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I agree with the above poster re 3X12 reps , but if you keep the resistance going up, you'll surely get the job done. It's all about progressive resistance. It's that easy.
Agree with a lot of the last two posts. Either I did not state things well in my earlier post, or it was misunderstood. When I discussed twelve reps, I was talking about a standard workout for basic fitness, in which twelve reps is the number you work up to, at which point you add weight and lower the number of reps. Nothing wrong with throwing in some variation to this routine once you're in shape to do so.
My main point was that beginners need to be careful about going for the really heavy weights too quickly. Lifting really heavy at the beginning would be similar to being really out of shape, starting out on a jogging program, and then throwing in interval after interval of gut-blasting sprints after only a week or two of basic jogging. This would be risky because your body would not yet have built up the basic tolerance to being strained in the way that running strains the body. It's the same with strength training. You need to build up a good conditioning base before pushing it to the max. It also takes experience to get a feel for how much weight you can handle.
Agree with a lot of the last two posts. Either I did not state things well in my earlier post, or it was misunderstood. When I discussed twelve reps, I was talking about a standard workout for basic fitness, in which twelve reps is the number you work up to, at which point you add weight and lower the number of reps. Nothing wrong with throwing in some variation to this routine once you're in shape to do so.
My main point was that beginners need to be careful about going for the really heavy weights too quickly. Lifting really heavy at the beginning would be similar to being really out of shape, starting out on a jogging program, and then throwing in interval after interval of gut-blasting sprints after only a week or two of basic jogging. This would be risky because your body would not yet have built up the basic tolerance to being strained in the way that running strains the body. It's the same with strength training. You need to build up a good conditioning base before pushing it to the max. It also takes experience to get a feel for how much weight you can handle.
Oh yes, agreed^^^. My post above was just for fun. Yes, it does depend on the beginner, intermediate, advanced level of the participant.
I would suggest a 6-12 rep range to beginners as well.
Even when I take a couple of weeks off and get back into lifting, I can feel my muscles really struggling to the new resistance again. It takes time to get used to the workload all over again. To a true beginner, it would really shock their body. Plus they probably wouldn't be able to handle the higher weights due to form being all 'shaky' or just not have the mind/muscle connection needed. That's why the twelve reps is recommended.
Yeah I think we are all pretty much agreed on this thread . I was never advocating anyone doing one rep maxes, let alone beginners. Beginners obviously need to be careful - the shock to the nervous system and tendons and ligaments alone when you first start lifting heavy weight suggests you not go super heavy until you have a little experience. In addition, beginners are far more likely to sacrifice FORM to lift more WEIGHT, whether knowingly or unknowingly.
My point was just that, for someone who's into lifting, you generally are not going to hurt yourself lifting "too much weight" IF you maintain proper FORM. If you sacrifice form to move the weight, you are setting yourself up for injury.
Yeah I think we are all pretty much agreed on this thread . I was never advocating anyone doing one rep maxes, let alone beginners. Beginners obviously need to be careful - the shock to the nervous system and tendons and ligaments alone when you first start lifting heavy weight suggests you not go super heavy until you have a little experience. In addition, beginners are far more likely to sacrifice FORM to lift more WEIGHT, whether knowingly or unknowingly.
My point was just that, for someone who's into lifting, you generally are not going to hurt yourself lifting "too much weight" IF you maintain proper FORM. If you sacrifice form to move the weight, you are setting yourself up for injury.
lol....are you still on that? Your too funny!
This is mainly why it is highly recomended to visit your doctor prior to begining any new excersize regiment. Personal trainers don't count either Although I'd love to be considered as smart as a doctor i'm really not. Visit the Doc....he knows your medical history and all of your stats so he/she will be able to tell you what you should or should not do....relay that info to a PT or whoever is helping you get started and you should be good to go . Always trust your insticts.....personal trainers who don't truly listen to their clients end up putting them in danger so if you really really think something is wrong then tell them that your concerned and you need to stop....but just FYI....It's supposed to burn .
This is mainly why it is highly recomended to visit your doctor prior to begining any new excersize regiment. Personal trainers don't count either Although I'd love to be considered as smart as a doctor i'm really not. Visit the Doc....he knows your medical history and all of your stats so he/she will be able to tell you what you should or should not do....relay that info to a PT or whoever is helping you get started and you should be good to go . Always trust your insticts.....personal trainers who don't truly listen to their clients end up putting them in danger so if you really really think something is wrong then tell them that your concerned and you need to stop....but just FYI....It's supposed to burn .
Sound advice here. I'd rep you, but I it's the old ya gotta spread it situation. Still, some good thoughts. Rep to NJ and Hutch, and compliments to Lola, for showing how great minds (we all have great minds here, right?) can debate the details but still agree on the fundamentals.
One thing about the last line of Lola's post, "It's supposed to burn . . ." This is an example about why it's important to have experience before you experiment much. There are different kinds of pain or discomfort when you exercise. It takes a certain degree of experience to get the feel for when it's a good pain that means you're getting a solid workout, and when it's the pain that indicates you're pusing too hard, or doing something wrong.
cartilage, heart problems, over extending joints, tearing ligaments, hard hands(callous), addiction to the gym, biggest of all in men is hernia, ruptured back ( this kinda comes from poor technique thou)
cartilage, heart problems, over extending joints, tearing ligaments, hard hands(callous), addiction to the gym, biggest of all in men is hernia, ruptured back ( this kinda comes from poor technique thou)
Yeah you have to be really careful with the heavy weight, honestly you have to make sure by that point that you really know what you're doing, and that you have the proper form. I see so many people in the gym putting themselves at long-term injury risk because of the way they are lifting. A lot of people don't isolate properly, for instance, they throw their entire body into a set. Like they will be doing biceps and trying to gyrate their hips to give them some momentum to lift more, which is a horrible idea. It's like stretching where you bounce up and down, that is a high injury risk -- static stretching is far more effective and reduces the risk of tearing anything.
Even with a lot of experience and knowing what I was doing, I hurt myself pretty bad doing a back workout and the ironic part is that it ended up only limiting my bench press and shoulder workouts, because I was trying to do pullovers, so lying down on a bench looking at the ceiling, 100 pound dumbell gripped with both hands, going over my head, coming back above my face, etc. On one of the reps instead of pushing up or moving the weight with both arms, like using my back muscles, the weight got kind of situated above my left shoulder, it started to fall off balance, and I ended up yanking it back to center with that shoulder. At the time, I felt something kind of tweak, but it didn't really hurt, it was just a matter of it feeling uncomfortable. I was smart enough to stop that exercise for the day and pretty much ended my workout soon after, didn't do anything to aggravate it, but it was still too late. I worked out for about 2-3 more sessions, found I couldn't do much weight at anything with my shoulder like that, so I took 3 weeks off and it really still hadn't fully recovered. I could hear it make a funny sound when I moved it. I went back to lifting but suddenly couldn't do 225 pound bench presses like before, I was struggling, it wasn't like I felt pain when I was doing 185 but my body said, "Uhh, I wouldn't move up..." and I'm smart enough to realize that if you're not feeling comfortable with a weight, be careful. It just felt "sensitive" and not really ready for more weight. I kept working out but didn't really recover what I had been doing for quite a while, and finally went to a physical therapist for a few sessions. He said based on what he could feel and the movements that I was having trouble with, it was most likely a partially torn rotator cuff. He said I was best off doing certain types of stretching, which I did, and then rebuilding muscle around the scar tissue slowly, which I started to do.
At this point, I don't notice any weakness in that shoulder really, I think it may still be there a bit but I haven't noticed it being a big issue anyway. I'm still careful with my shoulder joints because they are so sensitive.
On 3 separate occasions I have injured my neck pretty badly, one requiring several days in bed and a lot of vicodin, which didn't really numb the pain that much at all sadly, haha. That was the last straw for me, doing shrugs to build those muscles. I decided it wasn't worth the pain and now I just don't bother doing them, they get enough exercise with other activities, they don't need to be any larger. I had 3 issues with them before and neck injuries are so painful it's not worth it.
Unfortunately weight-lifting is really a touchy activity if you're trying to become bigger, rather than just doing it for some cardio benefits and minor toning, in which case it's not dangerous or risky at all unless you really are a moron, haha. But if you're trying to pack on the muscle mass and push yourself, it's this really delicate line. They say it's a fine line between insanity and genius, well, it's a fine line between the perfect hardcore workout and a workout that stops you from working out for a week. I've had that happen a lot of times in my workout career, but especially after breaks. It's something I've gotten a lot better at finally, but if you don't work out for two weeks for whatever reason, your mind and ego says, "Oh, you're doing the same weight you were before, no way are you going to admit you can't do what you did before!" So you do it, it's awkward, and you injure yourself, then you don't work out for a week because you were trying to be a show off or a moron, haha, I call that a "false start" because it's embarrassing, now you have to wait to do another work out and this time come back with a little humility. The best attitude is not to worry about what weight you were doing before, you just think how positive it is that you are working out and doing your best, that's really what is important. And the longer you've been working out, too, I find the more accepting you are of the time it takes to get your form back. Like when I first started, if I got the flu for a week and then had to face the reality that I wouldn't be in the shape I was in before the flu until another two weeks, that was really depressing. I saw it not just as 3 weeks wasted but even more because during that 3 weeks I would have been moving up and instead I'll be lucky if I just can get back to where I was. Now I realize 3 weeks, come on, that's no biggie in the scheme of things, it's better to move up slower and keep a steady pace, no injuries, than to try to get it back too quickly.
Also injuries and setbacks make you appreciate just how amazing it feels to be at your best, in perfect shape. No matter how great you are at working out, and I certainly was a hardcore workout fanatic for three years, until the last year and a half when I've been struggling up and down a bit, the points where you truly reach a peak are to be savored. I used to be so ambitious and take it for granted that I would always just keep moving up that when I first benched 225, I was really excited about it but I was also thinking too much about doing more, like, "Ok I did 225, wow, great, that was sweet. Gee, better be able to do 235 next week at least, then I can get to 250 in a few more weeks," etc. And next week I'd come in, somehow a bit more tired than the week before, I'd do my best and somehow that week I'd have trouble doing 185, and when I would try 225 I'd do like 3 reps instead of 8 and think, jeez, what happened?!? And then you realize what a wonderful feeling it is to have a great workout day where everything is strong, your body and mind are in sync, and you are at maximum capacity.
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. I was never advocating anyone doing one rep maxes, let alone beginners. Beginners obviously need to be careful - the shock to the nervous system and tendons and ligaments alone when you first start lifting heavy weight suggests you not go super heavy until you have a little experience. In addition, beginners are far more likely to sacrifice FORM to lift more WEIGHT, whether knowingly or unknowingly.
Although I'd love to be considered as smart as a doctor i'm really not
. Visit the Doc....he knows your medical history and all of your stats so he/she will be able to tell you what you should or should not do....relay that info to a PT or whoever is helping you get started and you should be good to go 
.
