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Old 02-21-2015, 09:40 AM
 
4,984 posts, read 5,048,995 times
Reputation: 6322

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrat335 View Post
I think they're there to protect their point of view. This biker guy who is the leader is of course there for other reasons, namely personal gain but then there is good and bad in everything.
Hopefully the people dissatisfied with Putin criminal-imperial fiefdom will be able to protect their point of view too.

Quote:
Are you reading my mind?

This is a stupid discussion. You can't do any better?
Sure, we could do much better after you provide the abundant evidence, otherwise I assume it's all in your mind.


Russia's Investigative Committee has brought charges of inciting ethnic hatred against a woman who posted links to mainstream Ukrainian documentary films and television shows about the country's current crisis on her social network pages, the woman said.

Russian Woman Says Charged With 'Inciting Ethnic Hatred' for Posts on Ukraine Crisis | News | The Moscow Times

Russian Woman Accused Of Treason Over Suspected Troop Deployment


Speaking of the paid posters, Russian regime transcended that amateurishness long time ago.

Russia This Week: The Kremlin’s Growing Army of Internet Trolls | The Interpreter
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Old 02-21-2015, 10:32 AM
 
14,988 posts, read 13,562,871 times
Reputation: 6892
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
Putin' regime have financed Marie Le Pen party (and who knows what other Euro nazis, euro leftists are traditional Russian clients),
I'm sure that without "Putin's financing," Marie Le Pen wouldn't have come to existence in France at all))))

Quote:
Russians elected fascist clown Zhyrynovsky' party to the Russian parliament, fascist ideologue Dugin is sponsored and accepted by the Russian regime.
Then show me Dugin's people on the streets, will you? Because your nationalists are right here for everyone to see, which I demonstrated you through and through;


https://www.youtube.com/watch?annota...&v=1lVfsbLH5CE

See, anyone can *** all they want - you need proofs for those "great theories" of yours.

P.S. And what Zhirinovsky is good for, other than clowning in Duma?


Quote:
Those three represent acceptable, in the averaged Russian opinion, right wing ideology. Since it's you who demonize Pravii Sektor here,
Yeah, how could I demonize something as innocent as this -


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zeeh7ZMmh_E


Quote:
A belief in the "endless goodness" of the West" was popular among the soviet citizens circa 1989. Some former admirers, and you among them, were permanently affected by predictable disillusionment that followed. 25 years later you keep using 25 y.o. old clichés to analyze the present. As of 2015 "the West" represents not an idealized goodness but an attractive political alternative to the post soviet corrupt feudalism; transparency of the institutions, the rule of law, low corruption, effective courts and police, etc., etc., the list is endless.
Yeah, - the "endless goodness of the West"


Quote:
As of 2015 the West represents pragmatic things that the post soviet semi-criminal feudalism failed to provide, and it will never be able to provide those things.
And guess who helped to establish this "semi-criminal feudalism"???
See, all this "transparency of the institutions," "the rule of law" "effective courts and police" - that's in the eyes of the West is something that only West deserves. As practice showed it 20 years ago, Russia doesn't deserve such things. And naive Ukrainians think that they are "special." That unlike Russians, the "endless goodness of the West" will be applied towards them, since Ukrainians "have no historic connection to Russia" - a "totally different group of people all together," lol))))


Quote:
Who are the "liberals" you are talking about? Names only please, no bs?
Where, in Russia or Ukraine?
In Ukraine, the fine representatives are Yatzenuk and Turchinov))))
( Yatzenuk is loved by Western establishment in particular, the way may be only Chubais and Gaidar were loved by it)))

Quote:
Russian aggression was predictable? What American involvement are you talking about, no generic bs, names, amounts, etc.?
Rotflmao, are you for real? You can ask her "names, amounts etc)))"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaR1_an9CnQ
Quote:
Considering all those hundreds of billions dollars Russian regime wasted on the latest imperial adventure,
No generic bs" please - names, amounts etc.

Quote:
America and everything it stands for is on one side and semi criminal post Soviet feudalism is on the other side, hmm, what would you choose?
If I were young and naive as you, of course I would have chosen "the other side."
But I am not young and naive any longer.

Quote:
Yeah, we know your choice, to shill for the Russian Faterland without experiencing its rigors. You enjoy, but don't appreciate, the things US liberalism provided to you. You don't want the same things you have for the Russians or Ukrainians. That's some weird concoction.
In fact I do. I want it very much and always wanted it. Unfortunately, I've learned that that's not what America wanted for Russia. Russia shouldn't be "free and democratic" country; this is reserved for the West as I've already said. Russia should be preferably gone forever, disintegrating and not serving as any kind of global competition for the US, that strives for the ultimate world dominance. And Ukraine is a "useful idiot" in the eyes of American politicians, that can be used for this particular purposes. Now how Ukraine is going to be rewarded for that, is a different question.
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Old 02-21-2015, 12:54 PM
 
4,984 posts, read 5,048,995 times
Reputation: 6322
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
I'm sure that without "Putin's financing," Marie Le Pen wouldn't have come to existence in France at all))))
Cheap propaganda trick. All that matters that Putin' regime approves Marie to lend money to her. I asked you to compare the views of Marie, Zhyrinovski, Dugin and Pravii Sektor you demonize. You refuse do that because it will override 200 pages of BS in this thread.

Quote:
Then show me Dugin's people on the streets, will you? Because your nationalists are right here for everyone to see, which I demonstrated you through and through;
Cheap propaganda trick again. I asked you to compare the views of Marie, Zhyrinovski, Dugin and Pravii Sektor you demonize. You repeatedly refuse to do that because it will override of 200 pages of propaganda BS you wrote in this thread.

Anyone interested in viewing videos of the Russian nazi marches, minority beating etc., is quite capable of entering those search word in youtube.

Quote:
See, anyone can *** all they want - you need proofs for those "great theories" of yours.

P.S. And what Zhirinovsky is good for, other than clowning in Duma?
Zhyrinovksy clowns what's on Putin' and Russian people minds. That's why he got elected. Don't underplay validity of Zhyrinovsky statements. If Russian people elected that fascist clown, they approve his message.


Quote:
Yeah, how could I demonize something as innocent as this -
Cheap propaganda trick yet again. I asked you to compare the views of Marie, Zhyrinovski, Dugin and Pravii Sektor you demonize. You repeatedly refuse to do that because it will override 200 pages of propaganda you wrote in this thread.

Anyone interested in viewing videos of the Russian nazi marches, minority beating etc., orthodox fascists, is quite capable of entering those search word in youtube. And with the brownshirts Putin introduced more to come.


If you will keep with the unsupported labeling and demonizing, I will keep copy pasting the text above. We will not move our discussion further until you will make some rational comparisons of 1, 2, 3 and 4. If you chose to be an irrational propagandist about it, you can do that with your Russian comrades in this thread.

Quote:
And guess who helped to establish this "semi-criminal feudalism"???
I am all ears for your conspiracy theories. Comrade Putin & Co defeated the western liberal rot within, and the victorious regime is kinda fond of the semi-criminal feudalism, Russian peasants cannot get enough of it too, all it takes for Putin to invade something defenseless every 5-6 years or so. So what are you complaining about?

Quote:
See, all this "transparency of the institutions," "the rule of law" "effective courts and police" - that's in the eyes of the West is something that only West deserves. As practice showed it 20 years ago, Russia doesn't deserve such things. And naive Ukrainians think that they are "special." That unlike Russians, the "endless goodness of the West" will be applied towards them, since Ukrainians "have no historic connection to Russia" - a "totally different group of people all together," lol))))
Those are generic human ideals independent of the West or East. It's sad that Russians mock and insult those ideals while settling for something insane, criminal and insulting for human dignity.

Quote:
Where, in Russia or Ukraine?
In Ukraine, the fine representatives are Yatzenuk and Turchinov))))
( Yatzenuk is loved by Western establishment in particular, the way may be only Chubais and Gaidar were loved by it)))
Nonsense. Yatzenuk and Turchinov were spawned by Timoshenko clan at the time Chubais lost all his liberal veneer to become a bona-fide feudal in the FSB kingdom that Putin built. The only ideology of the post soviet clans is - to steal, to accumulate capital, to turn power into wealth. Calling anybody in the post soviet establishment "liberal" is an insult to that term. You are way too eager to fit the world in the box of your preconceptions.

Quote:
Rotflmao, are you for real? You can ask her "names, amounts etc)))"
Cheap trick again. You make a claim, you give numerical evidence to that claim. You should explain why Russians were willing to waste hundreds of billions on an aggression instead of exerting the influence American way. You claim you know all the nuts and bolts of the American domination. Your knowledge + Putin' billions = victory of mother Russia 1 year ago. Why war?

Quote:
No generic bs" please - names, amounts etc.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/544e25d0-9...#axzz3SPS3VPjx

Russian economy to shrink 5%, says EBRD. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/544e25d0-9...#ixzz3SPSUrSXs

Russia’s economy is being battered by falling prices for oil, its main export, and financing difficulties caused by EU and US sanctions imposed over the crisis in Ukraine, as well as the implications of the slowdown for the whole region. Piroska Nagy, the EBRD’s director for country strategy and policy, said the decline in oil prices “exposed the impact of long-running structural problems in [Russia’s] economy but also increasingly biting sanctions”. 5% of 2 trillions + 150 billions of the Russian currency reserves lost + invading military expenditures + Crimean anschluss expenses+"rebel" support, propaganda doesn't come cheap either.

Quote:
If I were young and naive as you, of course I would have chosen "the other side."
But I am not young and naive any longer.
Fitting the world' events in a box of the bitter disillusionment, paranoia and nazi mythology is a poor substitute for naiveté.

Quote:
In fact I do. I want it very much and always wanted it. Unfortunately, I've learned that that's not what America wanted for Russia. Russia shouldn't be "free and democratic" country; this is reserved for the West as I've already said. Russia should be preferably gone forever, disintegrating and not serving as any kind of global competition for the US, that strives for the ultimate world dominance. And Ukraine is a "useful idiot" in the eyes of American politicians, that can be used for this particular purposes. Now how Ukraine is going to be rewarded for that, is a different question.
Doesn't make sense. The victorious Fuhrer freed Russia from the American domination and offered the peasants irresistible concoction of neo feudalism, corruption, lawlessness, inequality, chauvinism, paranoia, mania of grandeur, lust for blood and glory. Why it's Russia and not Zimbabwe that should jockey for a position of global dominance? This Russian throwback mentality of 19th century imperialism doesn't belong in 21st century. You want global importance, you make yourself pretty to the people, you do something people value. Putin had 15 years of power, 15 years later a banana Russia is rattling soviet era weapons and demanding an exclusive sphere of influence it deserves. Surreal.

Russian mentality 101. It's never Russian fault, ever. If something goes wrong, it's because evil enemies outside are scheming against unquestionable Russian greatness. Quite amazing mentality coming from a thoroughly secondary, mosaic culture created by those enemy influences in the first place.

Last edited by RememberMee; 02-21-2015 at 02:16 PM..
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Old 02-21-2015, 01:33 PM
 
14,988 posts, read 13,562,871 times
Reputation: 6892
"Cheap propaganda tricks?"
As I've said - anyone can y ak, so bring the proves for your ya king - prove that Dugin's people are on the streets, enforcing the "laws" the way they see it fit, and government is approving of it. ( The way it goes in Ukraine.)
"Anyone can google it" approach won't work here, sorry, since I could easily find proofs for my statements. It's your turn, and unless you can back up your claims, on ignore list you go. I don't see any need to waste my time any longer refuting your delusions.
As for "conspiracy theories," I've left enough of information here. Get busy with your home work.
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Old 02-21-2015, 02:00 PM
 
Location: Russia
4,220 posts, read 2,347,637 times
Reputation: 1233
By the way, today watched "Hunde, wollt ihr ewig Leben? (Film/1959)". Good movie. What were they doing at Stalingrad? What are they doing at Donetsk today? Very complicated questions.
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Old 02-21-2015, 02:06 PM
 
4,984 posts, read 5,048,995 times
Reputation: 6322
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
"Cheap propaganda tricks?"
As I've said - anyone can y ak, so bring the proves for your ya king - prove that Dugin's people are on the streets, enforcing the "laws" the way they see it fit, and government is approving of it. ( The way it goes in Ukraine.)
"Anyone can google it" approach won't work here, sorry, since I could easily find proofs for my statements. It's your turn, and unless you can back up your claims, on ignore list you go. I don't see any need to waste my time any longer refuting your delusions.
As for "conspiracy theories," I've left enough of information here. Get busy with your home work.
It's a cheap propaganda trick yet again, comrade erasure. I asked you a specific question: to compare the views of Marie Le Pen, Zhyrinovski, Dugin and Pravii Sektor you demonize. You demonize Pravii Sector, you do the comparison, not me. You repeatedly refuse to compare the outspoken views of 1, 2, 3 and 4 because an honest comparison will override 200 pages of propaganda BS you wrote in this thread.

OK if you chose the path of a cheap propagandist, luckily you have plenty of the Russian comrades in this thread, you can propagandize, condition and enforce each others lunacies, paranoia and hatred.
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Old 02-21-2015, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Russia
4,220 posts, read 2,347,637 times
Reputation: 1233
RememberMee, it's for you.


http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/zergu...75347_1000.jpg
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Old 02-21-2015, 02:24 PM
 
Location: Russia
4,220 posts, read 2,347,637 times
Reputation: 1233
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
Russian mentality 101. It's never Russian fault, ever. If something goes wrong, it's because evil enemies outside are scheming against unquestionable Russian greatness. Quite amazing mentality coming from a thoroughly secondary, mosaic culture created by those enemy influences in the first place.
Tell me, who destroys homes in Donetsk and killing local residents? Is it Russia? No, it is Ukraine, which blinded by the idea of "Ukraine is one country, they must obey Kiev!"

You kill people, and that's too bad.
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Old 02-21-2015, 02:29 PM
 
14,988 posts, read 13,562,871 times
Reputation: 6892
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maksim_Frolov View Post
By the way, today watched "Hunde, wollt ihr ewig Leben? (Film/1959)". Good movie. What were they doing at Stalingrad? What are they doing at Donetsk today? Very complicated questions.
I've heard there was a big anti-Maidan rally in Moscow today, Maksim?
(Because I'm reading Dmitry Olshansky here, on FB.... )

https://www.facebook.com/spandaryan?fref=nf&pnref=story

"Let's dance Peggy, let's dance.

I see thieves, swindlers and clowns are getting into decisive fight with non-existent Maidan.
They've plastered the advertisements all over Moscow, hired a big crowd of extras, successfully mastered few million dollars from the budget of one well-known Kremlin department, and I'm sure they'll keep on mastering it.
My respect to them.
In fact not I only respect it all, but I am downright envious of scope and size of their business endeavor.
Needless to say, that if one day things will get really rough and dangerous here - all these people will be gone, as if blown with the wind straight into the toilet. At that, they'll push the lever down themselves, before they'll flee to the faraway lands.
The protection of motherland in this difficult situation will befall, as usual, on different suspicious outcasts - Strelkov and Limonov followers, and other random heroes who'll come out of nowhere, - security guards, grave diggers, and people in charge of garage managements somewhere in Birulovo.
But since difficult times are not here yet and all is good in Putin's kingdom, your favorite artists are going to be with you today, on circus arena.
Jumps, fights with inflated sledgehammers and food fights - all according to business plan of the circus. "



Couldn't say any better.
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Old 02-21-2015, 02:31 PM
 
4,984 posts, read 5,048,995 times
Reputation: 6322
Here is a terrible Pravii (Right) Sector leader explaining his views. http://seansrussiablog.org/2014/02/0...-right-sector/

As far as we understand, the Freedom (Svoboda) Party is closest to you in ideological views…

Yes. We have a lot of common positions when it comes to ideological questions, but there are big differences. For instance, I don’t understand certain racist things they share, I absolutely don’t accept them. A Belarusian died for Ukraine, and an Armenian from Dnipropetrovs’k died for Ukraine. They are much greater comrades of mine than any, sorry, Communist cattle like Symonenko, who play for Russia but are ethnic Ukrainians.

Stepan Bandera once advocated three ways of dealing with non-Ukrainians. It’s very simple. You deal with them as comrades – and this is for those who fight with you for Ukraine, regardless of their nationality. You deal with them in a tolerant way – for those who live on the land and do not oppose our struggle; thus, we treat them normally, Ukraine has a place for all. The third way of dealing with them is in a hostile way – and this is for those who oppose the Ukrainian people’s national liberation struggle. And this is in any state; any people takes exactly these positions.

Social nationalism is very complicated for me, because it is my belief that nationalism does not require anything extra; it is enough. Oleh (Tiahnybok – Ukrains’ka Pravda), too, has lately tried to go the way of traditional nationalism. Thank God. Although there isn’t much of a point talking about ideological discussions during a revolution. Finally, our guys stand at the barricades just like guys from Svoboda. This unites us.


That's why comrade Erasure you strategically avoid comparing Pravii Sektor ideology to that of Marie Le Pen, Zhyrinovski, Dugin, Putin, yourself. You just wage a little victorious propaganda assault for mother Russia here, that's all that matters to you.

Last edited by RememberMee; 02-21-2015 at 02:43 PM..
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