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View Poll Results: Which of these E. European cities/countries is best?
Warsaw/Poland 4 19.05%
Krakow/Poland 10 47.62%
St. Petersburg/Russia 4 19.05%
Moscow/Russia 1 4.76%
Kiev/Ukraine 2 9.52%
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-13-2011, 09:28 PM
 
32 posts, read 295,326 times
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Hey everyone,
I am thinking about visiting some Eastern European countries in the future to decide if they would be suitable for me.
Based on YOUR experiences, wonderful city-data community, what cities/countries out of these choices are the best to emigrate to and find a job? I am looking for the best possible conditions in terms of economic growth, stability, and culture/food...

Here are my favorites...which one of these is the best to you?
Warsaw/Poland
Krakow/Poland
St. Petersburg/Russia
Moscow/Russia
Kiev/Ukraine

Thanks!
LeFlux90 (Jon)
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Old 06-13-2011, 09:49 PM
 
Location: Macao
15,988 posts, read 36,975,823 times
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Hmm..emigrate (which implies permament)? Without having been to them...and not knowing anything about the food and culture.

Sounds like a HUGE LEAP from having no knowledge whatsoever, to spending the rest of your life.

Not only that, but none of these countries have laws in place in take in immigrants. They aren't immigrant countries.

If you really wanted to go about something like that...best bet would be to travel around these places...try to see first hand what appeals to you. Learn the language, find a wife and get married. Once you marry into one of these cultures, than you might attain some rights.

But you can't just fly into them, become an immigrant and start work the next day.
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Old 06-13-2011, 10:06 PM
 
32 posts, read 295,326 times
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Tiger Beer -
Thanks, you're spot-on with all of that. I did give the impression that I was just going to fly over there and hop right in, which was incorrect of me.
I have some Polish heritage and can speak some Polish and Russian, but really no Ukrainian whatsoever.
Money allowing, I will visit at least one of these places this winter. I was hoping to get a community input to help steer where I would go, as I probably won't be able to visit each of these places within the next year or so.
So, I have SOME knowledge of the cultures, languages and foods, but no first-hand account as of yet.

Thanks for the response, your advice will probably be repeated by many others.

Jon
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Old 06-13-2011, 10:17 PM
 
Location: Macao
15,988 posts, read 36,975,823 times
Reputation: 9569
I've been to Russia and Hungary (but not Poland, and I was on the Siberia side of Russia).

Probably someone more knowledgeable will come along shortly.

But from my research of Poland, it sounds like Krakow is the beautiful city, and Warsaw is a more bland capital city much better for business, and not so pretty from what I've heard.

I've known people who've lived in Poland, and generally I hear they are super conservative - probably from Catholicism. Also heard the people are really into intellectualism, and just interesting people in general because of it.

I spent about ten days over in and around Vladivostok. Russian people have a lot of thuggish looking people! But certainly some interesting things about Russia as well.

Personally if I had Polish heritage and spoke a little Polish, and probably a strong sense of understanding the culture through ancestory and family members...I'd probably go with Poland myself.

I'd probably also go with Krakow as that city seems to be the most popular touristic city, and apparently quite beautiful. Warsaw, from what I've heard, is very cold, soviet-like, bland....or so I've read and heard.

Sorry, not first hand experience...but I'm sure someone else will come along shortly (hopefully) and give some direct experiences...
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Old 06-13-2011, 10:21 PM
 
Location: San Antonio/Houston/Tricity
40,392 posts, read 58,515,230 times
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What about work? Did you checked job market? Your destination will depend on that.
Also depends where are you from. Are you from EU? US?
Here some info and regulations:
:: Current Ways of Immigration to Poland
Poland: Visa and immigration | Prospects.ac.uk
Poland
Poland Visa for Travel, Business; Tourist Polish Visas

Will the Russian government let someone immigrate into their country? - Yahoo! Answers
Russia: Visa and immigration | Prospects.ac.uk
What Are Russia's Immigration Laws? | eHow.com
Russia to ease immigration rules to draw in specialists, investment | Russia | RIA Novosti
Good luck!
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Old 06-14-2011, 04:26 PM
 
32 posts, read 295,326 times
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Thanks again for your reply Tiger Beer - I am definitely leaning towards visiting Poland (Krakow in particular) this winter...it seems like the city has a lot of culture and its own atmosphere, as opposed to no atmosphere, which is really nice. What are some of the interesting things about Russia that you noticed while there?

Elnina, also THANK YOU very much for taking the time and effort to send me these links! I am looking into them all right now...I am from the US, and I have a background in Finance (although I have been doing Marketing for the last 2 years). I assume Warsaw is probably more of a Finance city than Krakow, but I don't know for sure.

Thanks so much for the great information! If anyone else has any Poland, Russia or Ukraine experience, I'd love to hear about it!

Jon
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Old 06-14-2011, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Yorkshire, England
5,599 posts, read 8,536,088 times
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I spent most of 2007 teaching English in a city not far from Krakow so know the city relatively well. I would recommend it. Apart from the old-world charm it has quite a young, cosmopolitan (by Polish standards!) population (it's home of the country's major university) and is more centrally located for travelling around central Europe and is close enough for day trips skiing, whereas Warsaw is relatively far from other major city and is on a big flat plain. Warsaw was largely rebuilt after the war (and it shows) whereas Krakow was largely untouched. It does get touristy in summer and at weekends, much more than Warsaw, but only because it's more worth seeing. Be warned - property/rental prices and the cost of living in general compared to local salaries are higher than you may be used to. Job opportunities for non-Polish speakers are of course limited.

But are you sure you'd be eligible to live there in the first place? Most Americans in Poland are either English teachers (and then they prefer to employ Brits/Irish as we don't need a visa) or get transferred over from the States with their company who they started out with back home.
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Old 06-14-2011, 06:29 PM
 
15,879 posts, read 14,278,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeFlux90 View Post
Thanks again for your reply Tiger Beer - I am definitely leaning towards visiting Poland (Krakow in particular) this winter...it seems like the city has a lot of culture and its own atmosphere, as opposed to no atmosphere, which is really nice. What are some of the interesting things about Russia that you noticed while there?

Elnina, also THANK YOU very much for taking the time and effort to send me these links! I am looking into them all right now...I am from the US, and I have a background in Finance (although I have been doing Marketing for the last 2 years). I assume Warsaw is probably more of a Finance city than Krakow, but I don't know for sure.

Thanks so much for the great information! If anyone else has any Poland, Russia or Ukraine experience, I'd love to hear about it!

Jon
Finance? Marketing?
I'd say no matter what you do, my advise would be to stay away from Russia at this point in time ( Moscow or St. Pet - doesn't matter.)
The country is not really politically all that stable, it's ridden with corruption and although it's true that many Westerners made millions and billions over there (so the place might look attractive) at the end I suspect it will not end up well.
If you haven't heard yet of this particular case, it might be food for a thought for you.
( Not that I am saying that you'll be necessarily involved into something like this, but it's...yes, food for a thought.)


YouTube - ‪Hermitage Reveals Russian Police Fraud‬‏


YouTube - ‪Russian Untouchables. Episode 1: Artem Kuznetsov‬‏

Last edited by erasure; 06-14-2011 at 06:57 PM..
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Old 06-14-2011, 08:23 PM
 
32 posts, read 295,326 times
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Ben - Thank you very much for the information on Krakow! It sounds like a great place to visit. This just confirms my plans. I also do not know if I am "eligible" to live and work there...the living thing I will find out, but working, perhaps you are right. I will see what I can do, but the common phrase "if there's a will, there's a way!" comes to mind. I think if I try enough avenues, I will find something, which very well could be an American company with an office in Poland.

Erasure - I have heard of these kinds of things on the internet, in movies, etc...I was foolishly hoping that maybe they only took place in Moscow. This video shows me that I'm wrong, and that even the highest levels (as everyone knows, Medvedev is President now!) of Russian government are corrupt. This is insane. Thank you VERY MUCH for the heads up on these things, and I like to live life on the non-criminal side of things. I will avoid Russia until they smooth out their business issues.

Thanks everyone for such useful information. Looking forward to hearing more personal experiences if anyone cares to share!

Jon
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Old 06-14-2011, 09:27 PM
 
Location: Macao
15,988 posts, read 36,975,823 times
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Having spent some time in Vladivostok and Siberia. I certainly enjoyed it, but was glad to go. There was always an uncertain uneasiness with a lot of the Russian people. They always felt so volitile. Like anything could happen, and trigger some bad reaction. Partly because alcholism and drinking are to such chronic levels.

Certainly some people might be attracted to that, or deal with it anyways.

But the Polish people I've met, have always been interesting. I'm sure there is drinking and other things, but for some reason I don't imagine you'd have as many thuggist looking prone-to-violence looking people as in Russia...

Also, when I was in Russia, you have to register your hotels, and difficult to get visas. It is NOT a cheap country by any means. Prices for everything there are sky high. However, at least over in Vladivostok, I don't think the city warranted those kind of high prices. Things are expensive here in Japan, but you have immense modernism, safety, security, world class everything. Prices were the same in Vladivostok, but you get none of that anywhere, at least not there.

I've heard Ukraine is a good place for people who want a similar Russian experience, but not full-on, and with much better laws, and easier to get a tourist visa, without the constant hotel checks and registrations and everything else.

But, if it were me, and I had Polish blood, I'd definitely go with Poland and see what it's all about.
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