U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Europe
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 04-05-2019, 08:19 PM
 
14,974 posts, read 13,551,426 times
Reputation: 6892

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
Kind of sad to see pro Russians on here trying to find ways to spin this election as showing the country is divided against itself. The real story out of this is how the usual divide in elections is gone. There is no more south and eastern half voting for a pro Russian like in decades past.

Yes, any president can and will be tossed if the people don't like him going back on the positions they campaigned on. If Ze is elected and decides to do the opposite of what he is campaigning for (such as signing an agreement to join a Russian economic union) he would be tossed quick. That's how it works in the west, a president's survival depends on the will of the people. I know Russians are conditioned to react to such a concept with horror.

Poroshenko signed the deal with EU, ( and stayed the course,) but was still tossed out, because he didn't deliver the improvement of living standards in Ukraine, ( and that's what naive Ukrainians were expecting from this agreement.)
Zelensky is the last hope for Ukraine in this respect; he is in a very tough spot.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-05-2019, 09:34 PM
 
Location: Russia
179 posts, read 25,316 times
Reputation: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
That's how it works in the west, a president's survival depends on the will of the people.

Do you really think so?
It's fully nonsense. In the west president's survival depends from the political forces that put him in this position.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-05-2019, 09:52 PM
 
15,446 posts, read 13,428,866 times
Reputation: 20962
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
Kind of sad to see pro Russians on here trying to find ways to spin this election as showing the country is divided against itself. The real story out of this is how the usual divide in elections is gone. There is no more south and eastern half voting for a pro Russian like in decades past.

Yes, any president can and will be tossed if the people don't like him going back on the positions they campaigned on. If Ze is elected and decides to do the opposite of what he is campaigning for (such as signing an agreement to join a Russian economic union) he would be tossed quick. That's how it works in the west, a president's survival depends on the will of the people. I know Russians are conditioned to react to such a concept with horror.
Well in Ukraine, they believe not in elections, but by force. They did not like the election of Yanukovych, so they tossed him by force instead of waiting for the next election, which they knew they would lose anyway.

Since Zelensky did not gain a lot of support in areas that pretty much spearheaded the Maiden, maybe they will do the same since their boy Poroshenko did not get elected. That is the way they think, the way they roll.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 09:19 AM
 
5,645 posts, read 2,276,521 times
Reputation: 5868
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus View Post
Well in Ukraine, they believe not in elections, but by force. They did not like the election of Yanukovych, so they tossed him by force instead of waiting for the next election, which they knew they would lose anyway.

Since Zelensky did not gain a lot of support in areas that pretty much spearheaded the Maiden, maybe they will do the same since their boy Poroshenko did not get elected. That is the way they think, the way they roll.
Something like another Maidan is very likely considering who has the guns. There's a lot of crazies in the swamps and dark alleys around Kiev.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arsen_Avakov

Ever notice how many people in Ukrainian government aren't even ethnic Ukrainians?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 09:21 AM
 
5,645 posts, read 2,276,521 times
Reputation: 5868
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimogor View Post
Do you really think so?
It's fully nonsense. In the west president's survival depends from the political forces that put him in this position.
And the resources whichever candidate has available. The size of the warchest.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 12:05 PM
 
5,645 posts, read 2,276,521 times
Reputation: 5868
Something for you DKM.

How do you sleep at night?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h15i...4s&app=desktop

I really took note of what the one fisherman said at the end.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 02:07 PM
DKM
 
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
2,784 posts, read 980,680 times
Reputation: 2798
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Uh, right, it's kinda the Ukrainian version of Florida - those regions that vote for Boiko; that's where all Ukrainian retirees are flocking to apparently, to suntan and to play golf)))


It's either this, OR it's the INDUSTRIAL HUB of Ukraine, historically so. That's where the engineers/technicians/other educated specialists live and work.

Machinery manufacturing industry, chemical industry, electric power industry. This is not exactly the blue color region as Donbass, (which is mostly all about coal mines,) it's more of the white color regions, but industrial regions never the less.

The region that IMF would love to shut down as "unprofitable" ( as much as Donbass,) and turn it into the wasteland designated for fracking. To "keep Ukraine independent from Russian gas," you know.

As for the locals - they can always go to pick up strawberries somewhere in the EU, as Western Ukrainians do. Or join the ranks of Polish plumbers in the EU - whichever the "labor market" dictates.

But I don't think that these regions are ready for it yet, and that's why they vote for Boiko, to keep that cheap Russian gas coming, in order to keep their industries ( and jobs) afloat.
Ditto - you can add Odessa region in the South there; yet another white color region.



P.S. That red small "Poroshenko" pocket near the border of Donetsk - that's where apparently the Nazis are currently stationed ( the "National battalions" - Azov, Tornado and such,) and that's where they vote.



P.S. P.S. The Western part of Ukraine looks like a zoo in voting terms, sorry)))
Mostly only old people stayed in Luhansk and Donetsk regions. The younger people who can get jobs moved west to the jobs, mostly Kiev but other areas too. There is very little "industry" in the Boiko areas except Mariupol. Educated people don't work in coal mines, they work in IT and that's more and more in the western side of the country. Anyway you look at it, the elderly were the ones who voted for the guy as the stats back that up. Yes he promised them cheap gas and higher pensions but that trick doesn't work on the educated and younger people. There is no future in Donbas, Russia permanently ended industry there yet you want to blame the IMF. It would be funny but I feel sorry for Eastern Ukrainians having their lives ruined to protect Putin from "democracy".

The small "Poroshenko" pocket is simply where an army base lies so they voted more for their commander in chief than others. Its the 53rd mechanized Brigade there, not nazis but killing separatists is their job so I can see why you want to call them that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 02:09 PM
DKM
 
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
2,784 posts, read 980,680 times
Reputation: 2798
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Poroshenko signed the deal with EU, ( and stayed the course,) but was still tossed out, because he didn't deliver the improvement of living standards in Ukraine, ( and that's what naive Ukrainians were expecting from this agreement.)
Zelensky is the last hope for Ukraine in this respect; he is in a very tough spot.
He didn't implement the association agreement. According to the EU, only 24% was implemented since signing the deal in 2014. That's why he's getting tossed out. He never actually put into action the terms of the EU agreement. Now he's talking like he will, but its too late. There is nothing naive about improvement in living standards if you implement the EU institutions and rules. There is a reason why the Europeans are so rich compared to Russians...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 02:12 PM
DKM
 
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
2,784 posts, read 980,680 times
Reputation: 2798
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimogor View Post
Do you really think so?
It's fully nonsense. In the west president's survival depends from the political forces that put him in this position.
The political forces that put a president into their position is the will of the people. Poor brainwashed soviets. I was hoping Russia would overcome this legacy but I see little hope in this generation.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-06-2019, 02:18 PM
DKM
 
Location: Thousand Oaks, CA
2,784 posts, read 980,680 times
Reputation: 2798
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus View Post
Well in Ukraine, they believe not in elections, but by force. They did not like the election of Yanukovych, so they tossed him by force instead of waiting for the next election, which they knew they would lose anyway.

Since Zelensky did not gain a lot of support in areas that pretty much spearheaded the Maiden, maybe they will do the same since their boy Poroshenko did not get elected. That is the way they think, the way they roll.
You quoted my post and ignored the part where the president gets tossed out if they go against what they campaigned on. Ze will get tossed if he turns around and does the opposite of what he's being elected for. Sorry but that's what Yanukovych got. He made it worse for responding to protests of his change by beating up the kids doing the protesting.

This isn't Russia, Ukrainian people have the choice in their own course now. Oh I know how much this drives Putin crazy. The apparent interest in Ukraine on this thread is evidence of that. A successful election of a Russian speaking opponent to the incumbent who STILL WANTS to join the EU is a 100% disaster for Putin. The other half of Ukraine woke up to who their real friends are (its not from the east). I think he has no choice but to obscure this reality.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > Europe
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top