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Old 05-09-2018, 10:40 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
6,976 posts, read 7,745,631 times
Reputation: 5670

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
There is nothing about Trump that indicates he is somehow better than predicted. He is exactly who he was predicted to be. The only problem is that all this disaster is being normalized the longer it goes on, so non-critical thinkers who are simply getting used to it are thinking it's not so bad. It is bad, and anyone thinking otherwise is deluding themselves.


All the continued Hillary talk 18 months after the election is simply more excuse making by people who want to convince themselves that everything is fine or that their choices were justified. Who cares about Hillary now. Seriously.
If it were only conservatives bringing up Hillary, you would have a point. Unfortunately, there are major Democrat players that are still riding the Hillary train - including Hillary herself. Seriously, was it necessary to write a book detailing her loss? Was it necessary to continue to blame other people for that loss? And is it necessary for the former First Lady to make statements such as Michelle Obama made, asking what's wrong with women who didn't vote for Hillary?

Face it, the reason that Hillary is still in the news is that the left wants her to stay relevant for some strange reason. The way the left is acting, they're going to nominate her again in the hopes that the old adage about third times is true. Hopefully, the less rabid Democrats (if there are any) will prevail and someone will be nominated who doesn't have enough baggage trailing behind them to fill a fleet of Greyhound buses.

Trump, in my opinion, is a terrible POTUS. Not necessarily on policy issues, as he has actually done a few things that I agree with. Where I have a major problem with Trump is his complete disregard for anything approaching modesty. Being confident in yourself is one thing, pretending that you are infallible is something totally different. However, the fact that Trump is President is something that the Democrats bear at least half of the blame for. Had they managed to nominate just about any other candidate than Hillary, Trump would be a footnote in the history books. But it was "her turn" to be POTUS, and nothing was going to stop it from happening. Therefore, we ended up with the two most unqualified, disliked, and downright corrupt candidates that we've ever had. This is where we ended up, and until the Democrats figure out how badly they misjudged the working class in America and come back to actually supporting the average American citizen they'll continue to get their buttocks handed to them on a plate.
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:00 AM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
27,137 posts, read 15,677,613 times
Reputation: 9811
Quote:
Originally Posted by illinoisphotographer View Post
Personally, it has nothing to do with "small states" -- how about all of the purple big states that are winner takes all? How about Republican voters in Massachusetts or Democrat voters in Kansas?

In the current system, their voices don't matter at all. That's the issue.

You talk about wanting to remove "group think", yet that's exactly what the EC is for 48 states.
This is what I see. Voting Democrat in Arizona is basically fruitless in the Presidential elections. Besides Clinton in 1996, it goes back to I think the 1950's the last time Arizona went blue. It is getting less red but still not quite purple.
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Old 05-10-2018, 07:07 AM
 
2,963 posts, read 3,040,720 times
Reputation: 2869
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimRom View Post
If it were only conservatives bringing up Hillary, you would have a point. Unfortunately, there are major Democrat players that are still riding the Hillary train
That's a big mistake by the Democrats. I'm personally tired of hearing about her. She lost, everyone should move on. I expect Republicans to still use her as a punching bag, but the only reason Democrats should talk about her is if they were giving a presentation on "How not to run a campaign against Donald Trump."

Quote:
Trump, in my opinion, is a terrible POTUS. Not necessarily on policy issues, as he has actually done a few things that I agree with. Where I have a major problem with Trump is his complete disregard for anything approaching modesty. Being confident in yourself is one thing, pretending that you are infallible is something totally different.
That is refreshing to hear. It is a perfectly valid argument to say "I don't like the guy but he is doing a good job for XYZ reasons." We need more of that here and in the country in general.

I don't like the guy and a try to find a few good things he's done. I personally liked how he prevented that Broadcom buyout of Qualcom. He did something else too, but I don't remember what.

I think Democrats will need to figure out the winning strategy after they see how the midterms go. The "Anyone But Trump" likely won't work. The economy appears strong and whether he is the benefactor or merely a guy in the right place at the right time, that's a hard thing to argue against.
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Old 05-10-2018, 07:33 AM
 
11,844 posts, read 5,023,835 times
Reputation: 18242
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevroqs View Post
The only states that would vote to remove the EC are the states which Hillary won
Not true at all. It's not even about red states vs blue states. States like Delaware, New Hamphire, New Mexico which Hillary won, will not want to give up their right to choose the president. That's what they would be doing by voting to eliminate the EC. The EC was put in place to protect states like these from large states.
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Seattle, WA
621 posts, read 213,447 times
Reputation: 394
Well, if we get rid of The Electoral College, California, New York, and Illinois will control the president's every single time. The cities of New York City, Los Angeles, and Chicago have enough people to put Democrat's over the top. The rest of the country would be counted out. Specifically why we have it, so that every state has a voice, not just 3 cities.
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Denver CO
20,975 posts, read 11,624,951 times
Reputation: 31812
Why is the expectation that Hillary "should move on" just because she's still sometimes in the public eye? Most failed presidential nominees stay in the public eye and people don't complain about that. She wrote a book? So do lots of politicians. So did Bernie Sanders, for instance. No one said he needed to go away because he lost the Democratic primary.

John McCain's written a couple of books since he was a losing nominee, has have losing VP nominees Paul Ryan and Sarah Palin.

People are free to not buy Hillary's book or to not listen to what she has to say. But she has every bit as much right to tweet, write books, give speeches and go on book tours as anyone else.
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:57 PM
 
77,900 posts, read 33,252,383 times
Reputation: 15573
Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
Why is the expectation that Hillary "should move on" just because she's still sometimes in the public eye? Most failed presidential nominees stay in the public eye and people don't complain about that. She wrote a book? So do lots of politicians. So did Bernie Sanders, for instance. No one said he needed to go away because he lost the Democratic primary.
I want her to move on because she hurts the (D)'s chances moving forward.

Quote:
John McCain's written a couple of books since he was a losing nominee, has have losing VP nominees Paul Ryan and Sarah Palin.

People are free to not buy Hillary's book or to not listen to what she has to say. But she has every bit as much right to tweet, write books, give speeches and go on book tours as anyone else.
She does. Another Trump four years will be the result though.
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Old 05-10-2018, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Denver CO
20,975 posts, read 11,624,951 times
Reputation: 31812
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
I want her to move on because she hurts the (D)'s chances moving forward.



She does. Another Trump four years will be the result though.
Well, I'd say Bernie Sanders is doing a lot more to hurt the Democrats' chances of moving forward, but presumably you will disagree. Hillary isn't actively working against incumbent Democrats though.
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Old 05-10-2018, 01:13 PM
 
77,900 posts, read 33,252,383 times
Reputation: 15573
Quote:
Originally Posted by emm74 View Post
Well, I'd say Bernie Sanders is doing a lot more to hurt the Democrats' chances of moving forward, but presumably you will disagree. Hillary isn't actively working against incumbent Democrats though.
Many of them need someone to run against them. Sanders would have won. One day the party may learn, Corporate (D) or Corporate (R) there are many of us who will support neither and have no intention to see that the party wins no matter what.

Yes, those of us who supported Sanders hurt the party by not supporting it. It didn't support us either, so............
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Old 05-10-2018, 01:22 PM
 
Location: Denver CO
20,975 posts, read 11,624,951 times
Reputation: 31812
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Many of them need someone to run against them. Sanders would have won. One day the party may learn, Corporate (D) or Corporate (R) there are many of us who will support neither and have no intention to see that the party wins no matter what.

Yes, those of us who supported Sanders hurt the party by not supporting it. It didn't support us either, so............
Sanders would have lost even more badly than he lost to Hillary Clinton. Stop living in fantasyland. He would have faced a negative campaign for the first time, and there are far too many Americans who would never vote for someone who would be called a socialist, with footage of him praising Castro, saying breadlines and food rationing was a good thing, honeymooning in the USSR and more. Those are all real things that would be played over and over in ads.

And whether you want to call someone a "corporate Democrat" - when you attack an incumbent, you are making it easier for a Republican to win. Period. So yes, Bernie and "Our Revolution" are actively working to help stop a potential Democratic takeover of Congress, and potentially lead the way to Trump's reelection. Because he and his supporters would rather whine about not achieving their vision of perfection and pretend that what's happening in this country right now is the same as what would have happened in a Hillary Clinton administration. I know a large number of people of color and women and immigrants who can explain to you exactly how wrong that idea is.
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