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Old 10-23-2013, 10:28 AM
 
1,250 posts, read 1,638,671 times
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It's probably a biological impulse to be attractive for mating purposes which is then buoyed up by today's culture of consumerism. It is one of the great things about getting older since other things matter more. Anyway, even when I was younger, I stayed away from "hen house" women. What's the point of making others feel bad?
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:41 AM
 
1,699 posts, read 3,387,613 times
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I believe that women will have equal freedom as men to be ugly when men have equal pressure as women to be attractive. Ladies, do your part - actively pressure men to look better, with all of the pain, time, energy, and expense that this might entail. Time to flip the script. As a culture we are definitely moving in the direction of giving males a taste of their own medicine. For a while it will be a dark and discordant time with much backlash from men, but this will balance out and resolve after a couple generations at which point we'll be closer to equality than ever before.
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:27 AM
 
571 posts, read 950,775 times
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Yes, of course women have the freedom to be ugly. They can and for the most part, do, whatever they want to do.

As a culture, in the U.S., we dress down more than we used to. I go to the supermarket and see many, many people (men and women) that don't look like they've brushed their hair or done a whole lot of grooming.

As a matter of fact, among certain women, I've heard them talk down too much "primping" and knocking down others for "trying too hard."

I know some of this is regional - some areas of the country are more into appearances, etc. I don't think this is a gender issue.

I groom, I exercise, it's as simple as breathing. This obsessing stuff is an exaggeration. Most people put care into their appearance - and that's pretty healthy. (BTW, we all see extremes on TV and in magazines. Those are easy to turn off and not buy. It's not the reality.)
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:36 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh
21,518 posts, read 22,798,384 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelcake4 View Post
Yes, of course women have the freedom to be ugly. They can and for the most part, do, whatever they want to do.

As a culture, in the U.S., we dress down more than we used to. I go to the supermarket and see many, many people (men and women) that don't look like they've brushed their hair or done a whole lot of grooming.

As a matter of fact, among certain women, I've heard them talk down too much "primping" and knocking down others for "trying too hard."

I know some of this is regional - some areas of the country are more into appearances, etc. I don't think this is a gender issue.

I groom, I exercise, it's as simple as breathing. This obsessing stuff is an exaggeration. Most people put care into their appearance - and that's pretty healthy. (BTW, we all see extremes on TV and in magazines. Those are easy to turn off and not buy. It's not the reality.)
Maybe so, but look at the comments in the threads about the "no excuses" hot mom, or about sexy Halloween costumes or workout clothes. A lot of the women who say that women shouldn't be judged by extreme physical standards or shouldn't have to buy costumes that are short and tight and display lots of skin get called "jealous" or "fat" or "ugly" by people who have no idea what they look like. It is a bit gendered, because I don't see many men being accused of being fat or old as a retort when they disagree with something.

Last edited by fleetiebelle; 10-23-2013 at 11:48 AM..
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:40 AM
 
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It's never going to change, female looks are what makes them attractive. The flip-side would be "Are poor men ever going to be attractive?". The answer is no. Women get by on their looks, and men get by on their money or ability to make money.
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:47 AM
 
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Women already have the freedom to do whatever they want.

The real issue is being mature and/or strong enough to stand by your own decisions in the face of disapproval or disagreement.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:20 PM
 
874 posts, read 1,037,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duchamp Dude View Post
Oh please, that's a fine piece of blog that conveniently ignores that women brought this upon themselves and compete with one another from make up to fashion accessories.

And also play the victim card now
That's exactly why I wouldn't play the victim card. I like fashion and make-up, and I do it for myself. The essay applies to those who make themselves "pretty" for the wrong reasons (eg insecurity, perceived social "acceptance," etc.).
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Old 10-23-2013, 05:11 PM
 
2,601 posts, read 2,993,311 times
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Women have the freedom to be ugly. I see it all the time. Some women seem to care a bit too much (obsessively) about their looks, some seemingly not at all, and some (probably most) just enough. I don't see the big deal. Maybe part of it is for show. I mean, that's a big part of why people decorate their homes inside and out. It's for show. They want it to look good when people visit or drive by. It's why a lot of men have to have fancy tires on their cars. For show. There's nothing wrong with wanting to look your best for whatever reason; and the fact is, even if a person doesn't physically go out of their way to look "pretty" for whatever reason, they're probably doing something for show (fancy decorated house, expensive car, etc.).

I think people who put a little time into their appearance often seem more approachable. People who don't sometimes come off as wanting everyone to stay away from them. I'm sure this isn't always the case, but it can be interpreted that way.
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Old 10-23-2013, 05:57 PM
 
2,429 posts, read 3,067,868 times
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This thread has talked about everything from looks to grooming habits. Let's keep in mind LOOKS are a COMBINATION of physical looks (features, size, etc) -- AND clothing/dress.

in terms of DRESS -- As a woman who dresses down it's be crazy for me not to concede that the woman next to me in high heels, a short skirt and make up, or even a suit and make up....would drawn a male's eye more than I would in a wrinkled Tshirt, baggy slacks, and sneakers...just like the man in uniform or a suit would draw MY attention more than the SAME GUY guy in a Tshirt and jeans.

How about the gorgeous girl, no make up in baggy pants and a tshirt, or the fine guy in holey(sp) shorts and a tshirt....OR the UGLY man or woman dressed to the nines. I'm sure we've all seen plenty of all those scenarios. You can be dressed to the nines and still be 'ugly' physically.

Also "The freedom to be ugly" which is a VISUAL -- has nothing to do with personal hygiene. The OP has nothing to do with not showering or brushing teeth. That's not even what the OP was talking about.

'Grooming" MIGHT fall in between the two -- since you can SEE when a person doesn't comb their hair or their nails are dirty.

Some people go overboard with caring about their looks (for whatever reason)
Some people (me included) couldn't care less. But I'm not looking for a job, there's no advancement at my current job, I don't have a mate, and not going to put on a front to get one.....so unless you sign my paycheck, I don't see why I should look any better or dress any better than I need to for a given situation.

There are instances when being judged by your looks matters and times when it doesn't.
For example -- obviously I'd put on some lipstick for a job interview. But why should I when I don't wear it everyday life feel like I have to? Because it that situation being judged by your looks MATTERS.

The societal pressure comes when people are judged for looks and shouldn't really be judged on that -- when it SHOULDN"T MATTER. But as we all know we human beings are attracted to beauty, and that beauty is SELF-IMPOSED culturally.

The post about the older man who said the girl would be cute is she had boobs. THAT's the kind of ignorance that we all face when being judged by looks. He was just ignorant. Period.

Last edited by rdflk; 10-23-2013 at 07:12 PM..
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Old 10-23-2013, 06:34 PM
 
9,353 posts, read 7,365,606 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdflk View Post
The post about the older man who said the girl would be cute is she had boobs. THAT's the kind of ignorance that we al face when being judged by looks. He was just ignorant. Period.
Not to defend a jerk, but...

What if the guy just likes breasts? That's his right. His idea of what looks good has NO bearing on any woman or how women in general should feel about themselves.

As I see it, too many women seek external validation whether from men, friends, media, etc.

Women can be, do, wear whatever they want. What other people think is irrelevant. The only power other people have over us is the power we give them.
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