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Old 05-05-2013, 12:55 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
2,866 posts, read 5,243,291 times
Reputation: 3425

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
True. But, as in my case, you don't necessarily need a car. If I would be donated a used car, I wouldn't accept it. I don't want to pay for expensive insurance, gasoline and maintenance. Actually, I saw an ad where there was a Fiat for sale for 1€.

I use my legs, it's free and good for you.

And yes, one reason why gas is expensive is that governments and cities dont wan't you to use a car, but use public transport.
Same here, I don't even have a driver's license. Why would I get a car if I can use public transport for free as a student?

Btw, OneLess, you said in the OP that it's rare for Europeans to own a car so why is expensive gasoline and limited parking space a problem?

 
Old 05-05-2013, 12:58 PM
 
Location: Finland
6,418 posts, read 7,250,361 times
Reputation: 10440
I'm unlucky enough to live in a rare town in Finland that you actually need a car but I don't drive. Sucks to be me.
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:04 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,745,361 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by LindavG View Post
Same here, I don't even have a driver's license. Why would I get a car if I can use public transport for free as a student?

Btw, OneLess, you said in the OP that it's rare for Europeans to own a car so why is expensive gasoline and limited parking space a problem?
That is another unfounded claim. The difference is not that big, unfortunately:

List of countries by vehicles per capita - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,808,159 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Me too, I don't even have a driver's license Walking to and from the shopping center for an hour and a half keeps me fit
I read an article recently that less than 50% of people aged 18-21 in Helsinki decide to get a driver's licence. I don't want to start a debate on cars vs public transport, just mentioning that both the need for a car and the attitude is so different in Europe, and we can have high gas prices without people storming the parliament.

Also, most cities in the US are designed for cars, while most cities in Europe are designed for walking and horses. Having a car is many times inconvenient. The traffic jams are terrible, it's difficult to find parking space, streets are narrow and so on.

If I keep a quick pace while biking, I often get from place A to B faster than with a car. I can avoid traffic lights, don't have to sit in traffic jams, and I can take shortcuts. Damn, if I'm feeling frisky, I can even carry the bike across ditches and lawns, taking even more shortcuts. And I live in one of the more car friendly countries in Europe, as this is a large country with a small population.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LindavG View Post
Same here, I don't even have a driver's license. Why would I get a car if I can use public transport for free as a student?
For FREE? What communist country that hates liberty is that?!
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:16 PM
 
286 posts, read 331,637 times
Reputation: 219
My brother in law recently purchased a $900 pedestrian bike
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:18 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,745,361 times
Reputation: 9728
I suppose in countries like the US where there is a huge car industry, there is no interest in hurting that, anyway. The German automaker lobby is also influencing politics (environment, transportation infrastructure, especially railroads, etc.) in certain ways, to put it mildly. In the US you have to add the giant petro companies' influence.
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:23 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
2,866 posts, read 5,243,291 times
Reputation: 3425
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Yes, but it is similar in Germany and other European countries. Most people live in cities, while large areas are sparsely populated. Some of those areas are used for agriculture, others not used for anything really.
I remember passing through the Netherlands on train. Although that country has one of the highest population densities in the world, there are vast empty areas, which surprised me back then.

Currently I live in the Alentejo region of Portugal. While all of Portugal is a high-density country according to your map, this region (which makes up almost the southern half of the country) is almost empty:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...f_Portugal.PNG

Same thing for Germany:
http://www.demografie-portal.de/Shar...lob=normal&v=2

And the Netherlands:
http://sedac.ciesin.columbia.edu/dow...ty/nlddens.jpg
I have heard that a lot. People often imagine The Netherlands to be one big city considering how densely populated it is but that's not the case at all, except for a few concentrated areas. This map shows the population density differences within The Netherlands more clearly:



Even in Holland there are wide open spaces in between the cities. I went to Amsterdam by train a few days ago and practically the whole way from Utrecht to Amsterdam we were surrounded by agricultural land on both sides. The Randstand (conurbation of Amsterdam, Rotterdam, The Hague and Utrecht with 7,1 million inhabitants) has a huge "Green Heart" in the middle of it (hence the name "Randstad", which means "edge city"). This is a schematic map of the Randstad:



I assume that is what you meant by "urban planning" laws. We could easily make housing prices cheaper if we simply used all the land available to build new houses - and build huge skyscrapers in the inner cities - but alas, that is not allowed. I don't think it really bothers people though. I never hear people complain about it. It's just what we're used to, almost everyone lives in a 'small' house. I guess that is where the fascination with the "McMansions" of the US comes from, it's fun to imagine what it would be like living in such a huge house. At the same time, many will say it's too much maintenance and a waste of space. I live in a student house and my room is just 18 m2, that would probably make most Americans claustrophobic
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:38 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
2,866 posts, read 5,243,291 times
Reputation: 3425
That is not to say we don't have mansions of our own, of course. There's a very affluent area called "Het Gooi" where all the rich and famous live. It's a beautiful place but housing prices are through the roof. Here's a link with some of the houses on offer and their prices.
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:43 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,650 posts, read 60,925,505 times
Reputation: 101078
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
Did you design and build your house, or was it already built? I think the 'plainness' is quite part the Spanish style these days. Newer houses in particular don't have that many small details. I think that house was also made for foreigners. It kinda have a 'scandinavian' feel, not completely Iberian. I would like more details as well.

I think the house is two homes attached to each other. That is quite usual in parts of Europe, also Scandinavia, as it brings down the building costs. But they don't have access to each other, and you pay separate heating, water, AC and electricity bills. So you only share one wall and a part of the backyard with your neighbour. In that house you probably share the pool, so it's not your own but part of the common backyard.

Never thought about that master bedroom thing. I think I'd like it upstairs.
Ours was a new home but already built when we purchased it. Here we have what is called a "Builder's Parade of Homes" where builders showcase their work on a planned tour of various homes by a variety of builders - usually in the spring at the start of the "home buying season" - they are new construction. Our was one of those several years ago, so though we didn't choose the extra touches, they were already included and just happened to be exactly our taste! Plus, it was put on the market JUST AS THE MARKET FELL in the US - so we got a good deal on it. The local market has improved drastically since then - it was in a state of shock when we bought the place.

We did have to put in the yard, fence, sprinkler system, storage building, patio, flower beds, etc. But landscaping is a safe investment - in our market we usually can expect to get it back dollar for dollar at resale unless we go crazy with the improvements!

I hear from other parts of the US that it doesn't matter as much whether or not the master bedroom is upstairs, but here in east Texas it's a pretty big deal. It's a definite negative for the master to be upstairs. Also, people tend to prefer "split bedrooms" - the master suite on one side of the house and the minor bedrooms on the other side.

Open floor plans are also popular, though personally I prefer that the kitchen be a bit tucked away around maybe one wall - like an L shape. That's one of the few things I'd change about my current house.
 
Old 05-05-2013, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,650 posts, read 60,925,505 times
Reputation: 101078
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Yes, but it is similar in Germany and other European countries. Most people live in cities, while large areas are sparsely populated. Some of those areas are used for agriculture, others not used for anything really.
I remember passing through the Netherlands on train. Although that country has one of the highest population densities in the world, there are vast empty areas, which surprised me back then.

Currently I live in the Alentejo region of Portugal. While all of Portugal is a high-density country according to your map, this region (which makes up almost the southern half of the country) is almost empty:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...f_Portugal.PNG

Same thing for Germany:
http://www.demografie-portal.de/Shar...lob=normal&v=2

And the Netherlands:
http://sedac.ciesin.columbia.edu/dow...ty/nlddens.jpg
My point is that, with a much higher density of population, European HOUSING tends to be much more crowded - and smaller - than a lot of American housing. I'm not saying one is better or worse than the other, it's just a general observation.

Like I said earlier, the AVERAGE house size in the US is about 2500 square feet.
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