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Old 02-25-2007, 08:08 AM
 
133 posts, read 528,812 times
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I like the Pittsburgh house better for having more of an individualistic look and character. If it was in a good area and one had the money, I am getting to where I would rather modernize it to my liking on the inside rather than buy a cookie-cutter house. It's a hard call, as there are so many variables involved. As far as the price goes, it seems there is most likely a reason for a lower price.
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Old 02-25-2007, 10:13 AM
 
Location: palm harbor
471 posts, read 1,509,983 times
Reputation: 238
Quote:
Originally Posted by roaring-rox View Post
I like the Pittsburgh house better for having more of an individualistic look and character. If it was in a good area and one had the money, I am getting to where I would rather modernize it to my liking on the inside rather than buy a cookie-cutter house. It's a hard call, as there are so many variables involved. As far as the price goes, it seems there is most likely a reason for a lower price.
To someone not from the area it may have an individualistic look. To me -having lived in the area-it looks like 99% of the houses you will see in 80% of the neighborhoods built in the 1950's-60's.
Also the white sticker in the window looks like a HUD notice. These houses usually/often have major problems, termites, etc. You can probably assume it is going to cost much more than 55,000 to be able to live in it.
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Old 02-25-2007, 03:24 PM
 
12 posts, read 41,533 times
Reputation: 13
I live in Upper St. Clair (south of Pittsburgh) and most of our houses average $300,000 and up. Property taxes-5-10 thousand a year. Plus they tax your income in the city and I am charged for working in USC. The reason the house looks the way it does is because they don't level the entire lot. Only the place where the house is built. So you have a hill up to your house or one down to your front door. Pittsburgh is a great place to raise kids. Many normal people but I miss the beach and surfing, which I have been doing since the age of 12. We are looking at the Naples area and Sarasota. But I don't like the School Choice idea. If I can't afford the area of the school, I'd better get another job or two. You should pay for what you get...
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Old 02-25-2007, 03:29 PM
 
2,141 posts, read 6,340,034 times
Reputation: 588
Quote:
Originally Posted by soccermamaof3kids View Post
I live in Upper St. Clair (south of Pittsburgh) and most of our houses average $300,000 and up. Property taxes-5-10 thousand a year. Plus they tax your income in the city and I am charged for working in USC. The reason the house looks the way it does is because they don't level the entire lot. Only the place where the house is built. So you have a hill up to your house or one down to your front door. Pittsburgh is a great place to raise kids. Many normal people but I miss the beach and surfing, which I have been doing since the age of 12. We are looking at the Naples area and Sarasota. But I don't like the School Choice idea. If I can't afford the area of the school, I'd better get another job or two. You should pay for what you get...
You can't do much surfing on the gulf side, Wind surfing or wait for a good storm. There are no waves on this side.
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Old 02-25-2007, 06:32 PM
 
17,297 posts, read 25,645,113 times
Reputation: 8567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home View Post
I am curious to see what you think of south FL vs. north FL vs. the northeast states.

I am trying to understand why some people prefer south FL. I consider north FL much more desirable because:

1. Houses cost 1/2 to 2/3 and the land itself is much cheaper.
There's less going on up here. And more land to go around for now, while South Florida is pretty much boxed in between the Coast and the Everglades.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
2. Lower hurricane risk, cheaper hurricane insurance
I'm not so sure about the "lower hurricane risk"!! Less hurricane flood risk, maybe, due to some hilly areas.... but the panhandle has been hit by Ivan and Hurricane Dennis in the past couple of years.

Likewise, besides the active hurricane season a couple years ago down South, you will find hurricanes hitting all up the Southeastern US seaboard. As a matter of fact, North Carolina, that "escape from Florida destination" has been ravaged just as much as Florida in the past 10 years or so:

North Carolina Hurricanes:

Name Category Year Winds
Ophelia Category 1 2005 75
Charley Category 4 2004 125
Alex Category 3 2004 105
Isabel Category 5 2003 145
Floyd Category 4 1999 135
Bonnie Category 3 1998 100
Fran Category 3 1996 105
Bertha Category 3 1996 100
Emily Category 3 1993 100


Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
3. One third the crime, very important for my safety and should be for your family
Again, it depends on where you are. Jacksonville has a high crime rate, for example. But rural areas always tend to have lower crime rates.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
4. Better weather, the summers arent 9 months. Save on a/c and sweat less
Yes, the summers are about 7 months. Save on A/C, more on heat! All my plants died in my backyard last weekend when the temperature dipped into the teens for a couple days at night.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
5. Less traffic
Depends on the city.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
6. Prettier plants and trees
It's relative. Lots of big oaks.... scant on Palm Trees and tropical plants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
7. Fresh air, less pollution
I don't think there's a significant difference in air pollution up here from down there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
8. Friendlier people
Ummmmmmmmmmmmm..... maybe. There are plenty of rude people in North Florida. Actually, depends on who you are, as there is a more Southern conservative mentality up here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
9. Lower costs of living overall
More or less, yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Comparing the northeast vs. north FL

1. Houses as much as 75% off, 1/4th the price, 4 times cheaper
2. Minimal or no hurricane risk
3. The weather is a tie, cooler summers but also cool/cold winters
4. Lower overall costs of living
You're exaggerating quite a bit. The Northeast is renown for high prices. It's how people flock from the NE to FL using cashed out equity!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home

http://homepics.realtor.com/image8/http/pittsburghpa/listings/large/012/654315_101.jpg (broken link)
$55k for a nice Pittsburgh suburb house
Again, I'm sorry, but you're NEVER going to find a NICE HOUSE in a NICE AND DESIRABLE urbanized AREA for 55k. Ever. I'm a firm believer that bargains don't exist without a reason!

And this type of house is pretty standard fare up North....... it's not unique, and if you visited you'd probably see dozens like it. Small rooms, functionally obsolete, small baths..... To each his own though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
http://homepics.realtor.com/image9/http/gainesville/listings/large/018/273470a.jpg (broken link)
$220k for a Gainsville suburb house
That's Florida Middle Class home architecture basically.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
I am curious whats your own opinions about south FL vs. north FL vs. the northeast states. If you choose the more expensive location, does it justify the much higher prices? For me, absolutely not! I dont even like south FL and north FL looks to be equal to the northeast but absolutely not worth paying 4x more in north FL with one exception if they do away with property taxes then maybe itll be worth the big price cause the saving in property tax can add up big over time and help defray some of the extra house costs in FL.
SO you want to do away with property tax AND keep 0 income tax? My mother was talking about my aunt in New Jersey who pays very little for HOI as compared to her in Port St. Lucie (2X less), but then conceded, "she pays $7000/year in taxes" which is 3X what my mom pays+!!
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Old 02-25-2007, 06:38 PM
 
2,141 posts, read 6,340,034 times
Reputation: 588
Quote:SO you want to do away with property tax AND keep 0 income tax? My mother was talking about my aunt in New Jersey who pays very little for HOI as compared to her in Port St. Lucie (2X less), but then conceded, "she pays $7000/year in taxes" which is 3X what my mom pays+!!

And you don't think the taxes in Florida will go up that high Why ???? Remember the same people that let it happen in New Jersey and the Tri-State area there are here now.
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Old 02-25-2007, 06:41 PM
 
17,297 posts, read 25,645,113 times
Reputation: 8567
Quote:
Originally Posted by firemed View Post
Quote:SO you want to do away with property tax AND keep 0 income tax? My mother was talking about my aunt in New Jersey who pays very little for HOI as compared to her in Port St. Lucie (2X less), but then conceded, "she pays $7000/year in taxes" which is 3X what my mom pays+!!

And you don't think the taxes in Florida will go up that high Why ????

They might. Eventually... if the people don't demand change from their electors. But.... still don't think it's helpful to want 0 income tax, 0 property tax AND THEN complain that there is crime and poor schools!!
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Old 02-25-2007, 07:59 PM
 
Location: WPB, FL. Dreaming of Oil city, PA
2,909 posts, read 12,974,224 times
Reputation: 991
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
There's less going on up here. And more land to go around for now, while South Florida is pretty much boxed in between the Coast and the Everglades.

Less like what? North FL has everything I need. Ive noticed theres more land, but the houses themselves arent cheap to build it seems Very affordable if you choose the mobile home route.


Quote:
I'm not so sure about the "lower hurricane risk"!! Less hurricane flood risk, maybe, due to some hilly areas.... but the panhandle has been hit by Ivan and Hurricane Dennis in the past couple of years.
Well hurricane insurance is lowest in the interior of FL away from both coasts. Like in Gainesville.


Quote:
Yes, the summers are about 7 months. Save on A/C, more on heat! All my plants died in my backyard last weekend when the temperature dipped into the teens for a couple days at night.

My condolence for your plants. That was a very unusual cold that killed some of the more tender plants. Buy some seeds and start over. a/c costs more than heat and up in north FL you need heat maybe two days out of the year and only heat for a few hours during the night, once the sun comes out it warms quick.


Quote:
I don't think there's a significant difference in air pollution up here from down there.
Ive been to north FL and the air is cleaner and smells better.


Quote:
You're exaggerating quite a bit. The Northeast is renown for high prices. It's how people flock from the NE to FL using cashed out equity!

Depends on what states. You cant generalise the northeast as being expensive everywhere. Take Ohio, West Virginia and Pennsylvania to name three, those are cheap almost everywhere, especially West Virginia. Maine is more expensive but still far cheaper than north FL.


Quote:
Again, I'm sorry, but you're NEVER going to find a NICE HOUSE in a NICE AND DESIRABLE urbanized AREA for 55k. Ever. I'm a firm believer that bargains don't exist without a reason!
I prefer to live in the more rural areas anyway, its got much less crime, less pollution, less traffic and lower costs of living. The more rural areas in north FL your looking at $200k easily. Compare that to $50k in the more rural areas in several northeastern states.


Quote:
And this type of house is pretty standard fare up North....... it's not unique, and if you visited you'd probably see dozens like it. Small rooms, functionally obsolete, small baths..... To each his own though.
Many houses today have small rooms. I visited one that had a bedroom measuring 10x10

Quote:
That's Florida Middle Class home architecture basically.
And I find that design to be boring and simple. I love the designs many northeast houses used in the early 1900s. Two stories with basement and attic


Quote:
SO you want to do away with property tax AND keep 0 income tax? My mother was talking about my aunt in New Jersey who pays very little for HOI as compared to her in Port St. Lucie (2X less), but then conceded, "she pays $7000/year in taxes" which is 3X what my mom pays+!!

I doubt FL will eliminate property taxes but its being proposed now. No matter, theres always Tennessee and its very low prop. taxes and HOI and no state income tax. Some $50k houses as well but your gonna need more like $100k for a decent house in a safe area. Still beats Florida prices anyday and I prefer the TN weather. I wish it was cooler now, im sweating!
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Old 02-25-2007, 10:36 PM
 
17,297 posts, read 25,645,113 times
Reputation: 8567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home View Post
Less like what? North FL has everything I need.
Well, I prefer better shopping, travel, and dining choices than what is offered up in rural areas. I have to drive 2 and a half hours to get to an airport (Jacksonville) that actually has reasonable airfare.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Ive noticed theres more land, but the houses themselves arent cheap to build it seems Very affordable if you choose the mobile home route.
Look, I think you have a very different idea of what "affordable" is than I do (or a lot of people, really). To me, $50k is a downpayment, not a house price that is realistic in the year 2007. My parents bought a 3/2/2 on a 1/4 acre lot in PSL in 1995 for 62k. You're just not going to see prices like that UNLESS you move to the boonies. Do a mortgage calculator at today's interest rates and then add a couple hundred for taxes and insurance. You'll find that you can afford 100k or more on an average salary assuming you have good credit. (A 100k mortgage at 6.5% for 30 years is about $600. Even assuming you end up with $900 after P&I, that's a reasonable housing burden, IMO, and not far off rents.

Maybe you should look into "modular" homes rather than tornado-attracting mobile homes?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Well hurricane insurance is lowest in the interior of FL away from both coasts. Like in Gainesville.
Another way to reduce your insurance payment is to buy a townhouse with an association fee that rolls insurance and other amenities into one payment.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
My condolence for your plants. That was a very unusual cold that killed some of the more tender plants. Buy some seeds and start over.
Happens a few times every winter. And all the grass is dead and for about 3 weeks in a row it was grey and depressing. I had to go tanning to feel some warmth!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
a/c costs more than heat and up in north FL you need heat maybe two days out of the year and only heat for a few hours during the night, once the sun comes out it warms quick.
Depends on what kind of heating system you have. MY heat is less efficient than air conditioning, and it costs more to heat than air condition. People spending $400/month up north for heating bills is not uncommon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Ive been to north FL and the air is cleaner and smells better.
Unfortunately, I think yours is the "placebo effect" buttressed by the "grass is greener" syndrome. Observe:

Tallahassee: Air quality index
(% of days AQI ranked as good) 62.5%

Pensacola: Air quality index
(% of days AQI ranked as good) 63.0%

vs.

West Palm Beach: Air quality index
(% of days AQI ranked as good) 92.9%

Miami: Air quality index
(% of days AQI ranked as good) 77.3%

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Depends on what states. You cant generalise the northeast as being expensive everywhere. Take Ohio, West Virginia and Pennsylvania to name three, those are cheap almost everywhere, especially West Virginia. Maine is more expensive but still far cheaper than north FL.
Ohio is cheap in SOME places, not "almost anywhere". Rural cow country, yes. In "civilization"? No. You'll get more house for the money up there, but if you think Florida's got a crappy job market, Ohio is even worse!

And Maine? Have fun with that. For all the carping about hurricanes and tornadoes in Florida, how many people have been killed by ice storms and blizzards and extreme cold throughout the Northeast and mid-west this winter?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
I prefer to live in the more rural areas anyway, its got much less crime, less pollution, less traffic and lower costs of living. The more rural areas in north FL your looking at $200k easily. Compare that to $50k in the more rural areas in several northeastern states.
Again, move to the rural Northeast then. But clearly the trend is to LEAVE the rural NE to points South, so either everyone just doesn't understand how good they have it up there, or it's not a walk in the park that you make it out to be.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Many houses today have small rooms. I visited one that had a bedroom measuring 10x10
My grandfather had a pretty nice victorian 1920s home in New Jersey outside of Newark and it had "4 bedrooms".... one of which was later converted to a decent sized closet because that's more approrpriately what it was.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
And I find that design to be boring and simple. I love the designs many northeast houses used in the early 1900s. Two stories with basement and attic
And to others Florida architecture is unique and interesting. Amongst my favorite architectural style in the world is Addison Mizner inspired, the Boca Raton architect.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
I doubt FL will eliminate property taxes but its being proposed now. No matter, theres always Tennessee and its very low prop. taxes and HOI and no state income tax. Some $50k houses as well but your gonna need more like $100k for a decent house in a safe area.
It sounds like the only things you ***need*** are cheap housing and "not hot" weather, and not the things that most people take into consideration when relocating, such as job opportunities, education opportunities, health facilities, entertainment, shopping, dining.... Why bother with so much research then? Just move to Wyoming or Idaho in the boonies or something? Or move to that town in Kansas that is GIVING away land for FREE if you promise to build a house and stay for X number of years?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home
Still beats Florida prices anyday and I prefer the TN weather. I wish it was cooler now, im sweating!
I checked West Palm Beach weather right now. It's 70 degrees. In other words, PERFECT!! You should NOT be sweating. I keep my air conditioning warmer than that in the summer!
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Old 02-25-2007, 11:32 PM
 
Location: WPB, FL. Dreaming of Oil city, PA
2,909 posts, read 12,974,224 times
Reputation: 991
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
Well, I prefer better shopping, travel, and dining choices than what is offered up in rural areas. I have to drive 2 and a half hours to get to an airport (Jacksonville) that actually has reasonable airfare.
You can live in a suburb of a city and a short commute has all the shopping. There are Pittsburgh, PA suburbs with $50k houses and all the shopping you want 10-15 miles away and plenty of shopping right in the suburb.

Quote:
Look, I think you have a very different idea of what "affordable" is than I do (or a lot of people, really). To me, $50k is a downpayment, not a house price that is realistic in the year 2007. My parents bought a 3/2/2 on a 1/4 acre lot in PSL in 1995 for 62k. You're just not going to see prices like that UNLESS you move to the boonies. Do a mortgage calculator at today's interest rates and then add a couple hundred for taxes and insurance. You'll find that you can afford 100k or more on an average salary assuming you have good credit. (A 100k mortgage at 6.5% for 30 years is about $600. Even assuming you end up with $900 after P&I, that's a reasonable housing burden, IMO, and not far off rents.

Yes and no, depends on location. $50k is realistic in many states, but almost impossible to find in FL, although ive seen a few tiny shacks for $50k there.
As for mortgage, I would need to make at least $40k a year to afford a $100k house and still stick to the 25% rule of your gross annual income. $40k a year happens to be more than what teachers here make in south FL, my moms a teacher and doesnt make that much. $100k is not all that easy to afford. read carefully Let me put this in perspective. My friend has a masters degree and makes "only" $45k a year and she bought a house in Texas for $107k and told me that was pretty much her limit and she hardly has any money left for other things, a big chunk of it is going to the mortgage, insurance and taxes. I have to wake up to the reality that nothing in life comes easy, not money, not an expensive house and thats the truth.

Quote:
Maybe you should look into "modular" homes rather than tornado-attracting mobile homes?
They would end up costing more than houses in the northeast anyway. Show me where I can get a nice big modular home for under $50k on a 1/4 acre land. I much prefer a real house with basement, two stories and attic

Quote:
Depends on what kind of heating system you have. MY heat is less efficient than air conditioning, and it costs more to heat than air condition. People spending $400/month up north for heating bills is not uncommon.
The sellers in the northeast are paying $200 a month for heating and they have a big house. I will do exactly as they do.


Quote:
Ohio is cheap in SOME places, not "almost anywhere". Rural cow country, yes. In "civilization"? No. You'll get more house for the money up there, but if you think Florida's got a crappy job market, Ohio is even worse!
Lots of good bargains in south and east OH. Im self employed so who cares about the job market. Ive seen a few expensive locations in OH, just avoid those unless your really rich.


Quote:
And Maine? Have fun with that. For all the carping about hurricanes and tornadoes in Florida, how many people have been killed by ice storms and blizzards and extreme cold throughout the Northeast and mid-west this winter?

I personally dont care for Maine due to the cold and I can live in OH for cheaper than ME anyway.


Quote:
Again, move to the rural Northeast then. But clearly the trend is to LEAVE the rural NE to points South, so either everyone just doesn't understand how good they have it up there, or it's not a walk in the park that you make it out to be.

Pittsburgh, PA isnt rural. Parkersburg, WV isnt rural(130k pop in the county)
I have friends that live in WV and I know one guys wife whos gonna make over $20 an hour as a nurse and they live in a wv town where their dream house is gonna cost just $29k


Quote:
And to others Florida architecture is unique and interesting. Amongst my favorite architectural style in the world is Addison Mizner inspired, the Boca Raton architect.
Ill admit thats a nice house. Perfect for those rich upper class people.


Quote:
It sounds like the only things you ***need*** are cheap housing and "not hot" weather, and not the things that most people take into consideration when relocating, such as job opportunities, education opportunities, health facilities, entertainment, shopping, dining.... Why bother with so much research then? Just move to Wyoming or Idaho in the boonies or something? Or move to that town in Kansas that is GIVING away land for FREE if you promise to build a house and stay for X number of years?
Low crime is very important. Jobs dont matter, I cant find one even here but I dont need a job, my home business is doing fine and getting better and better. I am finished with college so no need. Health? Theres a hospital in every town/city ive looked into. Entertainment? Try fishing, hiking, going for a walk or find a sweet lady to hang out. You dont need malls and theme parks for entertainment. Theres shopping everywhere. Wyoming and Idaho are too cold and cost more than Ohio anyway.


Quote:
I checked West Palm Beach weather right now. It's 70 degrees. In other words, PERFECT!! You should NOT be sweating. I keep my air conditioning warmer than that in the summer!

Its 80.2 degrees in my room and thats with the window open. Its always warmer indoors. I wished it was 50 outside so itll be a pleasent 70 inside. I envy those that live in the northeast, they get the good weather now(winter is about over)
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