Flagstaff Proposed New Name: Abundance With A View (Phoenix, Prescott: sales, good credit)

[ZonyPony]

Originally Posted by zonababe

The locals have shortened the name Flagstaff to Flag. If they are too lazy to use two syllables do you think they will use a descriptive phrase?

Lazy? Nah... the good people of Flagstaff are not lazy. "Flag" has always been a pretty cool word to use when speaking about Flagstaff, but it certainly doesn't work for all cities or towns. For example - Phoenix, FEE? And Tucson, Toos? Haha!

[Lovehound]

Originally Posted by zonababe

The locals have shortened the name Flagstaff to Flag. If they are too lazy to use two syllables do you think they will use a descriptive phrase?

It has been called that ("Flag") for decades, maybe even more than a century. I think you might as well get used to it.

Originally Posted by Tom Lane

(ABQ = "The Duke City").

"Duke City" not "The Duke City"

Originally Posted by Greatday

Also - I would hazard a guess that Trader Joes has scoped out Flagstaff - did their demographics and said - NO. You might check with Trader Joes corp

I agree. Flag is not a Trader Joe's kind of place.

[motormaker]

[QUOTE

"Duke City" not "The Duke City"

.[/quote]

Hmmm.

Albuquerque’s negative equity hits 9% - New Mexico Business Weekly:

[carecare7]

Ok, the "Poverty with a View" slogan fits Flagstaff but think about why it is being bandied about in the media so much. Think about it. People here don't want Flagstaff to "grow" because they think that growth means a loss of their small town feeling that they have now. If they make people think it is a bad place to live, people may stop considering it. Especially if the slogan is really true; second home markets have driven the prices up, up, up here so people really wish that would stop.
Just saying.....

[CCCVDUR]

Originally Posted by Greatday

Because - Flagstaff is not a "liberal" town Also, they do no want to cater to "liberal, Bohemian students".

Originally Posted by Greatday

Also - I would hazard a guess that Trader Joes has scoped out Flagstaff - did their demographics and said - NO. You might check with Trader Joes corp

Flagstaff IS a strongly liberal market among YOUNG people 18-34. Beyond that, not as much. When I moved here last spring, I asked every single store clerk for 2 weeks if this was a liberal town. 90% said YES.

Coconino Co. (where "flag" is) has been one of about 5 counties in AZ to vote Democratic in the last 2 presidential elections - 65% Obama 2008; 60% Kerry 2004. The Navajo and Hopi nations endorsed Obama. In terms of gay marriage, while AZ voted FOR the ban, Flagstaff voted AGAINST the ban.

While the town, as you suggest, may not want to cater to liberal Bohemian students, they really should - Trader Joes, Whole Foods, Vitamin Cottage, REI, 24 hr fitness, and Costco would increase tax revenues for The City.

Santa Fe, Albuquerque, and Boulder have allowed these stores in, with great results. Read any Craigs List list of rentals for those towns, and landlords will advertise, "Hey, we're 2 blocks from Trader Joes and Flying Star and 6 blocks from Whole Foods and Vitamin Cottage." Why? Because they know how popular these are as places to hang out.

These places offer bulletin boards for small businesses to place their ads, and people to post places for rent. And, they feature restaurant/delis for young people to sit down over coffee. Go to Santa Fe and Albuquerque to the La Montiana Co-Ops, Sattelite Coffee, Flying Star, etc. and see the sense of community, which Flagstaff really needs.

Nevertheless, Flagstaff is the most conservative place I've ever lived, with the exception of Boulder City, Nevada. Arizona is one of the most socially conservative states in the US, rivaling that of several Southeastern states. New Mexico and Colorado are MUCH more liberal than Arizona.

On the other hand, having an office of "smart growth," as AZ has in the AZ Dept. of Commerce, which involves restrictions on development including Impact Fees, is NOT conservative, it is bordering on Socialism. "Smart Growth" policies have been shown to increase the cost of living by Drs. Angel and Cox, as I wrote in other posts.

If U want to start a business, go to New Mexico for tax breaks.

[CCCVDUR]

carecare7 wrote:
Ok, the "Poverty with a View" slogan fits Flagstaff but think about why it is being bandied about in the media so much. Think about it. People here don't want Flagstaff to "grow" because they think that growth means a loss of their small town feeling that they have now. If they make people think it is a bad place to live, people may stop considering it. Especially if the slogan is really true; second home markets have driven the prices up, up, up here so people really wish that would stop.
Just saying.....

tom responds:
It's not only the second home issue, in my opinion. In my view, I think that it's the Smart Growth policies enacted by the State of Arizona (the Arizona Dept. of Smart Growth; SmartGrowth Home Page (http://www.azcommerce.com/SmartGrowth/ - broken link)) that Flagstaff and all Arizona cities must abide by.

Flagstaff is re-writing their land code right now. the Impact Fees, part of the Smart Growth act, are tagged on to the price of your home, your apartment, and stuff you might buy at a brand new store in town.

So, the Poverty with a View traces itself to the Arizona Department of Smart Growth and the Flagstaff City Council that consists of tree huggers to the extreme. When so much land is off limits to development, demand continues to increase in a town that everyone is trying to move to, but supply diminishes. Result: home values go up and up as you point out. Yes, when vacation homes are vacant for part of the year, this contributes to less supply available to renters, especially students who then have to pay huge rents w/ aforementioned property managers (but not mine!)

As a Fiscal Libertarian I don't agree, but majority rules as it should -- and for now, people in Flag keeping voting people onto the City Council who are environmentalists with anti-growth viewpoints. I'm a big fan of Morgan Hagaman, but I don't think he would ever get elected here unless people became informed of the Arizona Dept. of Smart Growth. Hagaman would win by a landslide in pro-business Albuquerque, where you can rent a house in Rio Rancho for $800/month

And the irony in all this is that among places I consider moving to, one thing at the top of my agenda as a bicyclist is an urban trail system (like Flag, Albuquerque, Boulder, etc.). Flag has done a great job with the FUTS. However I think people need to come before pine trees....

[falastudent]

YouTube - flagnet1's Channel

[azriverfan.]

Originally Posted by Tom Lane

Flagstaff IS a strongly liberal market among YOUNG people 18-34. Beyond that, not as much. When I moved here last spring, I asked every single store clerk for 2 weeks if this was a liberal town. 90% said YES.

Coconino Co. (where "flag" is) has been one of about 5 counties in AZ to vote Democratic in the last 2 presidential elections - 65% Obama 2008; 60% Kerry 2004. The Navajo and Hopi nations endorsed Obama. In terms of gay marriage, while AZ voted FOR the ban, Flagstaff voted AGAINST the ban.

While the town, as you suggest, may not want to cater to liberal Bohemian students, they really should - Trader Joes, Whole Foods, Vitamin Cottage, REI, 24 hr fitness, and Costco would increase tax revenues for The City.

Santa Fe, Albuquerque, and Boulder have allowed these stores in, with great results. Read any Craigs List list of rentals for those towns, and landlords will advertise, "Hey, we're 2 blocks from Trader Joes and Flying Star and 6 blocks from Whole Foods and Vitamin Cottage." Why? Because they know how popular these are as places to hang out.

These places offer bulletin boards for small businesses to place their ads, and people to post places for rent. And, they feature restaurant/delis for young people to sit down over coffee. Go to Santa Fe and Albuquerque to the La Montiana Co-Ops, Sattelite Coffee, Flying Star, etc. and see the sense of community, which Flagstaff really needs.

Nevertheless, Flagstaff is the most conservative place I've ever lived, with the exception of Boulder City, Nevada. Arizona is one of the most socially conservative states in the US, rivaling that of several Southeastern states. New Mexico and Colorado are MUCH more liberal than Arizona.

On the other hand, having an office of "smart growth," as AZ has in the AZ Dept. of Commerce, which involves restrictions on development including Impact Fees, is NOT conservative, it is bordering on Socialism. "Smart Growth" policies have been shown to increase the cost of living by Drs. Angel and Cox, as I wrote in other posts.

If U want to start a business, go to New Mexico for tax breaks.

Flagstaff is clearly liberal and those businesses you mentioned would do well there. I agree that New Mexico is more liberal than Arizona but I don't agree that Colorado is. In terms of feel, Arizona is more liberal than Colorado and far more liberal than any Southeastern state and many Southwestern states like Oklahoma and Texas. I've lived in all of those areas and to say that Arizona is conservative like them is inaccurate to say the least. Just Our conservatives are Goldwater conservatives not Evangelical/Bible Belt/Southern conservatives which have two entirely different ideologies and culture and share little in common aside from seeking to minimize taxes. To be accurate, Arizona is more of a liberatarian state but votes Republican because that party reflects those values more than the Democratic party. Colorado has a strong Evangelical Christian population which is very socially conservative but unlike their evangelical counterpart states, they tend to vote Democrat due to the social welfare aspects. It's doubtful Arizona would have voted Republican in the last election had McCain not been from the state; Arizona voted for a Democratic President in 1996 to which Colorado voted for Bob Dole that year. Arizona has a lot of Barry Goldwater conservatives in the sense they want to keep taxes low but in regards to social values, I feel like it is more liberal than Colorado due to its proximity to California and obvious population exchange with that state. And Phoenix voted against the gay marriage ban first and only recently overturned it so the state wasn't strongly in favor of it. And Arizona continues to become more liberal as people from California, and the Upper Midwest continue to move here in droves due to the high cost of living in California and the rust belt nature of the upper Midwest.

[CCCVDUR]

Originally Posted by azriverfan.

Flagstaff is clearly liberal and those businesses you mentioned would do well there...........(truncated).........And Arizona continues to become more liberal as people from California, and the Upper Midwest continue to move here in droves due to the high cost of living in California and the rust belt nature of the upper Midwest.

Great post. How would you compare the Politics of the outdoors towns of 1) Flagstaff, AZ 2) Durango, CO and 3) Boulder, CO ?

[locoenlacabeza]

Hahaha I think poverty with a view did used to suit Flagstaff well, now I'd just call it poverty.