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Old 11-24-2008, 10:47 AM
 
26,590 posts, read 54,496,336 times
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Part of the problem is that people aren't wiling to settle for modest housing. They want the McMansion as a starter home. Look back at what our grandparents made due with, modest 3/1 1200 s/f homes to raise their five kids in Admit that most families live in far more space than they need, that it's OK for kids to share bedrooms, that it's OK to only have a single bathroom, that's it's OK to have to commute, that it's OK to not have a pool, that it's OK to live in an established neighborhood, then indeed there are affordable homes available to people making 40-50K a year.
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Old 11-24-2008, 10:57 AM
 
Location: Heartland Florida
9,324 posts, read 23,768,138 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk View Post
Part of the problem is that people aren't wiling to settle for modest housing. They want the McMansion as a starter home. Look back at what our grandparents made due with, modest 3/1 1200 s/f homes to raise their five kids in Admit that most families live in far more space than they need, that it's OK for kids to share bedrooms, that it's OK to only have a single bathroom, that's it's OK to have to commute, that it's OK to not have a pool, that it's OK to live in an established neighborhood, then indeed there are affordable homes available to people making 40-50K a year.
Those are the same homes that were bubble priced to 300-400K a few years back. Now that is why I know that the values are overinflated. Remember it started with drug money and became fueled by funny money.
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Old 11-24-2008, 12:02 PM
 
1,369 posts, read 3,350,506 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by big mean bear View Post
I used to say 1998, but now I say 2001. If prices lowered to what they were in 2001, that would be more than "fair" in my opinion.

If this prediction becomes a reality, they will have to raise taxes to make ends meet and to pay for all the services that northern transplants/malcontents desire ie huge police forces and high tech sewer systems to protect the Manatees. Oh, I forgot, the northern transplants love bike paths as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deep-blue-water View Post
yeah, just because locals are fine with swimming around in feces in the inshore waters doesn't mean everyone is
What do you mean?
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Old 11-24-2008, 12:16 PM
 
26,590 posts, read 54,496,336 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallrick View Post
Those are the same homes that were bubble priced to 300-400K a few years back. Now that is why I know that the values are overinflated. Remember it started with drug money and became fueled by funny money.
They were definitely overinflated three years ago. Now, not so much. I think that the market has settled and we're not going to see all that much more drop.
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Old 11-24-2008, 12:39 PM
 
5,969 posts, read 7,725,550 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk View Post
They were definitely overinflated three years ago. Now, not so much. I think that the market has settled and we're not going to see all that much more drop.
I agree, I think we will see a small drop in prices but it seems to be stabilizing.
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Old 11-24-2008, 01:19 PM
 
Location: Exit 14C
1,555 posts, read 3,713,657 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallrick View Post
In the Miami area the median income is even lower than that and asking prices are still stubbornly high. Little by little deals are popping up, but it will take a long time and a lot of pain before affordable homes become widely available. Much of Dade county was overpriced in the 90's and the the cocaine cowboy days of the 80's were the first time that homes became overpriced.
The median income for an individual or a family though? That seems ridiculously low for a family. For two incomes to only be 35k, it needs to average out to each person making less than $8.50 per hour (so if one person was making $10 per hour, the other would have to be making $7 per hour, etc.). I think the last time I made less than $10 per hour was in the 80s, and yes, I'm including jobs in Florida.

On the other hand, I can't say that, um, I do not "know about" any instances of folks receiving income that wouldn't have shown up in government statistics.
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Old 11-24-2008, 03:00 PM
 
710 posts, read 1,988,147 times
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This is the info from City-Data for Miami-Dade:

Estimated median household income in 2007: $43,650 ($35,966 in 1999)

This county: $43,650
Florida: $47,804
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Old 11-24-2008, 03:15 PM
 
26,590 posts, read 54,496,336 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planetsurf View Post
This is the info from City-Data for Miami-Dade:

Estimated median household income in 2007: $43,650 ($35,966 in 1999)

This county: $43,650
Florida: $47,804
Define household. That's the problem. A "household" can be a single person or a family of 12. The single would be living a comfortable livestyle. The family of 12 would be receiving a ton of government benefits--which wouldn't be counted as income. If I was getting food stamps, section 8, WIC, medicaid/care, etc. and bringing in $43K, even for a family of 12 I'd be fine.
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Old 11-24-2008, 03:53 PM
 
710 posts, read 1,988,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk View Post
Define household. That's the problem. A "household" can be a single person or a family of 12.
Right, and?

Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk View Post
The family of 12 would be receiving a ton of government benefits--which wouldn't be counted as income. If I was getting food stamps, section 8, WIC, medicaid/care, etc. and bringing in $43K, even for a family of 12 I'd be fine.
Again, right, and?

This is a statistic. "Household" has the same definition anywhere when comparing those comparable statistics.

THESE are the household income stats for Miami-Dade (which was discussed) ... when discussing "proper" valuations the VERY GENERAL rule of thumb is median house price = 3-3.5x median household income. By that rule, Miami-Dade is still overvalued for some.
I'd argue that Miami-Dade is a bit of an anomaly because the high-end properties are so high and the retirees, LatAm summer house folks & NYer snowbirds scewing the numbers, but that's another discussion.

Also, as most folks know, Miami is a very have & have nots city. There are MANY VERY poor people here which also throw off statistics and like you said, if they have 12 kids and assistance is adding to their income, they're still too poor to buy.

I believe more folks are now able to buy a modest but safe, decent SFH in Miami-Dade for under $150k -- that's a good thing. MORE are able to buy a ~$100k condo. Also a good thing. As you said, it won't be a McMansion, but if someone wants to get started with property ownership, it IS possible for many/most folks even in "overpriced" Miami.

Last edited by planetsurf; 11-24-2008 at 04:22 PM..
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