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Old 07-09-2012, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Midwest
2,975 posts, read 4,269,455 times
Reputation: 1941

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doll Eyes View Post
beautiful women don't have 'complaints,' their gripes are considered valid issues. 'complaints' is a word reserved for unattractive women who don't like something. That's one example.

there was a woman on here a few days ago (who I will not name) talking about how she is often too attractive and gets turned down or not asked at all on dates. People were going on and on about how pretty she is and must be something 'wrong' with those guys, etc. -- nobody said anything about complaining though.
i don't think average women have it bad. i really don't. if you are average you can compensate that with a nice body...a few nips and tucks and you have a chance to possibly be above average. in fact, i find that men are more likely to befriend and feel more comfortable around average women than very attractive women anyway.

and can you use some examples of how men treat ugly to average women badly??
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:43 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
8,738 posts, read 9,583,278 times
Reputation: 7507
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyanna View Post
i don't think average women have it bad. i really don't. if you are average you can compensate that with a nice body...a few nips and tucks and you have a chance to possibly be above average. in fact, i find that men are more likely to befriend and feel more comfortable around average women than very attractive women anyway.

and can you use some examples of how men treat ugly to average women badly??

you asked what are the 'perks' of being universally attractive to men -- I gave you an example.

Since you don't think average women have it that bad afterall and plastic surgery will save us all (thank God for this), I'm going to pass on wasting time giving examples. they would be moot.
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Midwest
2,975 posts, read 4,269,455 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doll Eyes View Post
you asked what are the 'perks' of being universally attractive to men -- I gave you an example.

Since you don't think average women have it that bad afterall and plastic surgery will save us all, I'm going to pass on wasting time giving examples. they would be moot.
I was hoping you would describe real life situations--something that occurred in the workplace or at the grocery market..
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:50 PM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,126 posts, read 25,794,118 times
Reputation: 16226
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyanna View Post
i don't think average women have it bad. i really don't. if you are average you can compensate that with a nice body...a few nips and tucks and you have a chance to possibly be above average. in fact, i find that men are more likely to befriend and feel more comfortable around average women than very attractive women anyway.

and can you use some examples of how men treat ugly to average women badly??
Surely!

Pretty women are given promotions or raises, even when they don't deserve them. I had a manager give another girl a promotion over me to full time because she'd 'be easier to look at 40 hours a week'. I noticed a HUUUUGE difference in the way the men I worked with treated the cute blonde girls over the average/not as attractive women. They were nicer, they'd open doors (while shutting them in my face) they offer to pick up lunch for them and then look at me and keep walking, if the pretty girls called in sick there was nothing but sympathy, but when the not so attractive girls did, there was nothing but complaints about how they didn't take their job seriously. The guys would constantly joke about needing more 'eye candy' and would hire women based solely on their looks and the rest of us had to pick up the slack because they would NEVER get fired. Unattractive girls? Fired at the first offense.

I could go on and on about how much better the pretty women are treated. I've witnessed it first hand.
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:57 PM
 
Location: Midwest
2,975 posts, read 4,269,455 times
Reputation: 1941
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetJockey View Post
Surely!

Pretty women are given promotions or raises, even when they don't deserve them. I had a manager give another girl a promotion over me to full time because she'd 'be easier to look at 40 hours a week'. I noticed a HUUUUGE difference in the way the men I worked with treated the cute blonde girls over the average/not as attractive women. They were nicer, they'd open doors (while shutting them in my face) they offer to pick up lunch for them and then look at me and keep walking, if the pretty girls called in sick there was nothing but sympathy, but when the not so attractive girls did, there was nothing but complaints about how they didn't take their job seriously. The guys would constantly joke about needing more 'eye candy' and would hire women based solely on their looks and the rest of us had to pick up the slack because they would NEVER get fired. Unattractive girls? Fired at the first offense.

I could go on and on about how much better the pretty women are treated. I've witnessed it first hand.
That is so ridiculous. And the crazy thing about this is I bet all of those guys have average looking girlfriends. when i go out in public, I usually see guys with girlfriends/wives who are clearly not knockouts.
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:11 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
8,738 posts, read 9,583,278 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyanna View Post
I was hoping you would describe real life situations--something that occurred in the workplace or at the grocery market..

oh. okay, I see.

I can tell you something that happened to me at work. I work in a doctor's office, with several other doctors connected and for the record most doctors are terribly into favoritism and women's looks in the workplace. Another group of men who do this and are worse then doctors are lawyers (which I will never work for again).

Anyways, there are several nurses and other secretaries in this medical office building. There is one woman very attractive, jet black hair greenish eyes, very katy perry looking. She works in an adjacent office, I do not know her personally. But if this woman comes into our side of the building, these doctors and male office workers are coming out of left field to circle around this woman to get attention. It is so embarrassing, watching these grown men vie for attention like that. They will have patients and everything else going on, but will sit around and talk about a bunch of nonsense with this woman as if they have all this free time, in an attempt to keep her engaged in conversation. Suddenly, everyone has something they have to say to her. There was a time when this was going on and I had to interrupt this doctor in my office twice because he had messages or a pharmacy on hold, whatever. This man gave me the look of death b/c I interrupted his conversation with that woman. He had no choice but to leave those other men with her. He snatched these written messages out of my hand and went into the back and closed the door. Everyone seen this. Why should I be embarrassed like that for doing my job? Excuse me. When it was time for me to go home, I asked him about a file something or other, he mumbled something, didn't look up and I closed the door in his face and went home.

I will give you the answers here: "Well she probably just has a great personality," "He could've been having a bad day." Yea that's probably what it was.

Last edited by Doll Eyes; 07-09-2012 at 08:19 PM..
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Old 07-09-2012, 10:03 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,683 posts, read 43,144,896 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetJockey View Post
Surely!

Pretty women are given promotions or raises, even when they don't deserve them. I had a manager give another girl a promotion over me to full time because she'd 'be easier to look at 40 hours a week'. I noticed a HUUUUGE difference in the way the men I worked with treated the cute blonde girls over the average/not as attractive women. They were nicer, they'd open doors (while shutting them in my face) they offer to pick up lunch for them and then look at me and keep walking, if the pretty girls called in sick there was nothing but sympathy, but when the not so attractive girls did, there was nothing but complaints about how they didn't take their job seriously. The guys would constantly joke about needing more 'eye candy' and would hire women based solely on their looks and the rest of us had to pick up the slack because they would NEVER get fired. Unattractive girls? Fired at the first offense.

I could go on and on about how much better the pretty women are treated. I've witnessed it first hand.
That really sucks, JJ. It really does make men sound like a bunch of misogynists who only want attractive women for sex. But, I wonder, how much do these men truly RESPECT these pretty women? Or are they just hoping on the off chance they can charm them into bed? I think some of this is unconscious too, and I know you'll expect this but I think women too treat people differently based on looks. I do think it might be a bit less blatant than men do, though.

I think simple minded people also tend to do the above. They are wowed by superficial beauty. I assure you not everyone, including males, is like this though. People in general kind of let me down far too often...
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:36 AM
 
Location: Up in the air
19,126 posts, read 25,794,118 times
Reputation: 16226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
That really sucks, JJ. It really does make men sound like a bunch of misogynists who only want attractive women for sex. But, I wonder, how much do these men truly RESPECT these pretty women? Or are they just hoping on the off chance they can charm them into bed? I think some of this is unconscious too, and I know you'll expect this but I think women too treat people differently based on looks. I do think it might be a bit less blatant than men do, though.

I think simple minded people also tend to do the above. They are wowed by superficial beauty. I assure you not everyone, including males, is like this though. People in general kind of let me down far too often...
Well, two of the cute, ditzy hot girls got married to two of our pilots, so I'd say it was more than just superficial attraction.

I was always amazed at the difference being attractive made, because me and 3 of the women I worked with were treated sooooo differently, it wasn't just me. We weren't invited to get togethers after work even when they were in the building. I wasn't even invited to my own department meetings, but one of the cute front desk girls was? She didn't even work in the same building. My boss would hold the door open for one of the cute girls and then let it go, even if I was right behind her holding boxes. I wasn't the only one who noticed, either. It was actually one of my male coworkers that brought it up.

When I got laid off, I was replaced by one of those cute girls and she doesn't do even 10% of what I did, the other mechanics do her job for her... But hey, at least she's hot!
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Old 07-10-2012, 03:29 AM
 
Location: CA
3,469 posts, read 6,936,522 times
Reputation: 4779
Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
Because everyone is focused on how you look. You get subtle messaging starting when you are a kid that looks are very important if you are female.

You wouldn't necessary notice this, but starting around age 3, when those relatives come over, the first thing they say to the little girls is "wow, your dress/hair/earrings are really pretty." Or "you look pretty today."

By the time you start school, the pretty hierarchy starts. Young girls are praised less for being smart, or athletic, or reading a book and more for "looking nice." Many people have a double standard when it comes to girls, they aren't supposed to get dirty, be to athletic, etc. You start learning those lessons quickly. The girls who don't look nice are not as well-received as the ones who do.

When the media talks about women in power they comment on their clothing and perceived attractiveness. (Ahem, Sarah Palin, Hilary Clinton, Michelle Obama, Nancy Pelosi, Laura Bush....) And if they aren't conventionally attractive (aka young and pretty with long hair), the media makes fun of them (Margaret Thatcher, Janet Reno).

Why are Michelle Obama's arms and butt size even a topic in the media? What does that have to do with her being first lady? I love to see Michelle Obama's outfits, she is totally a fashion inspiration for me, but seriously, no man in power had endless articles about his outfits. No man in power is criticized for not being "in shape" or being "toned," while every woman's body is up for debate. Even for women not in appearance focused industries (like acting).

This is Olympic season, but I guarantee, the female athletes with the most profiles/media coverage are not the successful ones, but the ones that look good in a dress. How come more people aren't talking about the most successful weight lifter in American history......Sarah Robles? Hmm I don't know, but I am guessing it has a lot to do with the fact she doesn't have a conventionally attractive female body. I have seen tons of coverage about Marlen Esparza, and lots of magazine features. Hmmmm double standard?

Or how about this Olympic swimmer, Rebecca Adlington, who was criticized for being "fat." Hello she is going to the Olympics, how could she not be in shape?
London 2012 Olympics: Rebecca Adlington outraged by constant 'nasty' online abuse over her looks - Telegraph

Be amazed if you can find a woman who manages to overcome decades of messaging, and not be obsessed with appearance.

This is true... great post. A woman's value is much more tied to her looks than a man's is & can almost be the sole determiner of her value.... not to say men have the luxury of actually being valued for who they are either. There's just LESS focus on their appearance when it comes to social value.
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Old 07-13-2012, 01:02 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
26,876 posts, read 28,154,657 times
Reputation: 25988
In case we needed another reminder that achievement is meaningless without "beauty."

The top 30 hottest political women of 2012 | Washington Times Communities

[and some commentary on why this is problematic: http://www.about-face.org/misogynist...omen-of-2012/]
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