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If you claim that there is no "objectivity for humans", then you disqualify the truth value of everything you've said so far. Factual claims would become impossible, reason would become an exercise in solipsism and science and philosophy would grind to a halt.
Do you really not understand what I'm saying, or are you just pretending not to understand? Maybe you are just silly.
There is no truth value when it comes to perception, especially safety.
Last edited by Minato ku; 07-13-2016 at 04:14 PM..
Do you really not understand what I'm saying, or are you just pretending not to understand? Maybe you are just silly.
There is no truth value when it comes to perception, especially safety.
It's clear what you're saying. Unfortunately, what you're saying is demonstrably wrong.
You can read why you're wrong here, because, as the user above mentions, this is diverging into philosophy rather than to do with crime and safety, and we can keep the rest of the thread on-topic.
The fallacy applies only to objective facts, or what are alleged to be objective facts, rather than to facts about personal tastes or subjective experiences, and only to facts regarded in the same sense and at the same time
This discussion was about personal tastes or subjective experiences, not objective facts.
In no way, this could be a relativist fallacy.
Stop trying to present subjective experiences as a fact.
Crime and safety perception, if they are not based on actual crime stats, are subjective.
So, there is no "truth value" about it.
But in all seriousness we should be celebrating the undeniable fact that all three cities are among the most amazing places the world has to offer, albeit for different reasons! Come on, how about some positives!!
This discussion was about personal tastes or subjective experiences, not objective facts.
In no way, this could be a relativist fallacy.
Stop trying to present subjective experiences as a fact.
Crime and safety perception, if they are not based on actual crime stats, are subjective.
So, there is no "truth value" about it.
You're confusing and mixing up three separate things:
1. The difference between real world (objective) observation and qualia (purely subjective experience).
2. The difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.
3. The difference between statements of opinion and statements of fact.
"Neighborhood A is dangerous and unsafe for tourists" is a statement of fact. It is related to objective observation of the real world. "I feel safe in neighborhood A", or "I prefer neighborhood A to neighborhood B for safety" are statements of opinion. They are related to subjective experiences. This doesn't exclude the possibility that statements of fact and opinion can be misused.
Anecdotal evidence like the cab driver's testimony may stem from either qualia or objective observation or both. Anecdotal evidence can be formal, as in a scientific case study or police report, or informal, as in hearsay or rumor. Here, the presumption is that his testimony is accurate, so this quibbling over subjectivism is irrelevant, unless you directly challenge those assumptions.
But in all seriousness we should be celebrating the undeniable fact that all three cities are among the most amazing places the world has to offer, albeit for different reasons! Come on, how about some positives!!
"Les Banlieues" in google image search brings up something much worse. However, what we're probably looking at are the very worst examples of those areas. The truth probably lies somewhere between this and the more optimistic snapshots shown above.
Last edited by CTDominion; 07-14-2016 at 01:09 AM..
"Les Banlieues" in google image search brings up something much worse. However, what we're probably looking at are the very worst examples of those areas. The truth probably lies somewhere between this and the more optimistic snapshots shown above.
Note that this housing estates has been demolished long time ago.
Google image just shows you stereotypes as presented by the media.
The reality is that housing block estates are a minority of the housing in Paris suburbs, you just have to get a look on Google street view.
Why are there so few images of single familly houses when they clearly dominate most of Paris suburbs when you search "banlieue" on Google image?
Maybe because Google Image doesn't show you an accurate view of the reality, just like all the links posted by Brave New World.
Drancy (among the worst suburbs of Paris)
The reality is that crime rate is in average lower in Paris suburbs than in the City of Paris
Quote:
Number of Homicide in Ile de France: 160 (162 in 2010)
Murder rate per 100,000 : 1.36
Number of homicide by departements in Ile de France
City of Paris: 42
Seine Saint Denis: 33
Val d'Oise: 17
Hauts de Seine: 17
Yvelines: 16
Val de Marne: 15
Essonne: 11
Seine et Marne: 8
Murder rate per 100,000
Seine Saint Denis: 2.18
City of Paris: 1.88
Val d'Oise: 1.45
Yvelines: 1.14
Val de Marne: 1.14
Hauts de Seine: 1.09
Essonne: 0.91
Seine et Marne: 0.69
Paris suburbs are home to over 8 million inhabitants, the overwhelming majority of them are nice peaceful middle class communities.
Some of them are very wealthy area, some other are poorer.
You can't stereotype them with one picture.
I'm pretty sure working class Parisien suburbs aren't anywhere near as bad as some of the scare stories. That is, in fact, why I'm surprised by very negative accounts given by visitors. All I have to base my opinion on so far are these testimonies.
What visitors ? A real visitor or a journalist who want to make make a sensationalist article or even worse a biased article against Paris.
Because most visitors (I have meet) have been surprisingly surprised by those suburbs and how media depiction was exaggerated and nowhere close to the daily life reality.
What visitors ? A real visitor or a journalist who want to make make a sensationalist article or even worse a biased article against Paris.
Because most visitors (I have meet) have been surprisingly surprised by those suburbs and how media depiction was exaggerated and nowhere close to the daily life reality.
Feel free to disagree with her story. As far as I'm concerned her personal experience is still relevant.
I'll come to my own conclusions about Les Banlieues if I ever get a chance to visit.
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