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If I had to decide right now, I'd go live in Portugal. Fantastic seafood, romantic music, warm people who speak a melodious language, excellent & cheap wine, deep culture, and beaches just like LA, but without the silicone. Paradise, right!
The 3 bln Euros is not money that is borrowed to Berlin, it is just transferred there without the prospect of it being paid back at some point. Some of the rich states would actually not have to borrow more money and increase their debts if they didn't have to transfer some of their money to poorer states. Berlin receives more money through this system than any other of the poor states and it is just a city.
True, although it's in any case simplistic to say that one area 'supports' another, without looking at the demographics/psychographics of the areas you are comparing. For example, are Berliners within a given social or economic class, or with a given level of education or cultural capital, more or less productive economically than equivalent Bavarians? If they are in fact equally productive, then Berlin's revenue deficit is simply a reflection of the social make-up of the region, and one can argue that such economically unproductive individuals will exist, whether or not they happen to be geographically concentrated. If this is the situation, then other Germans' resentment of Berliners is merely a resentment of the poor, and probably misunderstands the economic functions of poverty. If, OTOH, equivalent individuals are less economically productive in Berlin than elsewhere, or rather, show less desire to be productive than those elsewhere, I suppose the resentment we're discussing could have more validity.
Of course, these are not easy questions to answer, but without looking at them, we're left wondering if the supposed resentment of Berliners by other Germans is not merely the resentment that the rich feel for the poor whose services they pay for through their taxes, and which, IMO, is a misjudged resentment.
True, although it's in any case simplistic
Of course, these are not easy questions to answer, but without looking at them, we're left wondering if the supposed resentment of Berliners by other Germans is not merely the resentment that the rich feel for the poor whose services they pay for through their taxes, and which, IMO, is a misjudged resentment.
The resentment from West Germany is completely justifiable, for reasons that go beyond the rich/poor duality that you mention.
Berlin has been the black sheep city of Germany and central Europe for nearly a century. West Berlin was propped up like a big middle finger to the East for 40+ years, sucking away on life support from Germany and the Allied countries who administered it after WW2. Throughout the cold war Germans came to West Berlin in order to gain exclusion from conscription or required civil service. Even before WW2 Berlin was a haven for decadence and iconoclasts. Berlin is the most multi-cultural city in Germany and thus has less to do with German culture than a lot of other cities. Following Istanbul, Berlin has the highest concentration of Muslims in any European city.
The only real industry in Berlin is politics. And tourism. Berlin is desperately in need of people to move in who make their money elsewhere and spend it there. Thus you have tens of thousands of artists, media workers, and creative people scraping by as freelancers and in tech startups. But there's not much money actually in the city. Not many Berliners get to live the first-class German lifestyle that you'd expect from Europe's greatest economic power.
Then there's aesthetics. Compared to Munich, Berlin is filthy dirty. Dog **** everywhere, graffiti all over the place, schizophrenic architecture... Quite colorful, but understandably unacceptable to the tastes of more well-to-do, traditional Germans who love their order and cleanliness.
Even further - all of the former DDR is (often unfairly) chastised in such a manner by a lot of west Germans, many of whom haven't even been to the east.
These are only some of the many reasons why west Germans would feel resentment that Berlin, the 'stolen capital' should be the recipient of their taxes. Berlin's a spoiled brat of a city. But that's why so many people love it!
If I had to decide right now, I'd go live in Portugal. Fantastic seafood, romantic music, warm people who speak a melodious language, excellent & cheap wine, deep culture, and beaches just like LA, but without the silicone. Paradise, right!
Damn. I never seriously looked into Portugal until now. It looks amazing. Porto and Lisbon seem to have pretty much everything I like in a city. Dense streets, old architecture, right on the ocean, cool to warm weather. Saw in an older thread by Tiger Beer he was considering retiring there. Not sure how that can be done. Not sure if it's a good place to go as a white, agnostic single either. One of the reasons I never looked into Portugal is because it had a reputation for high unemployment and recently is on the list of countries on the verge of defaulting.
What about Spain (Barcelona or Madrid)? Looks nice as well and better off economically.
Last edited by vaga bond; 02-28-2011 at 05:58 PM..
I visited Madrid for a week (just last week) and Barcelona last year.
Spain is nice, but also defaulting. Prices are going up.
Being large cities, Madrid and Barcelona are much more expensive than say, Granada.
The two cities also have completely different personalities, Madrid being medieval in parts; Barcelona being more modern and upscale.
Madrid was a big party! Both are nice, but quite different.
Well, out of the tolerable weather places in Europe, I think Spain and possibly the bottom half of France are the only options unless you have tons of money then you can live wherever you please. France has its own problems, Spain may be defaulting. I think the fear of this happening is declining now though unless I'm mistaken.
Frankfurt is ****. Berlin is much more diverse and better. Why do some Southern Germans always hate Berlin? It is the third-most visited city destination in Europe and it is much more popular worldwide than Southern German places like Frankfurt or Munich (totally boring and homogenous)
If you've never gone anywhere, how would you know? They may not be what you're looking for, but there's nothing wrong with either Frankfurt or Munich. People who know things are just trying to give you suggestions.
Ok, so despite my irritation at your ridiculous comment about Frankfurt & Munich (written from Canada, not Germany), I think you should make this move. Berlin might just break your heart when you find that what some people have described as diverse and colorful may not be exactly what you're planning on experiencing, and that you have to overlook a lot of gloom to see the gems. Nevertheless, it is definitely a city worth seeing, and if you have the option to do so long term, all the better. Good luck to you.
Berlin is a most existentially challenging place. Be sure to bring along plenty of rosy preconceptions and romantic optimism. They burn warm but quick. When these have been reduced to ashes you'll be left with just yourself and your wits, and if you're lucky you might find life in Berlin to be .01% ahead of a zero-sum game.
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Fantastic seafood, romantic music, warm people who speak a melodious language, excellent & cheap wine, deep culture, and beaches just like LA, but without the silicone. Paradise, right! 
Go for it
