Will McCain have support in Western Europe to confront Russia? (9/11, Iran)

[TuborgP]

Will his confrontation with Russia be without our traditional allies in Western Europe? Are the traditional colleagues tired of American Cowboys? Read and decide. I will give you a teaser or two.
The Georgia Crisis: A Blow to NATO - TIME

The Georgia Crisis: A Blow to NATO
If Russia's brutal response to Georgia's provocation had, in fact, obliged NATO to intervene, the Atlantic Alliance itself might have faced a terminal crisis. Most of its member states have no enthusiasm for confronting a resurgent Russia in the Caucasus, traditionally a Russian sphere of influence

Great article from Time magazine. It also includes the suggestion that Russia in response to our missile shield in their backyard may station strategic bombers in Cuba.

Yup what won't they do to keep power in the White House.

[walidm]

Originally Posted by TuborgP

Will his confrontation with Russia be without our traditional allies in Western Europe? Are the traditional colleagues tired of American Cowboys? Read and decide. I will give you a teaser or two.
The Georgia Crisis: A Blow to NATO - TIME

The Georgia Crisis: A Blow to NATO
If Russia's brutal response to Georgia's provocation had, in fact, obliged NATO to intervene, the Atlantic Alliance itself might have faced a terminal crisis. Most of its member states have no enthusiasm for confronting a resurgent Russia in the Caucasus, traditionally a Russian sphere of influence

Great article from Time magazine. It also includes the suggestion that Russia in response to our missile shield in their backyard may station strategic bombers in Cuba.

Yup what won't they do to keep power in the White House.

Didn't we go through this Cuba situation once before?

[NewToCA]

Your posting assumes Georgia provocation, while the UN assumes otherwise:

Russia committed act of war against Georgia, says UN

The Kremlin is guilty of committing an act of war against Georgia, according to a United Nations report.

Last Updated: 7:10PM BST 26 May 2008


Russia committed act of war against Georgia, says UN - Telegraph

[BigJon3475]

It's not a new situation and we as a nation being complacent is the wrong direction.

From day one we are obligated to show the other people what freedom is....it's addictive and in the best interest of the entire world.



We want everything democratic it can be....How we became great.

[.....think]

Originally Posted by BigJon3475

It's not a new situation and we as a nation being complacent is the wrong direction.

From day one we are obligated to show the other people what freedom is....it's addictive and in the best interest of the entire world.



We want everything democratic it can be....How we became great.

SO let forcibly make people choose democratics!!!!! and lets destroy our economy in the mean time and well who care who gets hurt and if there is a more peaceful way like we did 2 well SOVIT RUSSIA and change them into a little more democratic but very corrupt govermet.

[BigJon3475]

Forcefully?

Afghanistan was tied directly with 9/11

Iraq has a vicious dictator that killed by the masses, controlled the a large reserve of the worlds oil, was known to set them a balze if he didn't get his way....ect...ect...Ohh by the way his two sons would have carried on the tradition.

Yeah we should have let the peaceful countries sleep....they'd never do anything to hurt a fly.

[Soccersupporter]

Originally Posted by TuborgP

Will his confrontation with Russia be without our traditional allies in Western Europe? Are the traditional colleagues tired of American Cowboys? Read and decide. I will give you a teaser or two.
The Georgia Crisis: A Blow to NATO - TIME

The Georgia Crisis: A Blow to NATO
If Russia's brutal response to Georgia's provocation had, in fact, obliged NATO to intervene, the Atlantic Alliance itself might have faced a terminal crisis. Most of its member states have no enthusiasm for confronting a resurgent Russia in the Caucasus, traditionally a Russian sphere of influence

Great article from Time magazine. It also includes the suggestion that Russia in response to our missile shield in their backyard may station strategic bombers in Cuba.

Yup what won't they do to keep power in the White House.

TuborgP,

You and I have had civil disagreements many times and I respect your opinion but we depart dramatically here. If you feel Russia is entitled to run over the surrounding democracies at will you are gravely mistaken. This is not black and white as some people believe but what Russia is doing is completely wrong.

If you think Georgia has not right o sovereignty I guess you are on the wrong side. Bringing the countries surrounding Russia in to NATO would be the smart thing to do if Russia does not back down. The UN is powerless and inept or they would resolve this situation ASAP.

I guess where we differ is I don't always take a shot at the government without thinking the situation through clearly. Russia is a destabilizing factor in Europe right now and something needs to be done to calm things down. I would be interested in hearing your solution.

[TuborgP]

Originally Posted by Soccersupporter

TuborgP,

You and I have had civil disagreements many times and I respect your opinion but we depart dramatically here. If you feel Russia is entitled to run over the surrounding democracies at will you are gravely mistaken. This is not black and white as some people believe but what Russia is doing is completely wrong.

If you think Georgia has not right o sovereignty I guess you are on the wrong side. Bringing the countries surrounding Russia in to NATO would be the smart thing to do if Russia does not back down. The UN is powerless and inept or they would resolve this situation ASAP.

I guess where we differ is I don't always take a shot at the government without thinking the situation through clearly. Russia is a destabilizing factor in Europe right now and something needs to be done to calm things down. I would be interested in hearing your solution.

You are missing my point and the point of this thread. Accept everything you say about confronting the Soviets and ask the following:

Are the nations of Western Europe our traditional allies ready and willing to follow us as we confront Russia. The link and other data seems to suggest otherwise. Now is McCain the man to win the hearts and souls of the Western European Democracies so that their leaders have the will of their citizens behind them? Is Nato ready to align with McCain and does he need to go to Wester Europe to show the leaders he can rally their people? Without the support of our traditional allies the NATO we know and count on is in jeopardy.

[TuborgP]

Do some reading from European sites. It is being billed as the American/Polish deal to place missiles in Poland thus angering Poland. Words like controversial get used. Is the message that the placement was via NATO or America? Is this encouraging the citizens to support the use of their military as a result of this decision? What about Afghanistan and their upping the troop committment there? Are they rushing to do so? Are they rushing to join the US and Israel in any military action against Iran? Will it be Poland and the United States against Russia? Will it be Israel and the United States against Iran? Who is left with us in Iraq? Yes the forces of evil are there in the world to be confronted but who is yelling for American leadership to directly confront the evil as full and active partners?

[BigJon3475]

Poland, U.S. sign missile shield deal - CNN.com

"Col. Gen. Anatoly Nogovitsyn, deputy chief of staff of the Russian armed forces, called it "a very serious question."

"Our political and military cooperation moves to a different higher level." Radoslaw Sikorski, the Polish foreign minister, said, after the signing."

Why would Russia have anything to fear from a missile defense system?

"The plans to base the anti-missile system in Eastern Europe have raised alarms in Russia, which fears the system would blunt its nuclear deterrent."

But why such a weird stance if you are on the uppity up?


"There is a lot of work to be done and the American side is aggravating the situation even more in the relationship between the United States and Russia," Nogovitsyn said when asked about the U.S.-Poland agreement. He was speaking at a briefing called to discuss the Russia-Georgia crisis.
Both countries are former Soviet satellites which now belong to the NATO alliance."


Ohh well now I see it clearer. More work to be done? I wonder what that entails.....I mean they are members of NATO already...I wish I could ask him to define more work.... my assumptions aren't good as to what he means but maybe he will clarify.