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Point #1: I'm not a Tumpster ... though I think you meant Trumpster. I'm honestly still on the fence. I can't say who was worse out of The Donald and Hillary. All I know for certain is both were so revolting that I would never have voted for either. But unlike the Hillary faithful, I actually know when an election is over and I don't throw tantrums when my party -- Libertarian in my case -- loses.
I decided to have a listen to Jill Stein explaining why she's doing this. I looked it up and watched the various interviews. She was absolutely fixated with DRE's -- which is largely what I was responding to. She couldn't seem to shut up about the things. She also insisted that she was only focusing on states that were most likely to be compromised and that the vote tally was completely irrelevant to her. Well ... MI doesn't have any DRE's and probably has the most secure system in the USA. MI is quite proud of the fact that they've taken their entire voting system offline -- which probably means that the tallies aren't transmitted over the Internet either. You can very easily load the numbers on a thumb drive and ship it or drive it to Lansing. It doesn't ever have to touch the Internet, which is what the folks in Michigan are going for. MI is the absolute worst candidate for a recount. Jill Stein knew it. She asked for the recount anyways. That just stinks to high heaven.
The next problem is actionable evidence of hacking. Arizona probably merits a recount because they really did get hacked. Same goes for Illinois. Now if there were any evidence that MI, WI and PA got hacked, I'd support the recount effort 100%. Honestly, it wouldn't bother me much if Hillary ended up winning as a result. But they have no evidence. It's like launching a murder investigation on some random person just in case they might have killed somebody at some point. It makes no sense at all. The only sense I can make out of any of it is the obvious: MI, PA and WI represent exactly the number of electors to change the outcome or at least to deny Trump enough electors to win.
More than anything, it's disappointing to see a potentially viable third party get trashed by its candidate playing proxy/slave to the Democrats. Stein seemed legit. Now she seems like a very bad joke and she's done tremendous damage to the Green Party as well. We need more voices in this nation, not less. So though I don't agree with them ideologically, I hate seeing the Green Party getting trashed in an absolutely blatant attempt to sabotage the electoral system as a tool for the Democrats.
I pretty much agree with everything you've posted.
I'd like to add and acknowledge that there is no smoking gun anywhere. The challenge is that the hack that's possible can't be discovered without a comparison between paper ballots recorded at the precinct and electronic tally at headquarters for the same precinct.
You will acknowledge that if there was evidence that the russians hacked the election results in only one state, then that would put the whole election in question?
I too would have rather voted for Bernie Sanders over all the finalists. Clinton was way past her shelf life and Trump is all sales and no product.
We'll see how it goes. I too, am not attached either way. Whoever has won, it will make for interesting times, as the Chinese would cynically say.
I am hearing rumblings about Stein purposely starting the Wisconsin recount late in order that the recount will not be completed on time and Wisconsin forfeits its electoral votes... anyone hear anything on that?
A lawyer with Stein's campaign has said it wants the recount done by hand. That would take longer and require a judge's order, Haas said.
Perhaps the most important deadline is Dec. 19, when electors around the country must meet to cast their Electoral College votes, said Edward Foley, an expert in election law at Moritz College of Law at Ohio State University.
"That is a hard deadline and if a state were to miss that deadline, it would be technically in jeopardy of not having its electoral votes counted," he said.
If the recount isn't complete by then, electors from Wisconsin could meet anyway and try to have their results sent to Congress by the time it counts the votes on Jan. 6, Foley said. Congress has wide latitude to decide how to count the states' electoral votes.
She is specifically asking for a hand recount, which will definitely slow up the process.
So if this is valid, it is really attempting to either steal the election, or cause a crisis that attempts to break the system.
Be ready for anything...
I had heard this as well, ie, that if she could delay the recounts until after December 19, the involved states might have their electoral votes denied. This could have resulted in neither Trump nor Hillary ( and certainly not Jill Stein, she had far fewer to begin with) getting 270 electoral votes, throwing the election to Congress. The idea was that this would be another attempt to delegitimize Donald Trump's election by the left, since they could claim (assuming a GOP majority in the House would elect Trump) that he lost the popular vote, lost the electoral vote via recount, and was "selected" by Congress.
I have no idea if this was Stein's motives for the recount, or if she was attempting to make Trump's transition to the WH as hard as possible under a possible spectre of such a recount throwing the election to Hillary. Or if her intentions were to throw mud into the process to see what might stick or glom it up, with the side effects of lining her own pockets for "future election integrity checks" ( whatever that means).
At this point, though, seems all she has accomplished is pi $$ing off a bunch of people, including judges in the involved states,
Democrats and even her own Green party members.
It's one million dollar BOND.... NOT cash.... which means it probably cost 20k cash to secure that bond... it's not a matter of not having enough... it's a matter of liberals are just stupid and can't figure out she walked away with a boatload of cash... Merry Christmas...
BINGO. Stein has a news conference set for Monday where she is presumably asking for more money.
Stein raked in the money. There were some proud people in this forum that donated to this scheme too.
She raised $7 Million for the recount. She paid $3.5M in Wisconsin already and owes another $0.4M and she paid $0.97M in Michigan.
If she stops PA then the other states won't do her any good
It was all or nothing and she can **** now..
According to the media reports I read a short time ago, Stein has given up on her bid to force a statewide recount in PA. She filed the petition because she missed the deadline of Nov. 21 to petition for a recount in PA. Apparently the judge required that she file a 1 million dollar bond to move forward with the hearing, and along with the name calling and carrying on that was her response this request, she dropped the petition for the statewide recount.
Apparently according to her attorney, though, she is continuing her county by county effort to get voters to petition for recounts. This involves getting three voters from each precinct to petition their supervisor of elections for a recount. I have no idea how many precincts are involved there, but getting this done looks to me to be more of a Herculean task than a statewide recount. It's been reported that these recounts are ongoing in any number of precinct in several countiesin PA, but I don't see the precincts in every county participating, and without the total state seems to me its dead in the water.
And that's just PA, she'd need all three states recounts to be significantly different to take those votes away from Trump.
,
I pretty much agree with everything you've posted.
I'd like to add and acknowledge that there is no smoking gun anywhere. The challenge is that the hack that's possible can't be discovered without a comparison between paper ballots recorded at the precinct and electronic tally at headquarters for the same precinct.
You will acknowledge that if there was evidence that the russians hacked the election results in only one state, then that would put the whole election in question?
I too would have rather voted for Bernie Sanders over all the finalists. Clinton was past her shelf life and Trump is all sales and no product.
We'll see how it goes. I too, am not attached either way. Whoever has won, it will make for interesting times, as the Chinese say.
And by the way, the Dems and their allies (at home and abroad) are just as likely and capable of hacking the election as Trumps allies.
As I said in my prior post, they're looking at the wrong states if they're looking for Russian/Chinese/Guatemalan/Antarctic hackers. The most vulnerable states are New Jersey, Delaware, South Carolina, Georgia and Louisiana. These states are full DRE without a paper trail. This likely means that their entire voting process is wide open to hacking and they lack the ability to do a manual verification. If I'm a hacker, you better believe that's my target. The state of Florida also uses DRE's without a paper trail and also happens to be consistently inconsistent on who they go for for POTUS. New Jersey going for Trump would have thrown up red flags all over the place. Florida, not so much. So that would be a prime target if I'm looking to hack an election. Virginia and Indiana would also be ideal targets for hacking.
It's the choice to demand a recount in MI above all else and WI to a lesser degree that makes Stein look like a complete fraud.
Adding to that, there is only one conceivable reason to wait until the last possible moment as well: You're trying to tie up the state in recount proceedings until the deadline has passed so you can potentially prevent these three states from sending their electors to the Electoral College. That is precisely why Stein sued WI for refusing to do a hand recount. WI officials have stated that they don't think they'd complete a hand recount in time. Stein is trying to deny WI, MI and PA a voice in the election. Why else wouldn't she have filed for a recount weeks earlier??
If Peruvian Nazi Bolshevik hackers really did mess with the result, then yes it would cast the results into question. If possible, it would need to be determined how many votes were tainted and if there are enough of them to have changed the outcome. If it's enough tainted votes then we might just need to have the first do-over Presidential Election in US history. If it couldn't have changed the outcome then:
A.) Go ahead and swear Trump in.
B.) Investigate voter fraud of all types in all states to the fullest and take whatever preventative measures are necessary to stop it.
Quote:
Whoever has won, it will make for interesting times, as the Chinese say.
On this point, clearly Trump is the the better choice. America has just elected a Twitter Troll. They've elected the least diplomatic and least tactful human being any of us will have ever seen as President of the United States in our lives. This is going to be a ton of fun to watch!! It was already the most entertaining presidential election ever. It's now going to be the most entertaining presidency.
Let's face it, Hillary is pretty boring by comparison.
And by the way, the Dems and their allies (at home and abroad) are just as likely and capable of hacking the election as Trumps allies.
As I said in my prior post, they're looking at the wrong states if they're looking for Russian/Chinese/Guatemalan/Antarctic hackers. The most vulnerable states are New Jersey, Delaware, South Carolina, Georgia and Louisiana. These states are full DRE without a paper trail. This likely means that their entire voting process is wide open to hacking and they lack the ability to do a manual verification. If I'm a hacker, you better believe that's my target. The state of Florida also uses DRE's without a paper trail and also happens to be consistently inconsistent on who they go for for POTUS. New Jersey going for Trump would have thrown up red flags all over the place. Florida, not so much. So that would be a prime target if I'm looking to hack an election. Virginia and Indiana would also be ideal targets for hacking.
It's the choice to demand a recount in MI above all else and WI to a lesser degree that makes Stein look like a complete fraud.
Adding to that, there is only one conceivable reason to wait until the last possible moment as well: You're trying to tie up the state in recount proceedings until the deadline has passed so you can potentially prevent these three states from sending their electors to the Electoral College. That is precisely why Stein sued WI for refusing to do a hand recount. WI officials have stated that they don't think they'd complete a hand recount in time. Stein is trying to deny WI, MI and PA a voice in the election. Why else wouldn't she have filed for a recount weeks earlier??
If Peruvian Nazi Bolshevik hackers really did mess with the result, then yes it would cast the results into question. If possible, it would need to be determined how many votes were tainted and if there are enough of them to have changed the outcome. If it's enough tainted votes then we might just need to have the first do-over Presidential Election in US history. If it couldn't have changed the outcome then:
A.) Go ahead and swear Trump in.
B.) Investigate voter fraud of all types in all states to the fullest and take whatever preventative measures are necessary to stop it.
On this point, clearly Trump is the the better choice. America has just elected a Twitter Troll. They've elected the least diplomatic and least tactful human being any of us will have ever seen as President of the United States in our lives. This is going to be a ton of fun to watch!! It was already the most entertaining presidential election ever. It's now going to be the most entertaining presidency.
Let's face it, Hillary is pretty boring by comparison.
True. The riveting possibilities of the situation are endless. Could go anywhere.
They've spent MILLIONS of dollars of Democrats and I just read that they have found 3 extra votes for Hillary and 5 extra for Donald so far. So Donald has netted 2 votes.
This is how they waste your money Dems. Rather than give it back to you they decided to blow it on these recounts. Because they just cannot stand the idea of returning money to where it came from.
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