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Old 08-25-2014, 03:12 AM
 
861 posts, read 977,348 times
Reputation: 307

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Quote:
Wadym
in this Putin has found allies in the face of Merkel.
So, Merkel is his ally? What's wrong she said? What your country needs decentralization is the common opionion. Austria, Belgium, Germany are the federated states. Spain isn't, but it's autonomies have a lot of rights.

Merkel is the best you can have. Be realistic.

The rebels have no future, in my opinion.
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Old 08-25-2014, 05:19 AM
 
Location: Germany
261 posts, read 199,557 times
Reputation: 64
does Russia really want another new independent state at its border, who is permanently
fighting in words and deeds with another neighbor ?
Russia already made clear that they wanted one Ukraine under a Yanukovich-like government.
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Old 08-25-2014, 06:00 AM
 
4,456 posts, read 3,685,860 times
Reputation: 3104
Re: ...'the rebels have no future'...

You know for themselves I know they believe the slights they feel are warranted yet their actions arguably run to humiliation and degradation of their enemies as the parade of their prisoners in Donetsk show. It would seem to me they have no 'order' and run around simply shooting guns. If there's a 'platform' it's hard to see an intelligent presentation of grievances. This is a group that has terrible PR.
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Old 08-25-2014, 07:01 AM
 
Location: Hong Kong / Vienna
4,557 posts, read 5,092,775 times
Reputation: 3909
Poland to send "humanitarian" convoy with banned food to Russian Kaliningrad Oblast
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Old 08-25-2014, 12:34 PM
 
14,952 posts, read 13,513,673 times
Reputation: 6885
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
This parade was not about "inhumane treatment of prisoners" per se; DNR has agreement with Ukrainians, they regularly make exchanges of POWs and so on.
It was not "directed" at prisoners themselves with a purpose to threaten or humiliate them - it was a referral to the events of the 17th of July, 1944 when defeated German troops were paraded through Moscow.
So it was really a staged political action.
In Donetsk it was a reminder, a statement what they consider this war to be all about, how they view it, particularly in the light of the "Independence Day" parade in Kiev.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=717145681666559
As I see, after this parade Ukrainian prisoners are going straight home.

Прощание с пленными Донецк 24.08.2014 Пленные с позорного парада позорно отпущены в Киев. Позор Украине.

Nope, nothing "inhumane" here, and as some Russian posters are saying, now these soldiers are REALLY running a risk to be shot by their own as being "not trustworthy" enough.
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Old 08-25-2014, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Kharkiv, Ukraine
661 posts, read 694,498 times
Reputation: 681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muscovite View Post
So, Merkel is his ally? What's wrong she said? What your country needs decentralization is the common opionion. Austria, Belgium, Germany are the federated states. Spain isn't, but it's autonomies have a lot of rights.

Merkel is the best you can have. Be realistic.
Do not vouch for the accuracy of the quotes - is a double translation from German - but I think the meaning is clear.
'Ukraine should take the necessary decision and end the conflict in the country and with Russia. Ukraine must make peace with Russia and to enter into a Customs Union. This will save face of Putin.
' Merkel.

You know how it is called? The trade morality, or easier - Prostitution.
I didn't think, that Ukraine can have prostitute as a friend.

By the way, Selena, is it you?
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Old 08-25-2014, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Kharkiv, Ukraine
661 posts, read 694,498 times
Reputation: 681
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
now these soldiers are REALLY running a risk to be shot by their own as being "not trustworthy" enough.
You're smooching mores of Russia and Ukraine.
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Old 08-25-2014, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
5,473 posts, read 9,513,440 times
Reputation: 2411
Okay, rough neck Scratch: You said my views are mysterious. Breaked down to simplistics. So, here's the deal:

For certain reasons I have to choose my side - and the side is Ukraine. But at the sametime i'm glad that Selena is not a corpse and back posting again, although i don't not agree with all she has to say.

And then there are some women here on this thread that gets my flagpole risin'.
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Old 08-25-2014, 01:38 PM
 
Location: Finland
24,268 posts, read 18,651,990 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
This parade was not about "inhumane treatment of prisoners" per se; DNR has agreement with Ukrainians, they regularly make exchanges of POWs and so on.
It was not "directed" at prisoners themselves with a purpose to threaten or humiliate them - it was a referral to the events of the 17th of July, 1944 when defeated German troops were paraded through Moscow.
So it was really a staged political action.
In Donetsk it was a reminder, a statement what they consider this war to be all about, how they view it, particularly in the light of the "Independence Day" parade in Kiev.
You have to remember that this is the worst propaganda there is available (from a Russian perspective).
Ok, a 1944 revival, and that was humiliating at the time, and people here in the west had gone forward even before. Farmer Gnther Bauer from Aschaffenburg wasn't responsible for Hitler's acts. Those parades would've been unacceptable already in 1815.
These acts of humiliation only reinforce the barbarian or untermensch mentality about Russians in all of us. And the less we want to have to do with these people.

If Europeans will ever accept the Russians as even nearly equals, you can't just throw Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky towards us, when the reality is road rage dashcam videos, bad-behaving babushkas and leather-coat mafia bandits leading football clubs.

General Lucius Clay, the US commander during the Berlin air bridge said "Dealing with the Russians quickly taught that they understand nothing but force, never barter with them without showing it". All Europeans should learn and take that as the guideline. As we've seen, soft speak doesn't get you anywhere.
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Old 08-25-2014, 02:29 PM
 
861 posts, read 977,348 times
Reputation: 307
Quote:
Ariete
untermensch mentality a
Don't use such words.

Last edited by Muscovite; 08-25-2014 at 03:18 PM..
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