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Old 02-26-2009, 12:50 AM
 
9,715 posts, read 13,290,266 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Actually the volcanoes of Hawaii are much less dangerous than those of the US West Coast. The Hawaiian volcanoes are much more active, but the nature of the magma (thinner and more liquid-like) makes them much less explosive than those of the Cascades and Sierra Nevada.

The reason Mt St Helens proved to be so deadly was that the lava was thick like lumpy porridge rather than runny like honey. The result was that it formed a solid plug which resisted movement until the pressure beneath it built up to a critical level - at which point a weak spot in the mountain's flank (bulged outward by the internal pressure) gave way during a small earthquake caused by magma movement in the depths of the peak. Once the flank gave way the internal pressure was released in an atomic-bomb-like horizontal blast. A similar violent eruption of Mt Mazama created Crater Lake many thousands of years ago.

The Hawaiian volcanoes have runny lava that flows much more freely and frequently - and thus doesn't build up so much internal pressure. All volcanoes are of course dangerous, but some are much more treacherous and unpredictable than others. The volcanoes of the West Coast fall into that latter category.

Ken
Volcanos also tie into earthquakes.

I didn't read this entire thread but Jindal's comment about the "volcano monitoring system" was enough for me to not vote for him. I consider that to be "truly out of touch" with the country.
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Old 02-26-2009, 01:02 AM
 
9,715 posts, read 13,290,266 times
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I think Bobby Jindal was sending us the "secret" message.

The "secret" message is: I'm no more ready to be President than Sarah Palin is.

And, after yesterday's speech, I'll totally buy that.
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Old 02-26-2009, 01:27 AM
 
2,659 posts, read 2,569,074 times
Reputation: 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTraik View Post
Thats 30000 people that are taking a risk. I don't see why this is everyone else's problem. Not only is it ridiculous to make this an issue for everyone... the likelihood of such destruction even happening is all speculatory.
How do you feel about the war in Iraq?
And the war on terror in general?
Quote:
LOL... You probably wouldn't believe me if I told you that art students were typically liberal would you? Too funny...
In my experience its about even, with the older engineers definitely leaning conservative. Rare that I've met an engineer under forty not a liberal - but when I say engineer I'm not including the basic IT guy
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Old 02-26-2009, 01:31 AM
 
8,758 posts, read 8,844,209 times
Reputation: 1429
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
It may LOOK authentic - but how do you know it wasn't a clever forgery? Are you an expert in such documents? Did you analyze the paper to be sure it's really 30+ years old? How about the ink? Are you sure it's a type of ink actually made back then? And then there's the signatures - did you verify them? Did you look up the attending doctor to validate he actually REMEMBERS the birth? I heard an internet rumor that Jindal was actually born in India and smuggled into this country later.

Or for that matter how do we know that you are telling the truth about actually seeing it? Maybe you are just covering for him because Jindal is one of YOUR guys.

etc, etc, etc.

Sound pretty stupid?
It IS - as are the similar moronic demands for detailed proof Obama is actually an American.


Ken

That was semi-funny the first time one of you did it, but it is getting old now. I am not one to get into the birth certificate thing, actually. Once he was elected that should have been over, because there is no do over. They might as well grin and bear the next four years.
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Old 02-26-2009, 02:02 AM
 
2,659 posts, read 2,569,074 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryneone View Post
In 38 pages no one has torn apart a single Jindal policy. I have seen people tear apart his name, appearance, and delivery.

I then quickly forget liberals can have an intellectual debate.
What new policies did he put out there last night?

He railed against spending, brought out a couple of real examples of poor spending (volcano montoring) ala Palin (mosquito research in france) and McCain (bear DNA).

Talked about tax cuts.

Did I miss a policy Jindal spoke about?
Did he have a new policy idea, or was it all recycled?
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Old 02-26-2009, 02:17 AM
 
Location: Rural Northern California
1,019 posts, read 2,479,021 times
Reputation: 824
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Actually the volcanoes of Hawaii are much less dangerous than those of the US West Coast. The Hawaiian volcanoes are much more active, but the nature of the magma (thinner and more liquid-like) makes them much less explosive than those of the Cascades and Sierra Nevada.

The reason Mt St Helens proved to be so deadly was that the lava was thick like lumpy porridge rather than runny like honey. The result was that it formed a solid plug which resisted movement until the pressure beneath it built up to a critical level - at which point a weak spot in the mountain's flank (bulged outward by the internal pressure) gave way during a small earthquake caused by magma movement in the depths of the peak. Once the flank gave way the internal pressure was released in an atomic-bomb-like horizontal blast. A similar violent eruption of Mt Mazama created Crater Lake many thousands of years ago.

The Hawaiian volcanoes have runny lava that flows much more freely and frequently - and thus doesn't build up so much internal pressure. All volcanoes are of course dangerous, but some are much more treacherous and unpredictable than others. The volcanoes of the West Coast fall into that latter category.

Ken
Well said, though I'd like to clarify a point or two. The shield volcanoes of Hawaii can still cause devastation through very large landslides (when they break apart; independent of an eruption event) which can lead to large tsunamis. Many of the dramatic cliffs on the island of Hawaii were produced in just such a manner. Also, even the mafic magma of Hawaiian volcanoes can cause steam eruptions, also known as phreatic eruptions, which can be locally dangerous.

Also, the St. Helens eruption, while large, is actually quite moderate when compared to historic eruptions at other Cascade volcanoes. The Mazama eruption that formed Crater Lake, as you mentioned, was a much larger event, and there is evidence of lateral blast events at Mt. Shasta (itself a much larger mountain than St. Helens) that far exceed the 1980 eruption.

Anyways, just nitpicking a tad I guess. It's not very often that I get to talk about volcanoes.
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Old 02-26-2009, 04:52 AM
 
3,277 posts, read 4,604,513 times
Reputation: 1913


Intrade Prediction Markets

Jindal '12
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Old 02-26-2009, 04:54 AM
 
Location: Charlotte
12,646 posts, read 13,894,201 times
Reputation: 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by UB50 View Post
Volcanos also tie into earthquakes.

I didn't read this entire thread but Jindal's comment about the "volcano monitoring system" was enough for me to not vote for him. I consider that to be "truly out of touch" with the country.
I'd love to hear him expand....perhaps hurricane monitoring is off the list as well....

On second thought, I don't think I could stomach another Mr. Rogers explanation of how ANYTHING works from Gov. Jindahl.
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Old 02-26-2009, 05:53 AM
 
Location: Turn Left at Greenland
17,700 posts, read 35,557,204 times
Reputation: 7951
As I listen to his speech even more ... my goodness ... he's talking down to people, making ***** up ...

Can all of you say wasteful spending?
Good, I knew you could

Can all of you say democrats caused katrina?
Good, I knew you could

Can all you of say, I'll take 90% of the money?
Good, I knew you could

It was like listening to a kindergarten teacher who is sick of teaching just drone on and on and on. Yea, he didn't slip up, but lordy lordy lord wingnuts! This is your answer to President Obama?

Helllooooooooooooooooooooooo second term!
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Old 02-26-2009, 07:17 AM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
19,868 posts, read 22,722,776 times
Reputation: 7167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Widowmaker2k View Post
Well said, though I'd like to clarify a point or two. The shield volcanoes of Hawaii can still cause devastation through very large landslides (when they break apart; independent of an eruption event) which can lead to large tsunamis. Many of the dramatic cliffs on the island of Hawaii were produced in just such a manner. Also, even the mafic magma of Hawaiian volcanoes can cause steam eruptions, also known as phreatic eruptions, which can be locally dangerous.

Also, the St. Helens eruption, while large, is actually quite moderate when compared to historic eruptions at other Cascade volcanoes. The Mazama eruption that formed Crater Lake, as you mentioned, was a much larger event, and there is evidence of lateral blast events at Mt. Shasta (itself a much larger mountain than St. Helens) that far exceed the 1980 eruption.

Anyways, just nitpicking a tad I guess. It's not very often that I get to talk about volcanoes.
Very good point.

The earthquake-induced landslide is a VERY dangerous thing. The Napali cliffs of the windward sides of the island didn't just magically appear that way - those pieces sheered off and fell into the sea in sometimes HUGE chunks, displacing LARGE amounts of water in the process and thus creating ENORMOUS tsunamis. Such sea-displacing landslides are VERY DANGEROUS to people thousands of miles away - as evidenced by the 200,000 people killed in the 2004 example off Indonesia (caused by an earthquake-induced undersea landslide).

There is plenty of evidence that even larger tsunamis (very probably formed by just such landslides on the windward cliffs of Hawaii's islands) have struck the US West Coast repeatedly - so we take them very seriously out here. Populated areas along the coast all have emergency evacuation routes clearly marked with road signs. They are pretty hard to miss.

And yes - even Mt St Helens - with it's 400 atomic bomb equivalent blast - was tiny compared to some of the other volcanic events of the past (Thera/Santorini, Krakatoa, Mt Mazama (now Crater Lake)).

Ken
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