...plan to require 50 hours of community service in middle school and high school and 100 hours.. (state, religion)
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Does that mean the misquote in the first post was a combination of quotes.. not verbatim?
And if so, doesn't that invalidate this entire 20+ page discussion about service being required?
The first quote was verbatim - the page did change over-night.
Aside from the bribe thrown into Obama's rewrite, the whole idea is far from original:
"Service in the Hitler Youth is honorary service to the German people. All young people are obliged from the age of 10 to their 19th birthday to serve in the Hitler youth."
Well, there you go. Whomever they were listening to (probably not CD--how could they ever keep up? I sure can't), they obviously did listen to input on how this would better work.
Amazing. An administration that actually listens to actual people...
Aside from the bribe thrown into Obama's rewrite, the whole idea is far from original:
"Service in the Hitler Youth is honorary service to the German people. All young people are obliged from the age of 10 to their 19th birthday to serve in the Hitler youth."
Switzerland and Israel are also countries that have service requirements. Is Israel a Nazi country? Please stop with the vitriole. this topic is worthy of serious discussion, as an American proposition, and does not need senseless things thrown in.
malamute,
The sad truth is that asking people doesn't work. When my kids were in school it was always the same parents who volunteered year after year. We got to know each other quite well but we could have used the help. Some of us worked outside the home and some didn't. (dads and moms) If we go to the community center it is still the same people volunteering there that we got to know when the kids were small. The kids who join the peace corps or who volunteer otherwise are the kids whose parents set the example when they were young. But the point is that at least 75 percent of people do not volunteer for anything. We are all tired and stressed so what? We are all needed. If you have a solution please enlighten me. If the government program is the best answer so far than maybe we need to think about it and come up with a workable alternative. But just complaining about the program with no solution is a waste. Bush talked about faith based programs and what happened? A lot of formerly successful programs closed down for lack of funding and the so called faith based community didn't pick up the slack.
So when these young Obama supporters don't really feel like trading their wild girls gone wild spring break parties to go work in some homeless shelter scrubbing toilets and serving soup, or raking leaves in their urban park, painting over graffitti, or they don't really want to put down the playstation or Nintendo Wii controller, what are you going to do about it?
Send in the Gestapo and haul them off? Whip them with canes? You really want to call forced service "volunteerism"? The sad truth -- many kids who attend church and are part of church groups are the ones being taught and giving community service but far too many no longer believe in anything like that.
So when these young Obama supporters don't really feel like trading their wild girls gone wild spring break parties to go work in some homeless shelter scrubbing toilets and serving soup, or raking leaves in their urban park, painting over graffitti, or they don't really want to put down the playstation or Nintendo Wii controller, what are you going to do about it?
Send in the Gestapo and haul them off? Whip them with canes? (snip)
This is such a weird question. When a kid doesn't want to put down is Wii controller and go to school, what do you do about it? Send in the Gestapo and haul him off? Whip him with canes?
When a kid doesn't want to get up in gym class, what do you do about it? Send in the Gestapo and haul him off? Whip him with canes?
These are "mandated" and have been for a good many decades, and (checking out my window quickly) no Nazis yet as far as I can see.
So when these young Obama supporters don't really feel like trading their wild girls gone wild spring break parties to go work in some homeless shelter scrubbing toilets and serving soup, or raking leaves in their urban park, painting over graffitti, or they don't really want to put down the playstation or Nintendo Wii controller, what are you going to do about it?
Send in the Gestapo and haul them off? Whip them with canes? You really want to call forced service "volunteerism"? The sad truth -- many kids who attend church and are part of church groups are the ones being taught and giving community service but far too many no longer believe in anything like that.
Give me a break. I seem to remember a church retreat I went to when I was young where one of the girls got pregnant. She "went a way" for a while. Another boy in church got married at 16 because he was about to be a daddy. (I'm dating myself) You really don't want to go there. Well, maybe you do but I'm not buying.
Volunteering doesn't have to be in a soup kitchen or a shelter which is why I brought up the grandma down the street. It could be something like helping in a classroom or taking a meal to a new mom. They still get to have their Wii.
There might be a statistical number out there that you can dig up regarding the percentage of church volunteers vs the percentage of non church goers, but it has been my experience that people volunteer based on what's in their heart. You know as well as I do that there are plenty of mean spirited non volunteer church goers out there. Some of the most active volunteers I know are atheist.
I don't advocate forcing people to volunteer and the proposal quoted at the beginning of this post doesn't either. You might want to take a closer look. I believe the proposal is met as an enticement not to be manditory. Having said that, once people find out that their greatest joy comes from helping others or as they say, "paying it forward" they rarely go back. Those who refuse to care just have to live with themselves.
This is such a weird question. When a kid doesn't want to put down is Wii controller and go to school, what do you do about it? Send in the Gestapo and haul him off? Whip him with canes?
When a kid doesn't want to get up in gym class, what do you do about it? Send in the Gestapo and haul him off? Whip him with canes?
These are "mandated" and have been for a good many decades, and (checking out my window quickly) no Nazis yet as far as I can see.
Not enough are being forced into gym class these days.
In 2010, when they get their tax credit, they put it in the bank.
Then they either put it in a lump sum toward the next semester, or use it to buy books, or keep it as "income" and release it to themselves a bit at a time so that they can work less each week.
In 2011, when they get that tax credit, they put it in the bank...
What is it you're not understanding here?
Is there anybody out there who can explain how it is that what amounts to $40 an hour for community service over the course of four years is not a good initiative and should be snubbed?
If I pay tuition in December for the spring semester in 2009, then I file my tax return in February I only have to wait until around March 1 to receive the credit. That is assuming that I file electronically and also have the money deposited directly into my account. That is only a lag time of three months. I use that money to pay tuition for fall semester in 2009. In the meantime I work and volunteer during the summer and accumulate money for spring semester 2010. I then claim the volunteer time on my 2011 return which I will file in early feb again and so on.
Sorry Jerz this doesn't explain why some think $40 dollars an hour isn't a good thing. And all I did here is repeat your comment.
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