in the US border, and not subjected to US taxes, YOU CANT PUNISH THEM...

So claiming that he wants to legislate them to not go overseas is a fricken ridiculous lie full of stupidity given you cant punish someone outside of your jurisdiction. All that would happen with Sanders policies is rather than pushing branches overseas, you're now going to push corporate headquarters as well..

Are you ready for companies like Microsoft and Google to be built elsewhere? I'm not.. I for one want these innovated companies to thrive here.. Not Sanders.. he wants to pass laws which will encourage them to leave COMPLETELY..

DUMB.. Beyond dumb.. stupidest idea I've heard in my life..
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Old 01-12-2016, 04:59 PM
 
16,376 posts, read 22,358,289 times
Reputation: 14391
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSchoolAtHeart View Post

We could also talk about school loans, making college for free, but to fund everyone's education, taxes would need to go up on the middle class as well....I paid off my 65K in school loans without help, so I am not too sympathetic for folks who decide to take big loans and ask for help paying them back. The root problem is the unfettered increase costs in academia and the realization, that when one takes a loan, they are accountable for paying it off.

Your $65k school loans likely covered more than just in-state TUITION. Things like room/board, meal plan, books, fees are not free on Bernie's plan. Also his plan is only the in-state tuition rate for public schools. In the US, this is an average of $9,400 for tuition/fees in the US. So without fees it's even lower. Each state has different rates.

Right now there is a tax credit for the first $2500 paid each year for the first 4 years of college.

We all are already subsidizing the cost of public colleges within each state. That's why they are cheaper for in-state residents.
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Old 01-12-2016, 05:01 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 63,828,510 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
No they do not as the government constantly does it. It's done it under Reagan, Bush, Bush ll and while the (R) held the House and Senate.

You will argue they arent Conservatives....Conservatives put them in office.
True conservative opposed this taking place, hell the only people that celebrated corn subsidies was lefties who promoted ethanol fuel and decreasing the use of oil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Bernie is arguing against favoring one business over the other. The position of the government not favoring either might be correct but since NO ONE will do it, the correct solution is no favoritism.

The conservative position is for the government to show no favoritism. No?
That might be what Bernie is saying but thats not the result of his proposals. It would be completely ridiculous to pretend we live in a stagnate economy where companies wont react to proposed legislation.
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Old 01-12-2016, 05:05 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,893,519 times
Reputation: 6059
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
ooh please.. lets take a left wing kook extreme position in order to show you where you are wrong....

In the past, companies polluted like mad, they killed their employees, had unacceptable work conditions, blah blah blah...

We then initiated legislation to protect workers, and companies went over seas.. Yeah, its extreme but it makes the point.

So the lefts answer is even MORE legislation, and somehow these companies will magically return.

The one thing I have yet to hear the left kooks explain to me is HOW DO YOU PUNISH A COMPANY OVERSEAS? If they are NOT in the US border, and not subjected to US taxes, YOU CANT PUNISH THEM...

So claiming that he wants to legislate them to not go overseas is a fricken ridiculous lie full of stupidity given you cant punish someone outside of your jurisdiction. All that would happen with Sanders policies is rather than pushing branches overseas, you're now going to push corporate headquarters as well..

Are you ready for companies like Microsoft and Google to be built elsewhere? I'm not.. I for one want these innovated companies to thrive here.. Not Sanders.. he wants to pass laws which will encourage them to leave COMPLETELY..

DUMB.. Beyond dumb.. stupidest idea I've heard in my life..
I'll just disregard the barrage of childishness and say that America is the biggest and richest market in the world. It is time America act like it, and not slavishly let corporations run amok.
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Old 01-12-2016, 05:09 PM
 
69,368 posts, read 63,828,510 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
I'll just disregard the barrage of childishness and say that America is the biggest and richest market in the world. It is time America act like it, and not slavishly let corporations run amok.
Sanders proposals only promote the ability for them to run "amok", since it limits competition and only allows the select few to have impact on how bills are written, which of course would be to their advantage.

Obama is a prime example. Lets all reform healthcare, and then of course bring in a select few to write laws which limited competition and then act shocked when prices dont fall as they were supposed to.

Shocking I tell you, complete shocking..

I'm waiting to hear from Sanders supporters how you legislate a company that moves overseas, outside of your jurisdiction. What are you proposing, we become like N Korea?
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Old 01-12-2016, 05:10 PM
 
12 posts, read 8,692 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by sware2cod View Post
Your $65k school loans likely covered more than just in-state TUITION. Things like room/board, meal plan, books, fees are not free on Bernie's plan. Also his plan is only the in-state tuition rate for public schools. In the US, this is an average of $9,400 for tuition/fees in the US. So without fees it's even lower. Each state has different rates.

Right now there is a tax credit for the first $2500 paid each year for the first 4 years of college.

We all are already subsidizing the cost of public colleges within each state. That's why they are cheaper for in-state residents.

Yes, and why the heck should we subsidize even more? I worked two jobs, took loans, had roommates to lower living expenses, and got scholarships...why should others not do the same? Those who want to go to college can do the same? We are talking about getting an average loan amount of 25-30K, the equivalent of a car loan, ...
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Old 01-12-2016, 05:14 PM
 
12 posts, read 8,692 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
I've covered this many times. No it was not paid back and even what was paid back was taking money out of one pocket and putting it in another. We lost billions on the car bail out and we really have no idea on the banks.

I'm on my phone but do I have to verify all of this again when I get home?

This doesn't even take into account the trillions provided by the QE programs which I am referencing above.




The money lost on the bailouts should be covered by the poor? Bernie is calling for a small tax on trades. An absolutely fair way to put some of this money back into the hands of those who paid it.




And yet the banks did that and did NOT pay it back. You say you aren't a fan but that doesn't get us our money back does it?

As an aside Bernie never said his program would provide an education for just anyone. No program even where available does that.
Please provide sources, as I have seen many sources that say the bank loans were paid back. Now the auto loans may be another story, as I would have preferred a bankruptcy there....
And pray tell how will Bernie pay for more school...lets guess, taxing those folks who build small businesses ....
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Old 01-12-2016, 05:21 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,893,519 times
Reputation: 6059
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Sanders proposals only promote the ability for them to run "amok", since it limits competition and only allows the select few to have impact on how bills are written, which of course would be to their advantage.

Obama is a prime example. Lets all reform healthcare, and then of course bring in a select few to write laws which limited competition and then act shocked when prices dont fall as they were supposed to.

Shocking I tell you, complete shocking..

I'm waiting to hear from Sanders supporters how you legislate a company that moves overseas, outside of your jurisdiction. What are you proposing, we become like N Korea?
On the contrary, it is this decades long promotion of large corporations, weakening of the anti-trust laws and favoring of the well heeled at the expense of small business owners which is severely weakening competition in the economy which is a stance Sanders has always had. If you really think the most attractive market in the world is powerless against corporations, you need to expand you imagination.
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