[Arcenal813]

Originally Posted by Linda_d

You obviously think that NYC = New York. It doesn't. There's whole great big state north and west of NYC with about 7 million people in it called "Upstate". Its biggest metro is the Buffalo/Niagara metro with about 1 million people. Then there's Rochester, Syracuse, and Albany, all metros between 900k and 500k. The rest of the area is predominantly rural or small city/small town America. Upstate NY is home to the largest wilderness area east of the Mississippi, the Adirondak Forest Preserve, as well as the Catskill Forest Preserve a few hours outside NYC and one of the nation's largest state parks, Allegany State Park, a couple of hours from Buffalo. Upstate NY, along with Michigan, has one of the longest freshwater shorelines in the North America, including Lakes Erie and Ontario as well as Chautauqua Lake, Lake Champlain, Lake George, the numerous Finger Lakes and all the kettle lakes in the Adirondaks. That's not even considering the man-made reservoirs and lakes like the Allegany Reservoir, Sacandaga Lake, or the Ashokan Reservoir or the many rivers, from the Hudson on the east to the Niagara on the west or the St Lawrence up north. We've also got wild rivers, too, like Au Sable in northern NY and the Genessee in the central part of the state.

Oh, and there's not really much of a rat race here either. Average commute times in the Buffalo metro is about 25 minutes. Albany is longer; maybe 35, especially if you live up in Saratoga County. Mine is 10 minutes, and I live at the opposite end of town from my job. I can make it into my brother's who lives north of Buffalo in about two hours, and that's 90 miles one way.

While NYS is notorious for high property taxes, those are balanced out by low real estate prices in Upstate. Housing costs across Upstate NY, including taxes, are about average for the US, but here you get a whole lot more for your housing dollars. You can buy a decent house in a safe suburban neighborhood of Buffalo in a decent school district for around $100k. You can buy a nice lakefront house on Chautauqua Lake for $200k. You can find rural properties, with houses and acreage, for anywhere from $50-75k and up. Oh, yeah, unless you live in a flood plain, your home owners insurance premiums are usually < $1000 because we don't get hurricanes and all the problems associated with those.

For a retiree, Upstate NY can be very affordable. SS isn't taxed. The first $20k of private pensions aren't taxed. If you're a retired public employee or military, your pension isn't taxed at all. The standard deduction for a single individual is $7500, so a retiree with a private pension doesn't pay tax on his/her first $27,500 of pension benies. NYS also has special tax exemptions for seniors that can save them a significant amount on their school taxes.

We do get cold, snowy weather in the winter, though, and it's also notoriously cloudy in this area, and those are primarily why so many New Yorkers migrate south. Of course, Florida's summertime heat and humidity are at least as infamous as Upstate's cold and snow.

So, sir, don't knock it if you haven't been here.

IIRC,Spring Hillian is from NY...

[jambo101]

After being dragged to Florida by my parents when i was 11 it wasnt long before i found the heat and humidity unbearable, after growing up with it for the next 20 years and working outside in construction after my schooling was over i finally got the chance to immigrate to Canada where i soon discovered i can do a Canadian winter a whole lot better than i can do the seemingly eternal Florida summer.
Different strokes for different folks i guess is the applicable analogy.

[Arcenal813]

Originally Posted by jambo101

After being dragged to Florida by my parents when i was 11 it wasnt long before i found the heat and humidity unbearable, after growing up with it for the next 20 years and working outside in construction after my schooling was over i finally got the chance to immigrate to Canada where i soon discovered i can do a Canadian winter a whole lot better than i can do the seemingly eternal Florida summer.
Different strokes for different folks i guess is the applicable analogy.

Having done the exact opposite of what you did, I agree with you. However, to be fair, neither the cold from Canada nor the Florida summer really ever bothered me too much. I've learned to adapt fairly well.

[Rabflmom]

Originally Posted by jambo101

After being dragged to Florida by my parents when i was 11 it wasnt long before i found the heat and humidity unbearable, after growing up with it for the next 20 years and working outside in construction after my schooling was over i finally got the chance to immigrate to Canada where i soon discovered i can do a Canadian winter a whole lot better than i can do the seemingly eternal Florida summer.
Different strokes for different folks i guess is the applicable analogy.

So are you still in construction in Canada working outside during the 8 or 9 months of winter?

It is hard to compare the working outside in Florida to an inside job and tolerating the cold in Canada if you now work inside up there. There is a big difference from going from the house to the car to a heated or air conditioned job than leaving the house at 6AM working outside for 10 hours in either climate. . I can tolerate the cold winds of Chicago as long as I have the winter coat and all the trimmings on, but that does not mean it is really a thing I would want to do......:-) I kind of prefer not having to grab a coat and boots just to walk out to the mailbox. So yep, different strokes for different folks......which is really a good thing. How boring and how crowded life would be if we all thought the same.

[Spring Hillian]

I know quite a bit about upstate NY. My mother was born and raised in Massena. Most of my cousins are still there or very nearby. Rochester is no bargain and neither is Buffalo. I have family in Onieda.
I lived in NYC for 30 years of my life. I used to enjoy the Catskill animal farm, winter vacations to Hunter Mountain. Watching the ships going through the seaway locks in Massena was always a sight to see.
Yes indeed. Upstate NY can be a wonderful place.

Originally Posted by Linda_d

You obviously think that NYC = New York. It doesn't. There's whole great big state north and west of NYC with about 7 million people in it called "Upstate". Its biggest metro is the Buffalo/Niagara metro with about 1 million people. Then there's Rochester, Syracuse, and Albany, all metros between 900k and 500k. The rest of the area is predominantly rural or small city/small town America. Upstate NY is home to the largest wilderness area east of the Mississippi, the Adirondak Forest Preserve, as well as the Catskill Forest Preserve a few hours outside NYC and one of the nation's largest state parks, Allegany State Park, a couple of hours from Buffalo. Upstate NY, along with Michigan, has one of the longest freshwater shorelines in the North America, including Lakes Erie and Ontario as well as Chautauqua Lake, Lake Champlain, Lake George, the numerous Finger Lakes and all the kettle lakes in the Adirondaks. That's not even considering the man-made reservoirs and lakes like the Allegany Reservoir, Sacandaga Lake, or the Ashokan Reservoir or the many rivers, from the Hudson on the east to the Niagara on the west or the St Lawrence up north. We've also got wild rivers, too, like Au Sable in northern NY and the Genessee in the central part of the state.

Oh, and there's not really much of a rat race here either. Average commute times in the Buffalo metro is about 25 minutes. Albany is longer; maybe 35, especially if you live up in Saratoga County. Mine is 10 minutes, and I live at the opposite end of town from my job. I can make it into my brother's who lives north of Buffalo in about two hours, and that's 90 miles one way.

While NYS is notorious for high property taxes, those are balanced out by low real estate prices in Upstate. Housing costs across Upstate NY, including taxes, are about average for the US, but here you get a whole lot more for your housing dollars. You can buy a decent house in a safe suburban neighborhood of Buffalo in a decent school district for around $100k. You can buy a nice lakefront house on Chautauqua Lake for $200k. You can find rural properties, with houses and acreage, for anywhere from $50-75k and up. Oh, yeah, unless you live in a flood plain, your home owners insurance premiums are usually < $1000 because we don't get hurricanes and all the problems associated with those.

For a retiree, Upstate NY can be very affordable. SS isn't taxed. The first $20k of private pensions aren't taxed. If you're a retired public employee or military, your pension isn't taxed at all. The standard deduction for a single individual is $7500, so a retiree with a private pension doesn't pay tax on his/her first $27,500 of pension benies. NYS also has special tax exemptions for seniors that can save them a significant amount on their school taxes.

We do get cold, snowy weather in the winter, though, and it's also notoriously cloudy in this area, and those are primarily why so many New Yorkers migrate south. Of course, Florida's summertime heat and humidity are at least as infamous as Upstate's cold and snow.

So, sir, don't knock it if you haven't been here.

[Spring Hillian]

Originally Posted by cfbs2691

South Florida lost soooo many parks and public land to the politicians and developers during the boom .... it will turn my stomach forever.

I hope your area stays protected.

Yes, a lot was developed. I will state that I should have been more concise in my posts. Its SE FL where Ie seen way too much population growth. SW FL is totally a different ball game. I think our protected sites will remain as there is more than enough privately owned land around here. Undeveloped lots in their natural state are plentiful.

[PDD]

Nobody goes to Fl anymore, it's too crowded. (Yogi)

[jambo101]

Originally Posted by Rabflmom

So are you still in construction in Canada working outside during the 8 or 9 months of winter?

It is hard to compare the working outside in Florida to an inside job and tolerating the cold in Canada if you now work inside up there. There is a big difference from going from the house to the car to a heated or air conditioned job than leaving the house at 6AM working outside for 10 hours in either climate. . I can tolerate the cold winds of Chicago as long as I have the winter coat and all the trimmings on, but that does not mean it is really a thing I would want to do......:-) I kind of prefer not having to grab a coat and boots just to walk out to the mailbox. So yep, different strokes for different folks......which is really a good thing. How boring and how crowded life would be if we all thought the same.

Actually most of my time here in Canada was spent working in an ice cream factory, much of my time in that job was spent stacking ice cream in the freezers -25F,i didnt mind it a bit.

[Spring Hillian]

Originally Posted by jambo101

Actually most of my time here in Canada was spent working in an ice cream factory, much of my time in that job was spent stacking ice cream in the freezers -25F,i didnt mind it a bit.

Was that an indoor or outside job?

[retired11]

Originally Posted by Spring Hillian

We dont cater to every major automaker, airplane manufacturer and every single industry because it would destroy the natural beauty of the state. You want every major automaker, airplane manufacturer and every single industry in your back yard? You want to chase dollar bills? Try the northern part of the US as I like FL just the way it is.

Chasing dollar bills is a much better pastime than chasing poverty.