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Old 10-24-2013, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,612 posts, read 24,802,203 times
Reputation: 11185

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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleetiebelle View Post
What I got from the initial article is that the question isn't just about women being unattractive in a dating context. Look at how Hilary Clinton gets criticized for her pantsuits or her ponytails, or how Lena Dunham is slammed for being naked on Girls. It's the pervasive attitude in culture that we all deserve to look at pretty women, even when being attractive has nothing to do with being capable or intelligent or whatever the task at hand is. It's a collective "how dare she?" or "why doesn't she dye her hair/get plastic surgery/fix her teeth/etc.?" So yeah, "unattractive" women walk around every day like they're people, but they don't get the perks or the kudos that attractive women do.
Well, such is life. Women are expected to look a certain way. And men are expected to do things. You never hear about a girl "earning her womanhood." Womanhood is a purely a product of a woman's biology. It's different for men.
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Old 10-24-2013, 06:21 PM
 
11,896 posts, read 14,364,183 times
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Ugliness: a gift of the gods to certain women, entailing virtue without humility. - Ambrose Bierce.
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Old 10-24-2013, 10:31 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
13,439 posts, read 15,046,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleetiebelle View Post
What I got from the initial article is that the question isn't just about women being unattractive in a dating context. Look at how Hilary Clinton gets criticized for her pantsuits or her ponytails, or how Lena Dunham is slammed for being naked on Girls. It's the pervasive attitude in culture that we all deserve to look at pretty women, even when being attractive has nothing to do with being capable or intelligent or whatever the task at hand is. It's a collective "how dare she?" or "why doesn't she dye her hair/get plastic surgery/fix her teeth/etc.?" So yeah, "unattractive" women walk around every day like they're people, but they don't get the perks or the kudos that attractive women do.
No, I'm surrounded by not that attractive women all the time. Mostly lawyers since I work in the legal field, but we interact with surgeons, engineers, corporate officers. Some women are very well presented, others focus more on their careers. They have enough self-confidence to wear pantsuits like Hilary Clinton and not be worried by banal comments about how they don't have perfect teeth. It's not really any different with men. There's a few Captain America-types out there in their 40s with less body fat than your average college student dressed to the nines but even more overweight sloppy dressers. The majority of the Captain America-types aren't the banal losers. They take pride in their appearance but also aren't stupid to judge on looks which matter very little in the professional world. No different with men. Most successful men and women aren't successful because of looks. Maybe a model can be an airhead with a nasty personality, but that's about it.
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Old 10-25-2013, 12:21 AM
 
2,429 posts, read 3,054,833 times
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Quote:
They take pride in their appearance but also aren't stupid to judge on looks which matter very little in the professional world.
Well, some people (bosses, decision makers, interviewers, clients) somewhere are judging by appearances because it's my understanding the studies have clearly shown that more attractive/more beautiful people get jobs, and promotions, and opportunities others who are just as qualified but not so pretty to look at don't get.

Sure there's a peer pressure element to all this but I think, as insightful posters have pointed out, it's also and perhaps MOSTLY that not dressing well, or looking pretty, or being attractive as you can comes with a societal price of NOT getting the job or assignment one is perfectly qualified for, because of looks that have nothing to do with one's qualifications. (Let alone attracting a mate.)

I'm dating myself here young folks won't even know the names -- but Ruth Buzzi or Sophia Loren -- who do YOU think is getting the job. Or not even such an obvious beauty difference. How about Meryl Streep or Susan Sarandon?........Kathy Bates or Annette Benning?.....Adele or Carrie Underwood? Nigela Lawson or Paula Deen?

And it's not just women...who'd get the job John Goodman or Hugh Jackman? Steve Buscemi or Kevin Costner? Tony Goldwyn (that fine thing on Scandal. Oh, sorry) or Drew Carey?

Last edited by rdflk; 10-25-2013 at 12:39 AM..
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Old 10-25-2013, 02:42 AM
 
Location: Europe
2,731 posts, read 1,956,946 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlanta_BD View Post
As long as men are men, women will not have the freedom to be ugly. While there are exceptions to every rule, at the end of the day, men like hot women. No way around that. You get more things out of life (and from men) when you are an attractive woman (it could even affect your job opportunities).

It's been that way since the beginning of time. If a woman is smart, she will make sure she's looking her best.

I think my hubby is the greatest MAN ever. More man of him than I never met before of anyone else. It is not about looks of women he says, it is about souls There is wise men around if are looking .. but of course some women are content with those "boys are boys", "men are men" , forever teenagers who have no brains but only something in their pants.

"men are men" means kiddos.. A MAN is something else

Each to their own
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Old 10-25-2013, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Montgomery County, MD
3,241 posts, read 3,148,138 times
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WTF, since when don't women have freedom to be ugly? I guess that goes for models and actresses but ugly women hold most high status jobs other than those. Im from DC and its very true there. You have to be a bit deluded to think female appearances play a factor in high end jobs when its only low end stuff like bartender/ waitress or promo model where looks matter. Elena Kagen got into the Supreme Court because guys all wanted to bone her?
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
26,876 posts, read 28,154,657 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhenomenalAJ View Post
WTF, since when don't women have freedom to be ugly? I guess that goes for models and actresses but ugly women hold most high status jobs other than those. Im from DC and its very true there. You have to be a bit deluded to think female appearances play a factor in high end jobs when its only low end stuff like bartender/ waitress or promo model where looks matter. Elena Kagen got into the Supreme Court because guys all wanted to bone her?
No the problem is that despite their professional accomplishments, these women will still be judged on their looks.


I am on my phone, please forgive the typos.
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,612 posts, read 24,802,203 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
No the problem is that despite their professional accomplishments, these women will still be judged on their looks.
But why can't men be judged on our looks alone? I wish I could walk down the street and get approached with marriage proposals and women offering to take me on 5-star vacations. A beautiful woman can live a life of privilege without ever having done anything.


T.I. - Whatever You Like [OFFICIAL VIDEO] - YouTube
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,612 posts, read 24,802,203 times
Reputation: 11185
Will men ever have the freedom to not be successful? When the money goes, will the honeys stay when they gray skies replace the sunny days?


Money Goes, Honey Stay (When The Money Goes Remix) - YouTube
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Old 10-25-2013, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh
21,465 posts, read 22,706,474 times
Reputation: 45139
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
But why can't men be judged on our looks alone? I wish I could walk down the street and get approached with marriage proposals and women offering to take me on 5-star vacations. A beautiful woman can live a life of privilege without ever having done anything.
It's interesting that you think being judged solely on your looks is a good thing. Women are people above and beyond what they look like. While a sincere compliment is flattering, a guy approaching a woman on the street with a marriage proposal knows nothing about her other than what she looks like. To him, she's just an object or a status symbol, not a human being. The "beautiful" woman living a life of privilege on someone else's dime based entirely on her appearance has a shelf life. What is she going to do in 5, 10, 20 years when her man finds someone younger and prettier and she has nothing to fall back on?
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