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Old 09-15-2008, 09:18 AM
 
25,780 posts, read 38,992,690 times
Reputation: 13782

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob The Builder View Post
Maybe Obama should give back ALL the contributions made to his campaign from Wall Street.
Yeah! I guess it isn't so bad after all if he can get 66 Million he can give easily money to support Texas and Wallstreet....with all the extra money he is still behind...so this 66 million will go down the gutter.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:21 AM
 
11,328 posts, read 5,923,565 times
Reputation: 3544
Quote:
Originally Posted by paperhouse View Post
How could they be? It's not like they created all the new money that flooded the system enabling all these companies to lend so unscrupulously and without regard to basic accounting and verification of incomes.
Yup, everyone wants to blame GWB and the Republicans.

The silly notion that the Fed thinks they can control the economy is one of our biggest problems. I thought we were supposed to learn from history? I guess not.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,845 posts, read 3,882,639 times
Reputation: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by songgirl View Post
I agree 100%. It was predatory lending which is causing these banks to collapse. Plain and simple.
I agree. But it was more than just predatory. It was criminal. I know some of these lenders. Where is the public outrage?

There has got to be some accountability. These guys walked off with their pockets stuffed full of cash knowing that their borrowers were going to get in trouble.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:25 AM
 
Location: Albemarle, NC
7,730 posts, read 12,689,324 times
Reputation: 1504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob The Builder View Post
I agree. But it was more than just predatory. It was criminal. I know some of these lenders. Where is the public outrage?

There has got to be some accountability. These guys walked off with their pockets stuffed full of cash knowing that their borrowers were going to get in trouble.
There is absolutely NO accountability under the Federal Reserve system for those that control the currency. Start at the top and direct your outrage down from there.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,845 posts, read 3,882,639 times
Reputation: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by paperhouse View Post
There is absolutely NO accountability under the Federal Reserve system for those that control the currency. Start at the top and direct your outrage down from there.
Nah.

We know where the lenders are. We know where the realtors are. Blame some figure head if you like, but what about your neighbor who was selling the loans and pocketing tens of thousands in fees? What about the neighbor/realtor who pocketed hundreds of thousands in commissions?

They were the first to sell you down the river.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:31 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
14,330 posts, read 19,496,696 times
Reputation: 18436
Quote:
Originally Posted by t206 View Post
Pretty irrational post. If you really believe that only one party, and the current POTUS are completely responsible for this mess, you have definitely been consumed completely by partisan politics. This is a bi-party disaster, nobody is free from blame.
It is not partisan politics, it is reality. If the war were a success, Conservatives would be taking the credit because they are the only people who perpetuated the war. If the economy, jobs, housing were doing well, Conservatives would be saying that their policies were the reason. Conservatives have been calling the shots these 8 years and their failures and one-side emphasis on war, war, war is now impacting this country here at home. Again, Bush lied to go to war, to fight an ideology with guns while this country bleeds to death. Housing crisis, record unemployment, American workers getting displaced as a matter of course by cheap foreign labor flooding the country on visas, outrageous gas prices, skyrocketing street gang problems, crumbling infrastructure, economy in a free-fall. You can't possibly sit there in your pjs and say that wasting trillions on a failed war has not negatively impacted this country in these areas.

As the latest president, George Bush was in a better position than any president in history to keep this from happening because he had the benefit of hindsight. Bush had more information at his disposal than any previous president, yet chose to engage in war, war, war. No, conservatives cannot get away from the negative impact their ridiculous policies have had the last 8 years. They have been in control and thus must assume the blame. This includes McCain, who is part of the problem.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:34 AM
 
Location: Texas
43,408 posts, read 52,393,689 times
Reputation: 70378
Quote:
Originally Posted by tluv00 View Post
The blame falls in the hands of the mortgage companies who are now laying in the beds they made. There is partial blame on the administration in regards to not regulating the industry.

One of Bush's goals was to have his legacy include "ownership". More people buying homes than ever before and while a good goal, it came back to bite everyone in the a$$ thanks to....once again.....$$.

I get that it would have been preferable to some people to have the government policing these people better (though these same "screwed" people would be the first to get pissed if the government ever tried to tell them how to spend their money), and I understand that Bush encouraged people to follow the dream of home ownership, but I still don't get how the home buyer sitting at the desk in the bank with the papers in front of him isn't ultimately to blame for getting in over his head buying something he couldn't afford.

Encouraging people to own a home is not the same as telling them to make poor financial decisions and not read their contracts. People tell me to buy stuff all the time - it doesn't mean I listen to them.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:35 AM
 
177 posts, read 232,137 times
Reputation: 105
Default Fundamentally sound? How so?

Quote:
Originally Posted by songgirl View Post
McCain thinks the economy is fundamentally sound.
For who???
bush said something similar to that affect today.

I wonder what he means by fundamentally sound? I guess if you have millions and have so much money you don't know how many houses you own or what kind of car you own because you have a chauffer than the economy would be fundamentally sound.

I have lost over 100K in investments and it is growing. Everyday, I watch t.v. and look at the grim affects of the economy. Now there are 118 banks in trouble up from 100 just a few months ago but the FDIC won't reveal these banks, Buyer beware.


Go to hel_ John McCain as my economy is not fundamentally sound. Our income won't fully support us.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,845 posts, read 3,882,639 times
Reputation: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4 View Post
I get that it would have been preferable to some people to have the government policing these people better (though these same "screwed" people would be the first to get pissed if the government ever tried to tell them how to spend their money), and I understand that Bush encouraged people to follow the dream of home ownership, but I still don't get how the home buyer sitting at the desk in the bank with the papers in front of him isn't ultimately to blame for getting in over his head buying something he couldn't afford.

Encouraging people to own a home is not the same as telling them to make poor financial decisions and not read their contracts. People tell me to buy stuff all the time - it doesn't mean I listen to them.
Stan

Don't get me wrong. I sold out in 2005. I saw this coming back in 2003. The homeowner sitting at the conference table was not the smartest person in the room and those others who pulled nice fees and commissions had a fiduciary duty to protect them.
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Old 09-15-2008, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Sacramento
13,781 posts, read 23,751,182 times
Reputation: 6174
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexus View Post
It is not partisan politics, it is reality. If the war were a success, Conservatives would be taking the credit because they are the only people who perpetuated the war. If the economy, jobs, housing were doing well, Conservatives would be saying that their policies were the reason. Conservatives have been calling the shots these 8 years and their failures and one-side emphasis on war, war, war is now impacting this country here at home. Again, Bush lied to go to war, to fight an ideology with guns while this country bleeds to death. Housing crisis, record unemployment, American workers getting displaced as a matter of course by cheap foreign labor flooding the country on visas, outrageous gas prices, skyrocketing street gang problems, crumbling infrastructure, economy in a free-fall. You can't possibly sit there in your pjs and say that wasting trillions on a failed war has not negatively impacted this country in these areas.

As the latest president, George Bush was in a better position than any president in history to keep this from happening because he had the benefit of hindsight. Bush had more information at his disposal than any previous president, yet chose to engage in war, war, war. No, conservatives cannot get away from the negative impact their ridiculous policies have had the last 8 years. They have been in control and thus must assume the blame. This includes McCain, who is part of the problem.
Actually, your blame is generally inaccurate. In fact, much of the financial crisis that exists today can be traced to actions initiated under Bill Clinton, by Andrew Cuomo when he was at HUD:

Andrew Cuomo, the youngest Housing and Urban Development secretary in history, made a series of decisions between 1997 and 2001 that gave birth to the country's current crisis. He took actions that—in combination with many other factors—helped plunge Fannie and Freddie into the subprime markets without putting in place the means to monitor their increasingly risky investments. He turned the Federal Housing Administration mortgage program into a sweetheart lender with sky-high loan ceilings and no money down, and he legalized what a federal judge has branded "kickbacks" to brokers that have fueled the sale of overpriced and unsupportable loans.

In 2000, Cuomo required a quantum leap in the number of affordable, low-to-moderate-income loans that the two mortgage banks—known collectively as Government Sponsored Enterprises—would have to buy. The GSEs don't actually sell mortgages to borrowers. They buy them from banks and mortgage companies, allowing lenders to replenish their capital and make more loans. They also purchase mortgage-backed securities, which are pools of mortgages regularly acquired by the GSEs from investment firms. The government chartered these banks to pump money into the mortgage market and, while they did it, to make a strong enough profit to attract shareholders. That created a tug-of-war between their efforts to maximize shareholder value, which drove them toward high-end mortgages, and their congressionally mandated obligation to finance loans for those who needed help. The 1992 law required HUD's secretary to make sure housing goals were being met and, every four years, set new goals for Fannie and Freddie.

While many saw this demand for increasingly "flexible" loan terms and standards as a positive step for low-income and minority families, others warned that they could have potentially dangerous consequences. Franklin Raines, the Fannie chairman and first black CEO of a Fortune 500 company, warned that Cuomo's rules were moving Fannie into risky territory: "We have not been a major presence in the subprime market," he said, "but you can bet that under these goals, we will be."



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