[ssg II]

Originally Posted by Robyn55

I hope your changes work out for you. Let us know what happens. I am honestly interested. I've observed that many diners in this general area are both ignorant of good food and cheap. A pretty toxic combination when it comes to a decent or better "restaurant scene". Robyn

Amazingly enough, I have not been bitched-out or even questioned for asking for a credit card to hold a reservation larger than ten. The only person requesting reservations, who declined to guarantee with a CC was for a party of 25 and that was a group I remember. Last time the 25 was 5 adults and 5 children. Wow. We know how much money kids spend on food & booze and I remember having to ask them to vacate the second table when the remainder of their party was more than an hour late. They had a fit. Sorry, but let them torment somebody else!

So far, so good!

[Robyn55]

Good to hear that things are going well. Sometimes a little reality testing is a good thing . Robyn

[ssg II]

The next test will be our St. Pat's Party. Sometimes parties of 30 or more. Who's gonna take the risk? Should be interesting. I'll keep you posted.

Thanks!

[kyle19125]

Originally Posted by ssg II

The next test will be our St. Pat's Party. Sometimes parties of 30 or more. Who's gonna take the risk? Should be interesting. I'll keep you posted.

Thanks!

Sounds crazy. Did you ever go with the policy of not seating until the entire party arrives? Allowing some to sit at the tables and camp out until everyone arrives is killing your turnover. Many restaurants utilize that policy and it certainly is among the best in terms of running your business profitably.

[ssg II]

No turnover for the large tables on some nights. They come for dinner, the music and have the table all night. What am I to do? Nothing. It's their table. They had dinner and maybe one drink. It's more like a supper-club, but none of them drink like the "Rat-Pack."

Not seating until the entire party arrives? That's not even a consideration. Kyle, you know who I'm dealing with...These people want to walk all over you. And telling them they have to wait to be seated until the entire party shows would be chaos at the front door.

When I greet them at the door and ask if they have a reservation, they say yes, but don't know the name it's under. Maybe it's Bob & Sue. We don't take reservations under first names. Try again. Well I know it's a party of 8 or 10 or 6. Let's see, we have several parties tonight....

I want to blow my fuc**ng my brains out.

[Robyn55]

Originally Posted by ssg II

The next test will be our St. Pat's Party. Sometimes parties of 30 or more. Who's gonna take the risk? Should be interesting. I'll keep you posted.

Thanks!

Let us know what happens on Monday. Robyn

[kyle19125]

Originally Posted by ssg II

No turnover for the large tables on some nights. They come for dinner, the music and have the table all night. What am I to do? Nothing. It's their table. They had dinner and maybe one drink. It's more like a supper-club, but none of them drink like the "Rat-Pack."

Not seating until the entire party arrives? That's not even a consideration. Kyle, you know who I'm dealing with...These people want to walk all over you. And telling them they have to wait to be seated until the entire party shows would be chaos at the front door.

When I greet them at the door and ask if they have a reservation, they say yes, but don't know the name it's under. Maybe it's Bob & Sue. We don't take reservations under first names. Try again. Well I know it's a party of 8 or 10 or 6. Let's see, we have several parties tonight....

I want to blow my fuc**ng my brains out.

As I've maintained that's what happens when you let the customers dictate your policies and until you modify policies they're in charge, you'll still be running around like one of their minions and the restaurant's profits will continue along well below potential thanks to lack of table turns and turning away other customers. You can help to eliminate the chaos but informing people when they reserve for large parties such pieces of information as you will be holding the table for 15 minutes beyond the reserved time to help eliminate tables sitting empty for long periods of time during peak hours and also that you will not seat until the entire party has arrived, and if that goes 15 minutes beyond the reserved time you'll do your best to fit them in someplace else. You're not a running a private club for these people and they need to realize that current practices aren't acceptable for profitable operation of the business...which is what you're running! Sadly you've provided an expectation which isn't optimal but with polite, consistent reinforcement of new policies you can and will change to a more orderly, more profitable way of doing business. Otherwise you've seen the future, and it isn't pretty is it?

[Robyn55]

Originally Posted by ssg II

No turnover for the large tables on some nights. They come for dinner, the music and have the table all night. What am I to do? Nothing. It's their table. They had dinner and maybe one drink. It's more like a supper-club, but none of them drink like the "Rat-Pack."

Not seating until the entire party arrives? That's not even a consideration. Kyle, you know who I'm dealing with...These people want to walk all over you. And telling them they have to wait to be seated until the entire party shows would be chaos at the front door.

When I greet them at the door and ask if they have a reservation, they say yes, but don't know the name it's under. Maybe it's Bob & Sue. We don't take reservations under first names. Try again. Well I know it's a party of 8 or 10 or 6. Let's see, we have several parties tonight....

I want to blow my fuc**ng my brains out.

What kind of music do you have? When we used to go out to places like Ragtime that had music on some nights - people would stick around after they were finished eating to listen to the music. That was the main draw - coming to listen to the music. The bands often had 2 sets - with perhaps a 20/30 minute intermission between the early set (which didn't start all that early) and the late set. Some might have even had 3 sets (we never stuck around to midnight to find out ). The intermission was usually long enough to encourage the "music crowd" to clear out when the set was finished.

If the music is causing issues with things like customers overstaying their welcome - perhaps you can restructure what you're offering? Like 2 sets - 2 seatings. What are your dinner hours - and how many table turns do you reckon you need to do ok? How are the music offerings structured? Also - is there any demand for things like 8 pm and later seatings? Note that many/most restaurants I go to these days have 2 seatings over the weekend - most commonly 7 and 9 pm. I like to eat at 8 - so I go out on weekdays . I do go to some single seating restaurants (none in this metro area) - but they're basically high end restaurants that serve the same multi-course "chef's menu of the night" to everyone (and the meals tend to run 3-4 hours). A very different kind of operation than the one you're running.

From your customers' POV - if you're running things like a dinner theater - dinner and a music show after - they're going to treat it like a dinner theater. So perhaps the basic format has to be changed. Robyn

[Robyn55]

P.S. In terms of not seating large parties before all have arrived. If you have a separate bar - tell the early arrivals that they can have a drink at the bar while they're waiting. Also have benches/chairs outside for people who don't want to have a drink while they're waiting. FWIW - I assume you're talking about situations where - for example - a party of 8 is showing up in dribs and drabs over a 15 minute (or longer) period of time. Not one where 2 people in the party are showing up 5 minutes late.

[ssg II]

First of all, thanks for all your advice. I will heed it.

We do have a bar, but it's usually full by the time the "reservations" arrive and probably 50% of our customers don't drink and are actually offended by the suggestion if we do have barstools available. Others claim physical issues which prohibit them from sitting on a barstool or at the bistro tables.

Great idea, but two seatings just isn't doable, Robyn. The music varies from night to night. The Tuesday night band does a 2 hour set, attracts a very senior & pleasant crowd, and the place is empty by 9:30, which is fine. We wouldn't turn the tables on a Tuesday anyway.

The problem night is Friday. The bands start at 7, do a 3-4 hour set and most of the crowd leaves by 10. We have benches outside, but the winter's been cold & rainy, so they all congregate inside the front door. We have a patio bar, which will be open now that the weather's improved, but some waiting for tables refuse to sit there, because "people smoke." Oh, well.

I think I've got to be dealing with the rudest, whiniest people on earth. And Kyle, you're correct. Some of them think this is their private club because they patronize us once or twice a month. I've done my best to accommodate them, have increased business and it's back-fired. We can't take reservations during Bike Week, which just passed, and one of the Friday night snowbird a**holes grabbed me by the arm and informed me that they live in Palm Coast. (Surprise, surprise and I'm supposed to be impressed or intimidated? Guess they're confused with Palm Beach! ) And how dare we not take reservations from people who spend money all year. I'd never seen the guy before.

However, part of the problem is the owners, who remain clueless about their own business. They sit at the end of the bar near the front door (drinking) and have been known to drag half my kitchen staff out of an already stressed kitchen, to bring in extra tables & chairs to seat people without reservations. Now the kitchen is totally out of synch, backed-up and we don't have enough servers to take care of them. Thought I had explained to them and they finally understood, this was not the thing to do, but they pulled it again on my night off a couple of weeks ago. They, of course, never give up their barstools or table for customers. Some nights a third of the bar is taken up by them & their friends. No revenue & no tip.

Well, enough whining from me!

Thanks again for your input!!!