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Old 02-06-2015, 09:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easthome View Post
But that doesn't answer the question why she is different to her sister, and in fact my skin 'tone' is different from my sisters when we have identical family histories? I'm sorry your reasoning is flawed, its perhaps the way people thought in the UK 100 years ago!
Juilia is talking about native populations in Europe, not interracial.

 
Old 02-06-2015, 09:32 AM
 
Location: SE UK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waviking24 View Post
Juilia is talking about native populations in Europe, not interracial.
Me and my sister are 'native to Europe'?
 
Old 02-06-2015, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Florence/Prato 43,49 N
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There is variation on brother and sisters of course even innoigmentatio'

I m dark brown haired; my brother is black haired (shiny black hair)
I have medium brown eyes; my brother has lighter chestnut brown eyes
I have a bit of a convex nose; my brother has a straight nose
Skin pigmentation we are even.

Yes there is variation. But I was talking about adaptive mutations
 
Old 02-06-2015, 11:15 AM
 
4,690 posts, read 8,589,642 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easthome View Post
The 'darkest' skinned member of my family is my youngest daughter, she has the same skin colour as say Denzil Washington, after living her whole life at 50 degrees North it doesn't seem to have affected her 'colour' in any way! Also she has darker skin than her own sister. Like people have repeatedly tried to tell you, it has everything to do with genetics and nothing to do with 'where you live'
Do you even have a clue of what's been discussed? By the way, man did not change their skin overnight! It took many thousands of years for things such skin color, eye color or eye shape or body build to change. Eventually people who are dark-skinned will lighten if they live in more northern latitute especially in primitive conditions. The body does this to accomodate in the climate. At one time, the vast majority of humans were dark-skinned as they move into colder areas, they progressively change until they became as light as the people of Europe. Sexual selection might have played a role, in where light-skinned women were found more appealing than dark-skinned ones since they were scarce and so forth. Denzel Washington ancestors most hailed from West African people who were brought as slaves to America. On an evolutionary scale, the time he spent at the "50 degrees North" is too small compared to the time his ancestors spent enduring the African sun, so would too small for a great change to happen. However African-American are on average lighter-skinned than their African counterparts living in the lands where their ancestors came from. To a white person as you or me, Denzel just look black, but if you take a land like South Sudan or northern Uganda, you will see that he's much lighter-skinned than the average native Africans of those lands who spent more time in the sun. So yeah, the difference happens, but is very gradual.

A South Sudan official
http://www.ctvnews.ca/polopoly_fs/1...._960/image.jpg

http://www.ifacecover.com/thumbs/den...ington_-t2.jpg

Last edited by Rozenn; 02-11-2015 at 11:10 AM.. Reason: Copyright issues
 
Old 02-06-2015, 11:24 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by julia90 View Post
I wider how blonde people similar looking to northern euopean arrived in Europe; if genes rom ancient migrations from up north.. Or local adaption.

All we can say..observing far people like Japanese whose country range from 43 to 33 latitude is that they all have skin type III more or less, but still black hair.. And not the dark brown majority commonest in Southern Europe..and still found in Middle East and North Africa.
Good question! Eskimos, Mongoloids who also live at very northerly latitude underwent a different evolution due to their climate there. Their skin had no need to get any lighter than type III usually due to the fact that their diet which was extremely rich in Vitamin D and their hair and eyes pigmentation is predominantly darker than Europeans. So that's where the balance comes from. The need for a lighter skin tone is linked to a demand of faster absorption of Vitamin D in colder weather. The first hunter-gatherer of Europe were as white as we are, due to the fact their diet was richer in Vitamin D, this change when was agriculture was introduced from the Middle-East. This gave rise to the mutation of lighter skin, hair and eyes. This however took a very long time, did not happen all of a sudden, other factors also helped it.
 
Old 02-06-2015, 11:34 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by julia90 View Post
But if we look at georgians they all have mostly skin type III and dark brown hair like us
Georgians are similar to you Italians, but they are East Mediterraneans. They are over-all darker-pigmented than the Italians. Though in both Georgia and Italy, the Mediterranean genetical component is predominant. According to the National Geographic Genographic Project, the Mediterranean genetical component in the Georgian population is 61% higher than that of Italy (54%) with the exception of Sardinia (67%!).

By the way in Italy, skin type III is only slightly more frequent than skin type IV, not 60% as you suggested.

Italianos skin type frequency:

I + II - 10.3%
III - 45.8%
IV - 44.5%

France

I - 11.6%
II - 25.7%
III - 30.9%
IV - 31.8%

Last edited by saxonwold; 02-06-2015 at 11:46 AM..
 
Old 02-06-2015, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Florence/Prato 43,49 N
663 posts, read 719,038 times
Reputation: 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxonwold View Post
Do you even have a clue of what's been discussed? By the way, man did not change their skin overnight! It took many thousands of years for things such skin color, eye color or eye shape or body build to change. Eventually people who are dark-skinned will lighten if they live in more northern latitute especially in primitive conditions. The body does this to accomodate in the climate. At one time, the vast majority of humans were dark-skinned as they move into colder areas, they progressively change until they became as light as the people of Europe. Sexual selection might have played a role, in where light-skinned women were found more appealing than dark-skinned ones since they were scarce and so forth. Denzel Washington ancestors most hailed from West African people who were brought as slaves to America. On an evolutionary scale, the time he spent at the "50 degrees North" is too small compared to the time his ancestors spent enduring the African sun, so would too small for a great change to happen. However African-American are on average lighter-skinned than their African counterparts living in the lands where their ancestors came from. To a white person as you or me, Denzel just look black, but if you take a land like South Sudan or northern Uganda, you will see that he's much lighter-skinned than the average native Africans of those lands who spent more time in the sun. So yeah, the difference happens, but is very gradual.

A South Sudan official

Exatly that was all I wanted to say.. Denzel is a men..and probably he doesn't use depigmented creams..as he is a man..

Well that Ugandan man..is one of the darkest in Africa however.
But yes..Denzel is much more lighter skinned than his African counterparts. (I don't think white admixture pays much in his case).

Also people in USA don't live at 50 latitude..at much lover latitude ..at most 45-40
And USA do gets more solar irradiance than Europe..the solar irradiance of my region in Italy is the less intense in USA for example. It s the same solar irradiance as the north esteem part of usa
 
Old 02-06-2015, 12:45 PM
 
Location: Florence/Prato 43,49 N
663 posts, read 719,038 times
Reputation: 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxonwold View Post
Good question! Eskimos, Mongoloids who also live at very northerly latitude underwent a different evolution due to their climate there. Their skin had no need to get any lighter than type III usually due to the fact that their diet which was extremely rich in Vitamin D and their hair and eyes pigmentation is predominantly darker than Europeans. So that's where the balance comes from. The need for a lighter skin tone is linked to a demand of faster absorption of Vitamin D in colder weather. The first hunter-gatherer of Europe were as white as we are, due to the fact their diet was richer in Vitamin D, this change when was agriculture was introduced from the Middle-East. This gave rise to the mutation of lighter skin, hair and eyes. This however took a very long time, did not happen all of a sudden, other factors also helped it.
Mongoloid people included Amerindians..all descend from Eskimo like people.

Solar irradiance in a constant ice environments is huge in summer..as ice doesn't melt..but ice reflect greatly Sundays..this montoloids people have darker III skin type and black resistant hair to protect the to summer irradiation on ice.

But we have to observe Japanese.. Still not adapted..but going on the adaption.. They don't live in an ice place..and they live In a place the same latitude from Tuscany to Palestine..but their solar irradiance is like in northern Italy instead.

Still dark brown hair don't have made an appearance. While you find dark brown hair in Middle East and North Africa.

Also why mongoloids people don't differentiated much between them.. Apart those living in kore southern latitude than those living in japan.. Because of a huge founded effect..all descend from an omogeneous population not much varied in Its inside..and Then they espanded and moltiplicated rapidly..and hugely..but characters are not greatly varied among them. Like those in Central Europe or Southern Europe too that instead are quite varied

Last edited by julia90; 02-06-2015 at 12:56 PM..
 
Old 02-06-2015, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Florence/Prato 43,49 N
663 posts, read 719,038 times
Reputation: 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxonwold View Post
Georgians are similar to you Italians, but they are East Mediterraneans. They are over-all darker-pigmented than the Italians. Though in both Georgia and Italy, the Mediterranean genetical component is predominant. According to the National Geographic Genographic Project, the Mediterranean genetical component in the Georgian population is 61% higher than that of Italy (54%) with the exception of Sardinia (67%!).

By the way in Italy, skin type III is only slightly more frequent than skin type IV, not 60% as you suggested.

Italianos skin type frequency:

I + II - 10.3%
III - 45.8%
IV - 44.5%

France

I - 11.6%
II - 25.7%
III - 30.9%
IV - 31.8%
Pigmentation wise they are similar to us, with people majority dark brown hair like us..and skin type more on the III type
 
Old 02-06-2015, 12:50 PM
 
Location: Florence/Prato 43,49 N
663 posts, read 719,038 times
Reputation: 176
Evolution wise..I read an article..still after 1.000 you can find pigmentation not much changed for evolution.. But pasted more or less those years.. It changes..expecially skin color..that is the first thing to change.

But it seems to me 1000 years are too much. Another study saied that the third generation of immigrant babies in uk (those unmixed) was a bit more fairer than the first generation
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