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Old 06-22-2014, 07:15 AM
 
4,456 posts, read 3,707,855 times
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^
In general I'do go with erasure's point above. Just a further comment.

I'd suggest that yes the MAJOR consequential 'action' may lie between Russia and The 'Old Europe'. However, I'd say it is in the 'New Europe' where Russia, in pressing forth her interests, believes if is there where she can take advantage and develop relational weaknesses to undermine a STRONG Europe. It is there that Russia knows it can get at European cohesion.
But the example of Ukraine also shows that even countries out of the EU are targets if they shown just a glimmer of uncertainty in their national path.
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Old 06-22-2014, 08:34 AM
 
15,049 posts, read 13,645,910 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travric View Post
^
In general I'do go with erasure's point above. Just a further comment.

I'd suggest that yes the MAJOR consequential 'action' may lie between Russia and The 'Old Europe'. However, I'd say it is in the 'New Europe' where Russia, in pressing forth her interests, believes if is there where she can take advantage and develop relational weaknesses to undermine a STRONG Europe. It is there that Russia knows it can get at European cohesion.
Nope, Russia has no interest in "new Europe." It's not more important than buzzing flies. If Russia is interested in undermining the "strong Europe," she will hit at the right spot - i.e the backbone of Europe - Germany, and up to a certain degree at France.( Italy is yet another "weak chain" of "strong Europe" by the way.)
Russian-German ties go far back in history, to the times of the first Russian cities, and these are relations ( with all their ups and downs) that affect the rest of the world on a major scale.

Quote:
But the example of Ukraine also shows that even countries out of the EU are targets if they shown just a glimmer of uncertainty in their national path.
Again - you are confusing Ukraine, that laid foundation for Russia back in history, with some other unrelated countries that Russia was using to her advantage at different times.
That CIA is twisting the truth nowadays in order to serve American geopolitical agenda and denying the truth about the direct connection between Kiev and Moscow, doesn't make things any better.

"Ukraine was the center of the first eastern Slavic state, Kyivan Rus, which during the 10th and 11th centuries was the largest and most
powerful state in Europe. Weakened by internecine quarrels and Mongol invasions, Kyivan Rus was incorporated into the Grand Duchy
of Lithuania and eventually into the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. The cultural and religious legacy of Kyivan Rus laid the
foundation for Ukrainian nationalism through subsequent centuries. A new Ukrainian state, the Cossack Hetmanate, was established
during the mid-17th century after an uprising against the Poles. Despite continuous Muscovite pressure, the Hetmanate managed to
remain autonomous for well over 100 years. During the latter part of the 18th century, most Ukrainian ethnographic territory was
absorbed by the Russian Empire"

https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...ntrypdf_up.pdf


Reading this you'd never figure out that the "Russian Empire" grew out of "Kievan Rus" ( it only "absorbed" Ukraine out of a blue you see, according to CIA,) but the twisting of facts will not change history, as much as someone would love to re-write it.

Last edited by erasure; 06-22-2014 at 09:41 AM..
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Old 06-22-2014, 08:39 AM
 
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P.S Found the funniest picture on a subject of "Putin is the one fighting "freedom-loving Kiev" in East Ukraine;"

http://putinbog.files.wordpress.com/...whcaaeqikn.jpg
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Old 06-22-2014, 09:10 AM
 
15,049 posts, read 13,645,910 times
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..and here we go boys and girls, the true reason behind the "concerns" of US corporations about the "freedom and democracy" in East Ukraine. SHELL is drilling in Kharkov's region as we speak; and we are talking about fracking. The very fracking that's increasingly banned in the US because of the environmental issues,
Hydraulic fracturing in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
but they are not all that important when it comes to the "natives" of some "Ukraine," apparently...
Why not? Ukraine needs to be set free from economic dependency from Russia, right? And why shouldn't it, while helping a bit Uncle Sam along the way, with the distribution of profits 70/30 ( at least that's what Russian News channel reports. Putin - he is no fool as we know.)
Oh, if only not for those pesky local environmentalists with their silly anti-American banners...
On another hand -they can carry those banners all they want, Kiev's government feels free to shake hands with American corporations as they are pleased.
For now.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vY7eS6GzPRg#t=191
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Old 06-22-2014, 09:36 AM
 
5,823 posts, read 10,160,721 times
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So it's between Russia and the big guys, not some "slovakias." And that's how it has always been.

Absolutely right. And I can testify as a French guy that the majority of people who care here (not the brainwashed by the medias) have absolutely no sympathy for Ukraine right now.
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Old 06-22-2014, 10:06 AM
 
15,556 posts, read 13,550,797 times
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Originally Posted by streetway View Post
Huge amount of trade between EU and Russian ? EU exports to Russia represent 1% of the whole block's GDP. That's "hugely" astonishing.
I highly doubt that the EU will abolish Visa requirements for Russians, as I had mentioned before, Russians represent security risk for the EU as far as Putin can use Russian minority as an excuse for invasion. Moreover I thought Russians despise the EU and NATO why are they migrating into the EU and NATO coutries ?
I think the EU needs unilateral decision on visa requirements and I somehow doubt that lets say Schengen members like Latvia, Estonia, Poland, Czech republic, Slovakia or Finland agree with this, it's very risky Russian is unstable country.
Wow, you do not get out much, do you?

There are numerous Russians in the EU zone, both migrated, business, and tourists. A simple Google search would show you the ease of visa restrictions over the years, and the current talks taking place to do away with the visa requirement all together. As it stands now, the visa requirement is a joke as everyone gets issued a visa anyway. If you ever got out of your village, you would see even Slovakia has numerous Russians visiting, working, and conducting business there.

And you are delusional to think Russians represent a security risk, your cognitive abilities for interpreting information are low. Also, Russia is not even close to being an unstable country, that would be Ukraine, who has gone under two revolutions over the last ten years.

As for trade, you are completely wrong; Russia is the EU's 4th largest export partner, 2nd largest import partner, and overall 3rd largest trade partner after the US and China. For Slovakia, Russia is the third largest import partner.
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Old 06-22-2014, 10:27 AM
 
1,037 posts, read 911,681 times
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Ukraine: Nationalists clash with anti-war march in Kiev


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQkcfMiF1OU
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Old 06-22-2014, 10:51 AM
 
15,049 posts, read 13,645,910 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atai J. View Post
Ukraine: Nationalists clash with anti-war march in Kiev


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQkcfMiF1OU
Yup. More of 000.01% of Pravy Sector ( and other bozos) today in Kiev.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaiC0awbLFo


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYkjJMCf9v8#t=22
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Old 06-22-2014, 10:53 AM
 
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If streetway is worried about security risks, he should get out of his village and watch the world news, doesn't he know that crazy, murderous Djihadists (armed by his US friends ) are rampaging in Irak, burning oil fields and slaughtering people, and are on the brink of invading the capital, Baghdad. Oh yes but he will probaly answer that the Donetsk militia is "much more dangerous " and Putin worse than Ben Laden...
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Old 06-22-2014, 10:59 AM
 
15,049 posts, read 13,645,910 times
Reputation: 6926
Quote:
Originally Posted by pigeonhole View Post
If streetway is worried about security risks, he should get out of his village and watch the world news, doesn't he know that crazy, murderous Djihadists (armed by his US friends ) are rampaging in Irak, burning oil fields and slaughtering people, and are on the brink of invading the capital, Baghdad. Oh yes but he will probaly answer that the Donetsk militia is "much more dangerous " and Putin worse than Ben Laden...
....and speaking about the Islamic threat - Russia has been that column keeping "check and balances" in the world and curbing power of Islam for centuries, including throughout Soviet times. Once the US decided to remove Russia as a viable world power back in the nineties, guess what took place next...
It's all oh so biblical I can only say.
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