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Old 07-30-2018, 12:29 PM
DKM
 
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
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Vladivostok, like most of Russia, is Asiatic. Whether that means "Asian" or not, the presence of Asian influence in Russia exists. You can argue what defines Asian and whether or not Vladivostok fits in that definition all you want. The answer is, its both Asian and European.
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Old 07-30-2018, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Seattle WA, USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
Vladivostok, like most of Russia, is Asiatic. Whether that means "Asian" or not, the presence of Asian influence in Russia exists. You can argue what defines Asian and whether or not Vladivostok fits in that definition all you want. The answer is, its both Asian and European.
When people say Asian, at least in the US, they think of East Asians, or in the broadest sense of what I call Buddhist Asia.



So yes Vladivostok, and much of Russia is Asian, but for the most part they don't fit the definition of what people think of when they hear "Asian", instead it is North Asian or perhaps ruso-Asian, similar to how there is a an Anglo-American as opposed to Latin-American
.
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:01 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
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Originally Posted by grega94 View Post
When people say Asian, at least in the US, they think of East Asians, or in the broadest sense of what I call Buddhist Asia.



So yes Vladivostok, and much of Russia is Asian, but for the most part they don't fit the definition of what people think of when they hear "Asian", instead it is North Asian or perhaps ruso-Asian, similar to how there is a an Anglo-American as opposed to Latin-American
.
Khabarovsk is full of Manchus, though. Vladivostok has fewer of them--mainly Udege. And the Manchus (and various related tribes) converted to Buddhism, which is what motivated them to re-name themselves "Manchu", in the first place, after Manjusri, one of a number of Buddhas. Before that, they were called Jurchens. Your map included Chinese Manchuria, but not Russian Manchuria.
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Old 07-30-2018, 06:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Khabarovsk is full of Manchus, though. Vladivostok has fewer of them--mainly Udege. And the Manchus (and various related tribes) converted to Buddhism, which is what motivated them to re-name themselves "Manchu", in the first place, after Manjusri, one of a number of Buddhas. Before that, they were called Jurchens. Your map included Chinese Manchuria, but not Russian Manchuria.
I have no idea Ruth...
I don't understand in all these ethnic groups you mention, but these are statistics for Khabarovsk region;

"According to the 2010 Census,[8] 91.8% of the population are Russians, 2.1% Ukrainians, 0.8% Nanais, 0.6% Tatars, 0.6% Koreans, and 0.4% Belarusians. 55,038 people were registered from administrative databases, and could not declare an ethnicity. It is estimated that the proportion of ethnicities in this group is the same as that of the declared group.[21]

In addition to the Nanai, other indigenous groups include the Evenks and Evens in the northern part of the province, and Ulchs in the lower Amur river (Ulchsky District). Some Nivkhs (Gilyak), an indigenous fishing people speaking an isolate language, live around the Amur river delta as well. Smaller groups indigenous to the area are Negidals (567), Orochs (686), and Udege (1,657) and Taz people (3) according to the 2002 census."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khabarovsk_Krai
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Old 07-30-2018, 06:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by DKM View Post
Vladivostok, like most of Russia, is Asiatic. Whether that means "Asian" or not, the presence of Asian influence in Russia exists. You can argue what defines Asian and whether or not Vladivostok fits in that definition all you want. The answer is, its both Asian and European.

Russian *influence* ( or to put it bluntly Russian dominance) overrides any "Asiatic influence," that Ukrainian propaganda so desperately tries to ascribe to Russians.
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Old 07-30-2018, 07:44 PM
 
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If Vladivostock is a European city, what about Kalmykia, which is located in Europe and mostly Buddhist? Are the people of Kalmykia Europeans?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2y_BOlZKhs&t=418s
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Old 07-30-2018, 08:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
If Vladivostock is a European city, what about Kalmykia, which is located in Europe and mostly Buddhist? Are the people of Kalmykia Europeans?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2y_BOlZKhs&t=418s
You probably still didn't understand it.
The indigenous people living in Siberia/Asian part of Russia ARE NOT of European descent.
And the majority of them were tribal/pastoral people, which means no cities were built by them to begin with.
When Russians moved in, they were the ones who built the cities and moved in them ( with part of ethnic population moving in those cities too.) But since those cities we've discussed earlier were built by Russians and they are inhabited mostly by Russians, they ( Vladivostok and Khabarovsk) still have the European feel to them. ( What happens elsewhere in the region, how "European" or not it feels, it's a different story.)
So when you are talking about "Kalmykia," then we have to talk about the capital of it first of all - the city of Elista, putting it in the context of other cities - Vladivostok and Khabarovsk.
Judging by the look of it - no, it doesn't have a "Russian" ( or European) look to it at all. (If anything, it reminds me of Central Asia of Soviet times.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR56Nx36RX8

But it's no surprise, if we'll look at ethnic composition of Elista, which is 68 303 (65,8 %) of kalmyks, VS 25 931 (25,0 %) of Russians.
This is a big switch comparably to 1939, when this city was initially built by Russians - 13 074 (76,3 %) of Russians lived there, VS 3 494 (20,4 %) of Kalmyks.

"In November 1920, Elista became the administrative center of Kalmyk Autonomous Oblast. By the early 1930s, Elista was transformed into a small city as the collectivization policies of Joseph Stalin forced many Kalmyks to abandon their traditional pastoral nomadic lifestyle in exchange for a modern, sedentary, and urban lifestyle. In October 1935, Elista was recognized as the capital of the Kalmyk ASSR. In late 1942, the city was briefly occupied by the German army. Because of alleged collaboration between the ethnic Kalmyks and the Germans, on December 27, 1943, the Kalmyk ASSR was dissolved and its ethnic Kalmyk residents were forcibly exiled to Siberia. Russian people were brought in to repopulate Elista whose name was changed to Stepnoy (Степно́й). It was called Stepnoy until 1957, when the survivors of the deportations were allowed to return from exile."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elista

Hope this helps.
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Old 07-30-2018, 09:08 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
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Originally Posted by grega94 View Post
What does economics and politics have to do with categorizing a place as European or not? Is Moldova not European because it's a poor country or is Belarus not European because it's only had one president for the past 28 years?

Anyway Vladivostok architecturally and demographically looks very European

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1176...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1166...thumbfov%3D100

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1168...thumbfov%3D100

but then I suppose the same can be said about new world cities such as Quebec.

https://www.google.com/maps/@46.8132...thumbfov%3D100

https://www.google.com/maps/@46.8145...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@46.8106...thumbfov%3D100

Also Vladivostok is very close to east Asia, which is why it's considered as a gateway, if an Asian person wants to experience a bit of Europe, but doesn't have the money or time to go and fly to Europe they can spend a weekend in Vladivostok. Just like many Americans considered Quebec to be a cheaper alternative to Europe.
I'm not saying it's not European, it's just not a gateway.

Western Europe is a huge economy, so is Asia. This is exactly the reason why there's tons of trade in between. Had Africa be a prosperous land, Asia would be eager to do business with them. Business isn't dating, race/culture/language isn't important, business people follow where the money and opportunities are.

When it comes to tourism, yes, there are a few people who just want to experience Europe, or America or whatsoever. But most people have more specific interests. Why is Oklahoma totally unknown to international travelers? Being American enough doesn't make it an attractive destination. An Asian traveler who wants to visit Disneyland, Big Sur in Cali, MET, Broadway in NYC, beaches in Hawaii, Yellowstone in Wyoming probably has zero interest in Nebraska.

For instance, I love great weather, delicious food, safe streets, high-quality living at a reasonable price so Spain fits my bill. Vladivostok, like most of Russia, doesn't meet my expectations even remotely. However, Japan is a little bit pricey, but everything else is just perfect.
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Old 07-30-2018, 09:30 PM
 
234 posts, read 90,913 times
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Originally Posted by erasure View Post
You probably still didn't understand it.
The indigenous people living in Siberia/Asian part of Russia ARE NOT of European descent.
And the majority of them were tribal/pastoral people, which means no cities were built by them to begin with.
When Russians moved in, they were the ones who built the cities and moved in them ( with part of ethnic population moving in those cities too.) But since those cities we've discussed earlier were built by Russians and they are inhabited mostly by Russians, they ( Vladivostok and Khabarovsk) still have the European feel to them. ( What happens elsewhere in the region, how "European" or not it feels, it's a different story.)
So when you are talking about "Kalmykia," then we have to talk about the capital of it first of all - the city of Elista, putting it in the context of other cities - Vladivostok and Khabarovsk.
Judging by the look of it - no, it doesn't have a "Russian" ( or European) look to it at all. (If anything, it reminds me of Central Asia of Soviet times.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR56Nx36RX8

But it's no surprise, if we'll look at ethnic composition of Elista, which is 68 303 (65,8 %) of kalmyks, VS 25 931 (25,0 %) of Russians.
This is a big switch comparably to 1939, when this city was initially built by Russians - 13 074 (76,3 %) of Russians lived there, VS 3 494 (20,4 %) of Kalmyks.

"In November 1920, Elista became the administrative center of Kalmyk Autonomous Oblast. By the early 1930s, Elista was transformed into a small city as the collectivization policies of Joseph Stalin forced many Kalmyks to abandon their traditional pastoral nomadic lifestyle in exchange for a modern, sedentary, and urban lifestyle. In October 1935, Elista was recognized as the capital of the Kalmyk ASSR. In late 1942, the city was briefly occupied by the German army. Because of alleged collaboration between the ethnic Kalmyks and the Germans, on December 27, 1943, the Kalmyk ASSR was dissolved and its ethnic Kalmyk residents were forcibly exiled to Siberia. Russian people were brought in to repopulate Elista whose name was changed to Stepnoy (Степно́й). It was called Stepnoy until 1957, when the survivors of the deportations were allowed to return from exile."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elista

Hope this helps.
I see that most of the people seem to follow a Tibetian form of Buddhism. Is there an interest by Ethnic Russians following it such as having Tibetian prayer flags outside their home or go to Buddhist retreats, or convert to Tibetian Buddhism? Here in the West, it not unusual for Westerners to have an interest in it and seeing Tibetian prayer flags outside their home, going to Buddhist retreats and even converting to it.

Last edited by herenow1; 07-30-2018 at 09:40 PM..
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Old 07-30-2018, 09:45 PM
 
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Originally Posted by herenow1 View Post
I see that most of the people seem to follow a Tibetian form of Buddhism. Is there an interest by Ethnic Russians to follow such as having Tibetian prayer flags outside their home or go to Buddhist retreats, or convert to Tibetian Buddhism? Here in the West, it not unusual for Westerners to have an interest in it and seeing Tibetian prayer flags outside their home, going to Buddhist retreats and even converting to it.
I am not sure about the "Tibetian prayer flags outside their homes," but if I google "Buddhisms in Russia" - it's definitely not unheard of. There are groups of followers in Vk ( Russians version of FB,) there are forums, there are articles.
So I guess Russians are no different from the Westerners - they are looking for different sources of spirituality as well.
Some turn to Islam, some turn to Buddhism, some turn to paganism.
The latter one is probably more visible, as much as followers of Krishna)))
But I wouldn't know the percentage of either one.
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