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Not sure if "Centralized" is the right word. I am not talking about politically left or right, but the fact that in some countries populaion, wealth and culture is high concentrated in one city.
France is a perfect example. Basically when people talk about France, they are thinking about Paris primarily. The paris metro has 12 million people, or 20% of the country. The second city Lyon has less than 2 million. Paris has everything, politically, economically and culturally. There are some other cities but they are all significantly smaller.
London is another one, but probably not as bad as France.
I was wondering is this the best way to run a country? Wouldn't it be healthier if 2 or 3 cities compete against each other? Spain has Madrid and Barcelona, Italy has Rome and Milan, Germany has Berlin, Hamburg, Munich, even a relatively small Canada has Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver.
In the US, NYC is a giant, but it is no bigger than 2X of Los Angeles. Other big countries such as China, Japan, Brazil and India all have multiple centers.
The risk of countries with such levels of centralism is that if something happens to the No1 city, for example, a natural disaster or a military conquer, it is like game over.
The question is, does France want to encourage the growth elsewhere and give some more balance of power, or they just prefer an ever bigger and more powerful Paris? I myself would prefer something like Canada, which three major metropolis competing, each with its own characteristics.
Last edited by botticelli; 08-24-2012 at 02:41 PM..
France is indeed very centralized around Paris, but decentralization has been in effect for at least the past 30 years so the various regions are autonomous, just like in Spain or Germany.
I'd argue that Britain is by far the most 'centralist' country in Europe, with a significant population (I'm sure places like Finland and Norway are more centralist considering their small size).
London dominates absolutely everything. It is a city of of over 10 million in the metro area compared to only around 2 million in the next largest metro (Birmingham). It alone contributes around 25% of the national economy and 22% of the population (26% of England's population). It is the hub of media, politics, finance, sport, tourism, education - everything. It was chosen as the Olympics over anywhere else because nowhere else can even be considered.
Right now, the skyline of London is studded with cranes, it is a world apart from the provinces, there's no recession there, it is often given preference by the government and private companies at the expense of everywhere else, even when it is not needed (does an affluent city like London which has a high level of autonomy and power already to spend money on whatever it wants, really need money from the government thrown at it?).
Now Londoners may argue that a lot of council tax raised in London goes to the provinces, but if the provinces had the same level of autonomy and freedom that London enjoys it would not be needed, at least not in such large quantities. The current government is making progress but more is needed. Places in the north of England that were once dominated by heavy industry have lost almost everything - they were expected to replace this industry with finance, business, and other general service sector jobs. It didn't happen. The skills are not there. These places are losing people to London, which in turn receives even more money and investment - it's a vicious circle. As for the government wanting to encourage growth elsewhere, not sure about France, but the current Govt is trying to 're-balance' the economy away from London and the financial sector on the whole. A work in progress I suppose.
London is a great city, anyone will agree with that statement, but when you're living in the UK, in a provincial city, you can't help but feel a level of resentment towards the place (not to the people I might add). We just want recognition too. Sadly though I fear the damage has already been done, London has allowed to become disproportionately large compared to the rest of Britain, the provincials have endured a long decline from the glory days of the empire when they were amongst the words most prestigious cities and amongst the largest. For the foreseeable, London will dominate everything.
Last edited by dunno what to put here; 08-24-2012 at 07:40 PM..
The most centralist goverments were imposed first by the Bourbons, and then by the French Revolution and of course, by Napoleon.
The absolutist, centralist and authoritarian model represented by Louis XIV was represented in England by Charles II, beaheaded by Cromwell....But I believe that Cromwell was fiercely centralist too, not sure.
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I wonder if a lot of the focus on London has been to make it the pre-eminent global centre of finance, culture.etc, in a bid to compete with NY and Paris? It is a pity that a lot of industry, talent, skills.etc is being drawn away from the other major cities like Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester, Liverpool, Briston (especially Birmingham), Glasgow, Edinburgh just to prop up London even more. For such a small country (geographically speaking) Greater London utterly dominates the southern part of England. It makes a sizable footprint on a map of the UK!
Moscow dominates absolutely everything. It is a city of of over 10 million in the metro area compared to only around 4 million in the next largest metro (St. Petersburg"). It is the hub of media, politics, finance, sport, tourism, education - everything.
Right now, the skyline of Moscow is studded with cranes, it is a world apart from the provinces, there's no recession there, it is often given preference by the government and private companies at the expense of everywhere else
Hilarious, really ( I just don't remember the exact figures of Moscow's economy comparably to the rest of the country, so I've left it out,) otherwise I had to change only the names of the cities.
Probably the whole Europe is actually "centralist" except for may be Germany, that was united only at the end of the 19th century to begin with...
Hilarious, really ( I just don't remember the exact figures of Moscow's economy comparably to the rest of the country, so I've left it out,) otherwise I had to change only the names of the cities.
Probably the whole Europe is actually "centralist" except for may be Germany, that was united only at the end of the 19th century to begin with...
Spain is not that centralist. Power is divided between Barcelona and Madrid, and in some regions (not only Basque country and Catalunya) the government of the region has the same capacity for decision than the central government, moreover, the decision of the regional government prevails over the national government.
I don't think any other country is quite as bad as the UK though, although France gives it a good run for its money.
You're right though, most countries in Europe are centralist, but few have the population or the density of the UK, which makes it even more unique, especially when countries smaller than it (population-wise), such as Canada and Aus, have many important centres that dominate.
Last edited by dunno what to put here; 08-26-2012 at 02:20 AM..
Quebec, Catalonia, Basque country, Brittany, Corsica, "Padania" and Scotland will never be independent nations. They can make 100 polls if they want, they will loose.
Quebec, Catalonia, Basque country, Brittany, Corsica, "Padania" and Scotland will never be independent nations. They can make 100 polls if they want, they will loose.
I never said they would. Most of the ones on your list probably never will. But Quebec, Catalonia and Scotland... might. Probably not, but one never knows.
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