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Old 06-03-2016, 07:09 PM
 
820 posts, read 945,433 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saibot View Post
Okay, but your statement that it is "the norm" for French households to be worth 400k Euros is not true.

I'm done.
Yes my statement was not precise. It is the norm but on average, not for 50% people who are under 150 k euros but in the USA, it is 68k euros...

 
Old 06-03-2016, 07:18 PM
 
820 posts, read 945,433 times
Reputation: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post

Yup. Which is why the whole world wants to come to the U.S. You get what is basically a mini mansion on a middle class salary. My German relatives could never afford what we have here. They can't even dream of central air, or three car garages coming standard, or great rooms, or heated floors, or marble vanities. That's only for the rich in most of the world. In the U.S. it's available to anyone with a decent middle class salary.
According to an American study, only 10% of American people would choose the American economic model between 10 international economic models.
 
Old 06-04-2016, 06:28 AM
 
Location: Bologna, Italy
7,501 posts, read 6,223,088 times
Reputation: 3761
Quote:
Originally Posted by seixal View Post
To be fair, the US is one of the best countries in the world to live in if you're hard working, and france is one of the best countries in the world to live in if you're lazy. Pick your poison.
my friend works a lot and does not make a dime at the end of the month. Go figure.
 
Old 06-04-2016, 01:14 PM
 
10,275 posts, read 10,237,717 times
Reputation: 10644
Quote:
Originally Posted by amaroW View Post
According to an American study, only 10% of American people would choose the American economic model between 10 international economic models.
Why don't you post the study, then?

And if it's true, what's your point? It doesn't change the fact that the U.S. is much richer than these other countries. Whether or not some study indicates that people would prefer some alternate economic model has nothing to do with whether or not that economic model produces prosperity.

The U.S., for all its faults (and, yes, there are MANY), produces a ton of prosperity, far more than France. This can't be debated. The only countries with remotely comparable wealth are either microscopic in size/population or a few oil states. There is no place on earth that creates so much wealth for so many different types of people.
 
Old 06-04-2016, 03:51 PM
 
10,839 posts, read 14,625,632 times
Reputation: 7872
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
Why don't you post the study, then?

And if it's true, what's your point? It doesn't change the fact that the U.S. is much richer than these other countries. Whether or not some study indicates that people would prefer some alternate economic model has nothing to do with whether or not that economic model produces prosperity.

The U.S., for all its faults (and, yes, there are MANY), produces a ton of prosperity, far more than France. This can't be debated. The only countries with remotely comparable wealth are either microscopic in size/population or a few oil states. There is no place on earth that creates so much wealth for so many different types of people.
In terms of overall wealth what you said is true, but that higher wealth doesn't translate into better quality of life for Americans in general.

For example, America spends more money on health care per person than any other rich countries, yet no one can say Americans in general enjoy the best healthcare, it probably is near the bottom of the list, because it is the insurance companies that make most of the profit.

Why do you think American cities never rank high on quality of life rankings? Yes those ranking are not absolute truth and have their own standards but it is generally accepted that QOL in America is not that fantastic.

You can talk about GDP and income all you want, unfortunately that's not the whole story. How many Americans get 5 weeks vacation? One year fully paid mat leave? Yes your salary is higher and can buy more stuff in the malls, is that all that matters?
 
Old 06-05-2016, 03:28 PM
 
5,546 posts, read 6,827,283 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
In terms of overall wealth what you said is true, but that higher wealth doesn't translate into better quality of life for Americans in general.

For example, America spends more money on health care per person than any other rich countries, yet no one can say Americans in general enjoy the best healthcare, it probably is near the bottom of the list, because it is the insurance companies that make most of the profit.

Why do you think American cities never rank high on quality of life rankings? Yes those ranking are not absolute truth and have their own standards but it is generally accepted that QOL in America is not that fantastic.

You can talk about GDP and income all you want, unfortunately that's not the whole story. How many Americans get 5 weeks vacation? One year fully paid mat leave? Yes your salary is higher and can buy more stuff in the malls, is that all that matters?
Let us not forget that America is a debt society. I'm not sure if the same is true of France. College debt, housing debt, car debt, credit card debt, etc. Many Americans that enjoy good pay are debt slaves. That in itself paints a poor quality of life.
 
Old 06-05-2016, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Bologna, Italy
7,501 posts, read 6,223,088 times
Reputation: 3761
I have lived in France most of my life and I don't feel that the US are especially in a better situation. It has its advantages but it also comes with many inconvenients. About standards of living, it seems very similar.
 
Old 06-07-2016, 08:48 PM
 
Location: FIN
888 posts, read 1,584,396 times
Reputation: 811
Quote:
Originally Posted by manbury View Post
I have a good French friend who is a truck driver. He has a Thai wife, and he manages to work only five months per year in France, living the remaining 7 months in Thailand off of his savings from those 5-months of work.
He claims he can save up to 3.000 euros per months, as he drives international routes and sleeps mostly in the truck, while earning refunds for hotel rooms. And those refunds are even tax-free.

So in short this guy from La Rochelle can live on vacation 7 months a year thanks to 5 months of work in France! Just amazing!

This is really impressive, so I think you are totally right in your claim that France is the best place on earth for the average working person.

Actually I really envy your willingness to fight for your workers' rights.
Keep up the fight, mes amies!
Many people working road construction or other seasonal labor here up north live like that too. They work about 2/3 of the year, doing lots of overtime and collecting per diem from travelling work, the rest of the time during winter months they are laid off and receive unemployment. Many choose to spend that period in Thailand or some other country with relatively very low cost of living.

Never heard of anyone with a family doing that though. Many give up the "travelling" lifestyle by the time they have a stable relationship and/or children. Having done my share of travelling work myself, far from home for days and weeks at a time, staying in less-than-glamorous accommodations, working 12+ hours per day, i don't envy anyone who makes good money that way.
 
Old 06-07-2016, 09:38 PM
 
10,275 posts, read 10,237,717 times
Reputation: 10644
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
In terms of overall wealth what you said is true, but that higher wealth doesn't translate into better quality of life for Americans in general.
This is true, but what I am arguing is objective (wealth) what you are arguing is subjective (quality of life).

Objective facts can't be argued. The U.S. is indeed wealthier than France, and the gap grows every year.

Subjective points are impossible to quantify, and totally dependent on personal biases. What is "higher quality of life"? More possessions? A bigger house? A longer vacation? Happier children? A hotter spouse? There's no way to answer these questions in any sort of objective manner, so pointless exercise.
 
Old 06-08-2016, 05:53 AM
 
Location: London U.K.
2,587 posts, read 1,573,918 times
Reputation: 5781
Quote:
Originally Posted by manbury View Post
I have a good French friend who is a truck driver. He has a Thai wife, and he manages to work only five months per year in France, living the remaining 7 months in Thailand off of his savings from those 5-months of work.
He claims he can save up to 3.000 euros per months, as he drives international routes and sleeps mostly in the truck, while earning refunds for hotel rooms. And those refunds are even tax-free.

So in short this guy from La Rochelle can live on vacation 7 months a year thanks to 5 months of work in France! Just amazing!

This is really impressive, so I think you are totally right in your claim that France is the best place on earth for the average working person.

Actually I really envy your willingness to fight for your workers' rights.
Keep up the fight, mes amies!

When I was a licenced black cab driver in London, and it was a really good vocation, way back before TFL, (Totally Failing London), took over from the Metropolitan Police in running the Public Carriage Office, and before Uber was allowed to bend the law, when all we had was the minor irritation of fly-by-night minicab firms, who did the jobs that we weren't interested in, like sitting outside pubs, waiting for a drunk to come out and barf all over the back seat, I knew two brothers from Custom House, East London, who bought a house each in Spain.
Their wives and families lived there all year round, but Ted and Lenny, would fly back in mid to late June, rent a taxi each and work 15-18 hour days, crashing on relatives sofas.
They would do this until early January, when the taxi trade traditionally took a nosedive for some three months, this was known as 'the kipper' season, as everything went flat.
They'd then fly back to Spain, and have some six months laying around, as the weather warmed up, they'd sit round the pool drinking wine and eating paella, then, come June, as the weather threatened to become unbearably hot, they'd start checking flights.
They loved the fact that their kids went to school in Spain, were fluent in the language, and gradually helped their mothers to learn it too.
Lenny said that when he had a kiddy pool built, attached to his large one, his 14 y.o. daughter conducted the negotiations in Spanish with the builder, (with Lenny telling her what he wanted), and she oversaw the construction of it as well.
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