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They're a bandit group of neo-nazis (Russia has a lot too), what does that have to do with their electoral arm having very little support which is a fact?
What "electoral arm?" Did it look to you that they cared about such inconvenience as "electoral arm" on Maidan when they were throwing Molotov cocktails? Truth is, they do what they are pleased and those, officially in power use them whenever they find it suitable.
Quote:
Here's your Russian bandits in Luhansk:
The "bandits in Lugansk" is precisely the answer to bandits from Pravy Sector.
That's what the leader of Communist parliamentary party was talking about in Rada, until the nationalists from Svoboda jumped on him. How dare you to point at the culprit of upcoming civil war?
What "electoral arm?" Did it look to you that they cared about such inconvenience as "electoral arm" on Maidan when they were throwing Molotov cocktails? Truth is, they do what they are pleased and those, officially in power use them whenever they find it suitable.
Right Sektor has both a political and paramilitary arm. Not to mention, it's amusing that you think everyone involved in the Ukrainian revolution was a skinhead or a member of far-right groups. Officials in power do not use them, they just can't disarm them with Russia annexing and agitating everywhere.
Also, in case some people haven't realized, Kyiv is never going back into the Russian sphere of influence except by force which may start World War III. The audacity of Moscow to make demands and comment on the situation after invading, hosting a farce referendum, and then annexing Crimea is hilarious. They're also probably behind the agitation in Far East Ukraine. Moscow pretty much unilaterally ruined its dominant relationship and close ties with the country, for a very, very, long time. Even Russified Ukrainians will probably view the annexation with bitterness for centuries to come and the country is clearly looking west for aid and European integration (which means real living standards increases.)
Last edited by Rozenn; 04-09-2014 at 06:50 AM..
Reason: Unnecessary
Yeah..these guys aren't from the area... Definetly Russian provocation, typical....
And you know how? Could be Ukrainian citizens as well, or do I have to remind you yet again Yanukovich was voted into office by a fair election; I do not see why you are obtuse to facts like not all, 100% of people in Ukraine are aligned politically; in fact, they are very divided.
Looking at this, Americans should appreciate how lucky they were historically to be geographically too distant for the British Empire to effectively control. These days, even if you manage to overthrow the corrupt government with the best of intentions toward improving the country, your ruthless powerful neighbor may make that choice untenable.
The US eliminated all of its enemies in its expansion west.
Ukraine had a fairly elected government that was overthrown, I repeat; a fairly elected president was overthrown, removed from power unconstitutionally. The current government is not elected, but is signing away at legislation that impacts everyone in Ukraine.
What happened to the Orange revolt? Forget about that one? Oh yes, that failed also, that failed so bad people elected Yanukovich back into power.
What happened to elections? What will happen if the people who revolted do not like who is voted in next time, another revolt? Why has the new gov barred many people from running for office?
Right Sektor has both a political and paramilitary arm. Not to mention, it's amusing that you think everyone involved in the Ukrainian revolution was a skinhead or a member of far-right groups. Officials in power do not use them, they just can't disarm them with Russia annexing and agitating everywhere.
You're living in a RT fantasy world.
Also, in case some people haven't realized, Kyiv is never going back into the Russian sphere of influence except by force which may start World War III. The audacity of Moscow to make demands and comment on the situation after invading, hosting a farce referendum, and then annexing Crimea is hilarious. They're also probably behind the agitation in Far East Ukraine. Moscow pretty much unilaterally ruined its dominant relationship and close ties with the country, for a very, very, long time. Even Russified Ukrainians will probably view the annexation with bitterness for centuries to come and the country is clearly looking west for aid and European integration (which means real living standards increases.)
People said once Europe will never be under German influence again, now look who is basically running the EU and the economic powerhouse of Europe.
What is a farce is the elections in Ukraine now, oh wait, there have been no elections, yet the new gov has taken upon themselves to sign deals and legislation impacting everyone.
As far as being behind the agitation; maybe or maybe not, would not surprise me either way, but Ukraine caused that issue; being a country with two revolts in ten years, low quality of life, and near bankruptcy tends to cause issues like this.
So if we want to sue Locke, well then Crimea was also in the right just as much as the revolt was; it is either one or the other, cannot have it both ways. Cannot call the revolt legal under the natural rights of revolution (though the right to vote exists and the president was voted in by a fair election), but not apply natural rights of revolution to Crimea, who in fact voted their path, which despite how corrupt the vote was or not, was still more democratic than anything the new Ukrainian gov has done, and less violent.
I agree - once people in Kiev overthrew the elected government all rules about respecting established government in Ukraine went out the window. One can't organize a coup in one part of a country and then immediately criticize with any integrity reactionary uprisings elsewhere.
Of course the U.S. was deeply involved in Kiev for many months prior to the overthrow and is hypocritical for chastising Russia for voicing opinions on Ukraine - the U.S. is the pre-eminent example of a state that is constantly interfering in other states' domestic affairs...what other government maintains hundreds of military bases around the world to ensure hegemony and regularly invades nations when unhappy with governmental decisions enacted in those states or forces others to use their currency under threat of military action? None.
I don't think Russia honors the civil liberties of its citizens and I wouldn't want to live there. But the U.S. is not heading in the correct direction with protecting freedom of U.S. citizens either so there can't be any gloating. On an international scale, however it is no contest - in the last 50 years the U.S. has killed tens of millions of people through the use of military force, not to mention all of the misery caused by 'sanctions' and other nonmilitary oppression.
And you know how? Could be Ukrainian citizens as well, or do I have to remind you yet again Yanukovich was voted into office by a fair election; I do not see why you are obtuse to facts like not all, 100% of people in Ukraine are aligned politically; in fact, they are very divided.
Ukraine is not Russia's child, in fact it was once a proud nation centuries ago. They should be able to sort things out themselves. Russia is clearly provocating. The fact that Russia's puppet was voted in in a fair election doesn't mean much when his troops are shooting his own people and he invites Russian troops to Crimea, who then annex the territory. The man would at this point be hanged if he returned to his homeland.
Last edited by Rozenn; 04-09-2014 at 06:48 AM..
Reason: Unnecessary
People said once Europe will never be under German influence again, now look who is basically running the EU and the economic powerhouse of Europe.
Those people were being absurd, not to mention Germany lost out in World War II but never attempted to regain those territories, if they had, Poland wouldn't be nearly as chummy with them (and anti-Russia) as they are now.
Russia has committed massive atrocities against Ukraine since the 1600's when it fell under Russian control. The bitterness didn't flare up much after 1991 but it is very strong now.
People said once Europe will never be under German influence again, now look who is basically running the EU and the economic powerhouse of Europe.
Actually I think the Germans have been a good example for everyone since after WW2. They have apologized repeatedly for the Nazi atrocities, spent much of their national effort on improving the lives and welfare of their people and are trying to improve the environment.
World War 2 was a horror but it did lead to the European Union and the NATO alliance. Since WW2, all the old European Great Powers; France, Great Britain, Germany, Italy, and Spain etc are now united. For hundreds and even thousands of years these countries have been at each others throats but today - never has Western and Central Europe been so peaceful.
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