[NYLATINQT]

I have been on this site for a few days and find it very interesting. I've read about FLA, GA and NC in particular. I am from NY, moved to Fla in 2004 then GA 2006. I'm finding a common theme. People from up north move South in search of a better life, then they get there, complain because they hate it and then move back. The people that are from the South complain that we complain and want us out. So i sat here thinking "why is there such a pattern?" I think I know now. I remember 10 yrs ago visiting Florida and it was fantastic. It was dirt cheap, not too crowded, everybody was happy. Ditto GA, Ditto NC. As real estate prices started to climb in the mid 90s, (which hit the NE harder than other areas because it was always expensive to begin with), Northerners had to find other areas in which to live. In our minds we always think of these states as they traditionally have been. Well with all of the real estate developments that sprang up overnight, we of course, ran to them. Almost overnight, Fla, GA, NC, etc...lost their small town feel, schools became overcrowded, the roads were not designed to be able to accomodate quadruple the number of cars on the road, etc....The quality of life went down the drain in about a 10yr span.
Didn't these developers think about all of this? What happened to zoning laws or city planners in general? I see all they did think about was putting up more strip malls with the usual supermarket in place, then comes Walmart, and then all of a sudden it's considered a "community."
I think the reason people from the North hate the South when they move there is not because of the people so much (but we are different, let's be honest), but it's because the neighborhoods are so sterile, so bland, there is no sense of community. All of the homes look exactly the same in the subdivisions. I didn't even know about subdivisions until I moved South. you buy a home and then somebody tells you what you can and cannot do? Sounds like renting to me. It's just plain stupid. So I vote to blame all of the greedy real estate developers that are basically ruining this country. If you read threads from other areas, especially the West coast, they are having the same problems. It's like people keep running from state to state to try to find a decent place to live and most places worth living in are over priced, overcrowded, and it's one big mess. I was not born in this country but i've been here almost my entire life. I feel the quality of life in America is slipping. I work for a credit counseling agency and I can tell you that bankruptcies are still super high, the new laws didn't really do any good, and foreclosure rates are going up faster than ever. People can't afford to live any more. I hate to complain when I don't have a solution. Any thoughts?

[BlueWillowPlate]

Well, there is some truth to what you say about the developers: people did get greedy and there was a bubble and the air is now coming out of it.
However, cookie cutter architecture did not originate in the South, nor is it concentrated there.
One of the building industry's very first subdivisions created was Levittown, on Long Island in New York. It was built shortly after World War II.
I could walk into anybody's house on my block and know *exactly* where everything was.
Highlands Ranch in Colorado became the poster child for sterile, cookie cutter, suburban sprawl, with boxy homes that had garages but no front porches.

Northwest Florida is attempting to stave off this type of growth.

[Prichard]

No, it's not the developers. Developers only develop land in areas where people want to move. They are just a reaction to the demand for houses, etc. that others have already created.

The real blame lies with Democrats and Unions. People are moving from CT, NY, NJ, IL, and some of the other northern states because 1) the unions have run off industry, and 2) Demcrats have taxed their citizens to the point where they will uproot and move south. Notice that it is citizens from the Blue States flocking to the Red States, and not the reverse.

Some may be inclined to blame it on the weather. But the weather is really a neutral factor. For example, you have Californians flocking to Colorado. And, if there is any truth to Global Warming, which there probably is, then you would think people would try to get out of the sweltering heat by moving north. Jobs and Taxes. The North has too much of one and not enough of the other - THAT'S what is responsible for the migration, not developers.

[SPLIT]

NY: I have your similiar trend. After 25 years shoveling snow and even working in the Catskill ski industry , wanted warm weather all year to ride motorcycles and see Daytona motor events. As a retiree Fla was a bargain from NY taxes. For 10 years the party was friendly and the housing developments expanded because everyone had 3 other brothers and sisters move to their same street when they retired . Other Michigan people came cause "You can not run from a Michigan Winter!", and I'll take a 3 day notice from a hurricane. Last 2 years changed the insurance ind and taxes went sky high when you moved into a different house and lost your homestead Original price ( 3% rise cap /yr) . So of course us retirees starting looking other states for value. We go HALFWAY back to NE to sample the mountains of NC North Ga and now TENN, the one nice thing we missed moving to Fla. My Tenn expenses are 1/3 rd of what central Fla wanted for summer 2006 budget. I have my double Porches you mention, and all my new neighbors (From FLA) up and down my street. If you dislike Ga, you need to cross over border to Chattanooga.

[pixiewytch]

LMAO, I'm not going to touch that political theory with a ten foot pole but let's just say I adamantly disagree. Despite how progressive some people think Fl is, it has turned into a Republican/conservative state, so if things here are messed up, I wouldn't say the democrats are to blame. For those of you who may have been living under a rock, good ole Jebbie has been governor of our state for quite a number of years now and most of our legislators are Republican. So there you go.

However, I have a little backdoor insight to this whole developer thing because my husband is a civil design engineer. He is the go between for developers. The company he works for builds huge residential communities and strip malls. He hopes to someday leave his field because of the corruption he has seen. Although it is certainly true that developers wouldn't be building if people didn't buy, it is also true that they can be the most ruthless and aggressive destroyers of native land. They constantly look for ways around this "saving endangered species" stuff. They just want to plow it down and make a mint. They want the project done, they want it done now, and they want to make the largest profit possible, at anyone or anything else's expense. I can't tell you how many subdivisions have gone up around here touting the name of some native species (like gopher tortoises for instance) that my husband says were killed or if they were lucky, displaced by the bulldozers that came in.

Then of course they hire illegal immigrants with little or no training to build homes and pay them a meager under the table wage to save even more money. Let's not even mention the billions of dollars they are already making off of said project.

So I wouldn't say developers are to blame for all of it but I would say that they absolutely do not care about anything but a large profit so it is fair to say that they can take a large part of the blame.

Unfortunately though, as long as people shop in droves at Walmart and get suckered into buying these sort of housing developments that destroy the ecosystem, the developers will keep on going and making all the money.

[BigJimSlade]

I agree with much of what LATINQT had to say. I suppose as long as people want to live in giant (or even tiny) homes on lots where there is no yard and the houses are 8 feet apart, then I suppose they will keep selling. However, so many of those crud homes are on the market here in Tampa now, I wouldn't be surprised if they take years to sell. The only ones I have seen sell are for under $200K (borderline ghetto these days), or a very special lot like the one we lucked out and just got. But LATINQT is right, if you want a decent looking yard, you either have to pay $600K for a new house with land and charm or look for a house built before 1990 (and then possibly no one will insure you).

[alexander59]

Stop ***** footing around this state is run by republicans and it has gone steady down hill the last 7 years, we are not a union state, we are a right to work state, that means every illegal immigrant gets the job that a union person would have got. Now Jebbie wants to give all illegals liscenses so they can take away the jobs of heavy equipment operators. By the way Jebbie is the husband of a smuggler and the father of two drug and alcohol addicted kids, and the brother of Neil Bush anather scandal and the worse president ever. Before he started to try and clean up Fl he should have cleaned up his own house. Ask the average Floridian if its nicer to live here than it was 7 years ago.The blame lies with the voters who put these politicians in office.

[NYLATINQT]

Originally Posted by cil

Well, there is some truth to what you say about the developers: people did get greedy and there was a bubble and the air is now coming out of it.
However, cookie cutter architecture did not originate in the South, nor is it concentrated there.
One of the building industry's very first subdivisions created was Levittown, on Long Island in New York. It was built shortly after World War II.
I could walk into anybody's house on my block and know *exactly* where everything was.
Highlands Ranch in Colorado became the poster child for sterile, cookie cutter, suburban sprawl, with boxy homes that had garages but no front porches.

Northwest Florida is attempting to stave off this type of growth.

Yes I know Levittown. Used to live about 15 min away. I did hear how they were the first subdivisions back in the day. Except today none of the homes look the same, at least not from the outside. But i get what you mean.

[NYLATINQT]

Originally Posted by Prichard

No, it's not the developers. Developers only develop land in areas where people want to move. They are just a reaction to the demand for houses, etc. that others have already created.

The real blame lies with Democrats and Unions. People are moving from CT, NY, NJ, IL, and some of the other northern states because 1) the unions have run off industry, and 2) Demcrats have taxed their citizens to the point where they will uproot and move south. Notice that it is citizens from the Blue States flocking to the Red States, and not the reverse.

Some may be inclined to blame it on the weather. But the weather is really a neutral factor. For example, you have Californians flocking to Colorado. And, if there is any truth to Global Warming, which there probably is, then you would think people would try to get out of the sweltering heat by moving north. Jobs and Taxes. The North has too much of one and not enough of the other - THAT'S what is responsible for the migration, not developers.

Very interesting point you bring up here. I don't want to start a political debate so I won't comment on it. But i will certainly do some research on what you are saying. Elections are coming up and 2008 presidency as well. Thanks for the heads up. Not all of us are as smart as you.

[bnepler]

Blame can only be placed on those who have moved here. If you'd stayed where you where you would only be complaining about NY, NJ, NC, etc..
Which means where ever they, the complainers, live they wouldn't be happy. Nobody told them to move anyways...