Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Exercise and Fitness
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-24-2016, 03:02 AM
 
Location: Chicago
4,745 posts, read 5,537,343 times
Reputation: 6007

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
Right, those verifiable studies I showed are completely meaningless. And Grey Cook has no idea what he's talking about, nor guys like Mike Boyle who are also wary of the squat.
Like I said, squatting isn't for everyone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
Even my own anecdotal evidence in which I always dead-lifted more than I could squat was a mere illusion. Apparently, some guy on the internet knows my own body better than myself.
Most people can deadlift more than they can squat, a lot more in some cases. I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. They are two different exercises in case you didn't know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
Guess, I'll start squatting because some guy under 30 on the internet told me to do so without any evidence to support his claim.
What takes more strength, supporting hundreds of pounds on your back or swinging a 35 lb kettleball? lol Also, I'm not under the age of 30.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
It's your spine and your hips man. Do whatever you want to do. It's your body. You just need to realize that not everyone has to agree with you. I've done plenty of research, probably a lot more than you, and this is the conclusion I've come to.
Well, do your kettleball swings and lame trap bar deadlift instead. We are obviously cut from a different mold. If you have a weak torso or lousy form then heavy squats definitely aren't for you. Also, many people have a lousy range of motion in their joints and hips. Perhaps you need to work on core strength and flexibility?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
How many years have you been lifting?
Enough to know that squats are a superior strength building exercise to kettleball swings and trap bar deadllifts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-24-2016, 05:21 AM
 
Location: The Commonwealth of Virginia
1,386 posts, read 989,626 times
Reputation: 2151
Quote:
Originally Posted by McBain II View Post
Arnold isn't an exercise physiologist.
So, only an "exercise physiologist" is qualified to speak to muscle confusion? If Arnold Schwarzenegger, perhaps one of the most successful bodybuilders in the history of the sport, says that one of the ways he got BIG was because of, in effect, muscle confusion, we should completely discount what he says because he isn't an "exercise physiologist"?

Got it. That makes perfect sense.


--
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 05:26 AM
 
3,271 posts, read 2,174,188 times
Reputation: 2458
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago South Sider View Post
Like I said, squatting isn't for everyone.



Most people can deadlift more than they can squat, a lot more in some cases. I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. They are two different exercises in case you didn't know.



What takes more strength, supporting hundreds of pounds on your back or swinging a 35 lb kettleball? lol Also, I'm not under the age of 30.



Well, do your kettleball swings and lame trap bar deadlift instead. We are obviously cut from a different mold. If you have a weak torso or lousy form then heavy squats definitely aren't for you. Also, many people have a lousy range of motion in their joints and hips. Perhaps you need to work on core strength and flexibility?



Enough to know that squats are a superior strength building exercise to kettleball swings and trap bar deadllifts.
Like I said, it's your spine. You clearly don't have a strong mind because you only think in terms of reward, while completely ignoring risk.

I think in terms of risk vs reward.

You said the squat builds more "raw strength." Can you define raw strength in no uncertain terms?

And I didn't realize kettlebells only went up to 35 lbs.

I remember you posting your lifts for your weight and you were weak for your size, so what exactly are you trying to prove? That a sub par athlete that's only been lifting for a few years and isn't good enough to compete in any sport can get stronger using the barbell squat?

That's great. It's your spine. Do whatever you got to do. You're clearly insecure since you're projecting your weakness upon me. You assume I'm as weak as you.

I also hedge my investments. I guess that makes me weak too? What an idiot I am for protecting myself against catastrophic loss.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 07:06 AM
 
Location: The Commonwealth of Virginia
1,386 posts, read 989,626 times
Reputation: 2151
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
I remember you posting your lifts for your weight and you were weak for your size, so what exactly are you trying to prove? That a sub par athlete that's only been lifting for a few years and isn't good enough to compete in any sport can get stronger using the barbell squat?

That's great. It's your spine. Do whatever you got to do. You're clearly insecure since you're projecting your weakness upon me. You assume I'm as weak as you.

I also hedge my investments. I guess that makes me weak too? What an idiot I am for protecting myself against catastrophic loss.
You're taking this personally. Don't. Understand there are people who might know more than you do.

I do barbell back squats. I hate them. But I do them. In my experience, and from everything I've read, back squats are just about the best overall exercise you can do. Are their risks? Maybe. But everything I've read has said that when you do back squats with the proper form (and that's key), the risk is minimal.

There are also risks doing kettlebell swings. I was doing kettlebell swings with a 52 pound kettlebell and I threw my back out. My form was off. My back wasn't straight enough. There are risks to EVERYTHING.

I also like to do deadlifts. I've maxed out at 365. I'm afraid to go higher because I'm afraid I might hurt my back. I want to get a coach to help me with my form.

Just don't get defensive and resort to personal attacks. Because THAT'S weak.


--

Last edited by Bill790; 03-24-2016 at 07:32 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 08:13 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
8,087 posts, read 9,787,283 times
Reputation: 6650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobster View Post
Like I said, it's your spine. You clearly don't have a strong mind because you only think in terms of reward, while completely ignoring risk.

I think in terms of risk vs reward.

You said the squat builds more "raw strength." Can you define raw strength in no uncertain terms?

And I didn't realize kettlebells only went up to 35 lbs.

I remember you posting your lifts for your weight and you were weak for your size, so what exactly are you trying to prove? That a sub par athlete that's only been lifting for a few years and isn't good enough to compete in any sport can get stronger using the barbell squat?

That's great. It's your spine. Do whatever you got to do. You're clearly insecure since you're projecting your weakness upon me. You assume I'm as weak as you.

I also hedge my investments. I guess that makes me weak too? What an idiot I am for protecting myself against catastrophic loss.
Dude. Chicago South Sider is at 400+lb barbell squat. You have him confused with someone else.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 09:00 AM
 
Location: Tampa (by way of Omaha)
14,561 posts, read 22,980,515 times
Reputation: 10355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill790 View Post
So, only an "exercise physiologist" is qualified to speak to muscle confusion? If Arnold Schwarzenegger, perhaps one of the most successful bodybuilders in the history of the sport, says that one of the ways he got BIG was because of, in effect, muscle confusion, we should completely discount what he says because he isn't an "exercise physiologist"?

Got it. That makes perfect sense.


--
When said bodybuilder is directly contradicted on a well established fact by actual scientists, yes, we should completely discount what the body builder says. Also, Arnold was using steroids, which will put on massive amounts of muscle without ever touching a barbell.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Tampa (by way of Omaha)
14,561 posts, read 22,980,515 times
Reputation: 10355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix C View Post
Dude. Chicago South Sider is at 400+lb barbell squat. You have him confused with someone else.
Jobster is also...IIRC...one of those fanboys of "functional" training and kettlebell fad **** that tends to eschew traditional barbell training. To each their own, but make no mistake about it that the traditional barbell training with proper programming will give substantially better gains than anything you can do with a kettlebell.

Also, the whole safety argument is stupid. Barbell back squats are perfectly safe if done properly, and things like kettlebell swings can wreck you if done improperly. Rather than being a sissy and taking half measures, the proper approach is to learn to do the ideal movements correctly.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 10:21 AM
 
Location: East Lansing, MI
28,395 posts, read 16,265,163 times
Reputation: 10467
It's not that hard to learn to do a barbell back squat safely, jeez.


I'm 41 years old and have had microfracture surgery on my right knee and I can do (relatively) heavy back squats with no issues or pain.


Jobster, my back squat is only about 355lbs and I weigh about 225, not sure if that surpasses your "weak for your size" threshold or not.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 01:04 PM
 
Location: The Commonwealth of Virginia
1,386 posts, read 989,626 times
Reputation: 2151
Quote:
Originally Posted by McBain II View Post
When said bodybuilder is directly contradicted on a well established fact by actual scientists, yes, we should completely discount what the body builder says.
You sound like you know more about the subject than I do. So, please, educate me. A Google search shows me there is a lot of disagreement about the benefits of "muscle confusion." Not to mention a lot of disagreement about what muscle confusion is. How do you define muscle confusion?

Is it really a "well established fact"? It seems that you put 10 bodybuilders in a room and you'll get 11 opinions. And the scientists don't seem to be much different.

Please point in the direction of some of the studies to which you refer.


--
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 02:57 PM
 
3,271 posts, read 2,174,188 times
Reputation: 2458
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill790 View Post
You sound like you know more about the subject than I do. So, please, educate me. A Google search shows me there is a lot of disagreement about the benefits of "muscle confusion." Not to mention a lot of disagreement about what muscle confusion is. How do you define muscle confusion?

Is it really a "well established fact"? It seems that you put 10 bodybuilders in a room and you'll get 11 opinions. And the scientists don't seem to be much different.

Please point in the direction of some of the studies to which you refer.


--
So the guy that criticises me for not knowing enough requires an elementary education from McBain?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Exercise and Fitness

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top