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Old 04-21-2019, 05:51 PM
 
2,699 posts, read 984,510 times
Reputation: 1733

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thor herself View Post

Hell no. Munich Agreement failure all over. You cannot just give in to land-grabbers.
While itís true that Russia did effectively take over Crimea under suspicious circumstances, itís a dead end. Russia views the former Soviet states as satellites. They wants to ensure that Ukraine stays away from NATO. Part of it can be attributed to a fear of NATO expansion at its backdoor, the rest stems from a fear of losing its sphere of influence. Both views have merit.

I donít see the point in escalating tensions over Crimea. Itís a done deal by now. Let them have it.
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Old 04-21-2019, 07:29 PM
 
5,634 posts, read 2,271,035 times
Reputation: 5864
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thor herself View Post
What evidence do you have for this? None.
In the eyes of Russia proof was not needed. They were not going to allow it. Period. No one is going to to tell me the US wouldn't love to have Aegis destroyers and cruisers off the coast of Crimea, the cruise missiles they can launch would be within easy striking distance of the industrial centers of Russia.

Do some research, you obviously know next to nothing and your points are simply the product of one that is uninformed.


Quote:
The naval base in Sevastopol was leased to Russia to at least 2042! They already had their strategic base!
First off I don't think it was until 2042. Why don't you check. That is irrelevant when the US is involved also. The US State Department and the CIA run Kiev. They will do what the US tells them to. Breaking that contract would be nothing to them. Just send in the hoodlums and arrest the Russian personnel. It wouldn't have been pretty and most likely would have brought RUssia into a war with Ukraine, which Ukraine would have lost.

Quote:
Hell no. Munich Agreement failure all over. You cannot just give in to land-grabbers.
You cannot just give in to those who pull off coups, wreck whole countries and start wars either. All of which the US did here.
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Old 04-22-2019, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
9,467 posts, read 9,341,729 times
Reputation: 6640
Desperate times call for desperate measures.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/...ist-celebrity/
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Old 04-22-2019, 08:42 AM
 
14,965 posts, read 13,542,286 times
Reputation: 6887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alec Solano View Post
Victory!

I am sorry, in my mind I already gave my voice to Vasilii Goloborodko.
I can't vote for two different people.
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Old 04-22-2019, 08:58 AM
 
14,965 posts, read 13,542,286 times
Reputation: 6887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrat335 View Post
In the eyes of Russia proof was not needed. They were not going to allow it. Period. No one is going to to tell me the US wouldn't love to have Aegis destroyers and cruisers off the coast of Crimea, the cruise missiles they can launch would be within easy striking distance of the industrial centers of Russia.

Do some research, you obviously know next to nothing and your points are simply the product of one that is uninformed.




First off I don't think it was until 2042. Why don't you check. That is irrelevant when the US is involved also. The US State Department and the CIA run Kiev. They will do what the US tells them to. Breaking that contract would be nothing to them. Just send in the hoodlums and arrest the Russian personnel. It wouldn't have been pretty and most likely would have brought RUssia into a war with Ukraine, which Ukraine would have lost.



You cannot just give in to those who pull off coups, wreck whole countries and start wars either. All of which the US did here.

Oh, there were proofs/indications indeed.
A. Muraev ( that politician whose videos I've posted here earlier) said there were negotiations with Ukrainian government on its way on this subject ( or they already began - I don't remember, but he talks about it in one of those videos ( I just don't have time to go through all of them to figure out which one.)
Then there was a tender posted on US Navy site for repairs in one of the local schools in Sevastopol ( usually a precursor of American military "to get friendly with the local population" to proceed with the military base.)
Plus the common sense of course.
The whole Brzezinski doctrine - that's what it's all about.

Last edited by erasure; 04-22-2019 at 09:22 AM..
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Old 04-22-2019, 11:43 AM
 
14,965 posts, read 13,542,286 times
Reputation: 6887
Quote:
Originally Posted by grega94 View Post
I think politically it’s more advantageous to have large Russian populations in post soviet countries than to have them all move to Russia. These Russian populations kind of act as a lobby who vote in pro Russian candidates and policies.

I am sure that it's part of Putin's clan plan - that Russians remaining in the "nearest abroad" would do their bidding, but how much this expected bidding people that are FORCED to stay there are going to do? What do you think?
Another thing - the most bitter, the most hateful ( towards Putin and Co) rhetoric I hear so far comes from the Russians living in the Eastern Ukraine, and NOT for the reason that "Russia attacked Ukraine."
Just saying.
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Old 04-22-2019, 11:46 AM
 
14,965 posts, read 13,542,286 times
Reputation: 6887
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouldy Old Schmo View Post
Desperate times call for desperate measures.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/...ist-celebrity/

Yes.
But did these very people manage to change much I wonder?
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Old 04-22-2019, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Seattle WA, USA
3,902 posts, read 2,181,516 times
Reputation: 2587
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
I am sure that it's part of Putin's clan plan - that Russians remaining in the "nearest abroad" would do their bidding, but how much this expected bidding people that are FORCED to stay there are going to do? What do you think?
Another thing - the most bitter, the most hateful ( towards Putin and Co) rhetoric I hear so far comes from the Russians living in the Eastern Ukraine, and NOT for the reason that "Russia attacked Ukraine."
Just saying.
Oh no I agree, Russia should try to attract as many Russians to move to Russia considering Russia's demographic problem, and most of the countries that are anti Russian are going to remain anti Russian and no amount of Russian minority is going to change that, in fact reducing the Russian population in these countries might only improve relations as they won't be threatened by a Crimea 2.0 happening. I was just stating why Russia is reluctant to attract them since they still want that soft power projection.

Also as far as the Donbass goes, Russia is clearly using it as a bargaining chip for Ukraine to accept Crimea as Russian.
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Old 04-22-2019, 05:24 PM
 
Location: Europe
3,691 posts, read 567,347 times
Reputation: 778

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7g7xxiAOfw

If this comic show man wanna trade our state to tycoons we must come down him like Yanukovich!
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Old 04-22-2019, 05:29 PM
 
5,634 posts, read 2,271,035 times
Reputation: 5864
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alec Solano View Post

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7g7xxiAOfw

If this comic show man wanna trade our state to tycoons we must come down him like Yanukovich!
I think there is a chance he will be shot dead if he does the right thing that is for sure. Maybe you won't be disappointed. The power that rules in Ukraine is the power of terror.
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