[Lilybeans]

Originally Posted by Lakeland Yankee

Good point.



I take it that you never lived in a non-right to work state before? An employee can still be fired if they do not perform their job, the union only protects them from unfair firings like this here (http://www.local6.com/news/16594550/detail.html - broken link).

So what. What right does she have to a job? If it's my company I should be able to hire and fire anyone I want for any reason I want. Why shouldn't I be able to do that?

[Retiredcoach]

Originally Posted by Lilybeans

So what. What right does she have to a job? If it's my company I should be able to hire and fire anyone I want for any reason I want. Why shouldn't I be able to do that?

It could be that Pittsburgh is/was such a strongly unionized city. It could be that Pittsburgh lives/dies by its traditions. It could be that people treat their neighbors and fellow human beings with a more reverence and respect. It could be that Charlie Daniels defined the city mentality when he compared the extraordinary power of our underestimated country's patriotism to the fool who is thinking about "laying your hands on a Pittsburgh Steeler fan...."

An employer can do whatever he/she chooses within the parameters of the law. Doing what is his/her right is a complete paradox to "doing the right thing". The Florida right to work legislation devalues the human element (where any part can/will one day be deemed old and replaceable). Fire a server in Florida without just cause (too much smiling), and you get a news blurb; the issue dies. Fire a server in Pittsburgh without just cause and you get a news story; close the restaurant. Fellow neighbors of the fired server refuse to patronize a business that mistreats one of our own. It is so simple... neighbors caring and supporting their neighbors is an element of the Florida culture that is either hiding or missing in too many areas.

[Lilybeans]

Originally Posted by Retiredcoach

It could be that Pittsburgh is/was such a strongly unionized city. It could be that Pittsburgh lives/dies by its traditions. It could be that people treat their neighbors and fellow human beings with a more reverence and respect. It could be that Charlie Daniels defined the city mentality when he compared the extraordinary power of our underestimated country's patriotism to the fool who is thinking about "laying your hands on a Pittsburgh Steeler fan...."

An employer can do whatever he/she chooses within the parameters of the law. Doing what is his/her right is a complete paradox to "doing the right thing". The Florida right to work legislation devalues the human element (where any part can/will one day be deemed old and replaceable). Fire a server in Florida without just cause (too much smiling), and you get a news blurb; the issue dies. Fire a server in Pittsburgh without just cause and you get a news story; close the restaurant. Fellow neighbors of the fired server refuse to patronize a business that mistreats one of our own. It is so simple... neighbors caring and supporting their neighbors is an element of the Florida culture that is either hiding or missing in too many areas.

Whether or not people choose to patronize a business is their own choice. If I am paying the bills, no one else has a right to tell me how to run my business. If they like the way I do it they can choose to stay;if they don't like it they are free to leave.

"Doing the right thing" means that employees do what the owner tells them to do. They follow the rules. If they don't want to, they are free to leave .


But..employees do not have a right to keep a job just because they are there. If they want to invest their own money and put themselves at risk, then by all means they should start their own business.

[Retiredcoach]

Originally Posted by Lilybeans

Whether or not people choose to patronize a business is their own choice. If I am paying the bills, no one else has a right to tell me how to run my business. If they like the way I do it they can choose to stay;if they don't like it they are free to leave.

"Doing the right thing" means that employees do what the owner tells them to do. They follow the rules. If they don't want to, they are free to leave .


But..employees do not have a right to keep a job just because they are there. If they want to invest their own money and put themselves at risk, then by all means they should start their own business.

The Ebenezer Scrooge model of business ethics is alive and well in Florida! Lilybeans, will you be toasting the selfless acts of those Florida business owners who attempt to share their good fortune with their employee family? Will you instead be toasting the selfish acts and excessive profits made by the business owner who made his fortune on the backs of his "throwaway workers"?

If yours is the philosophy garnered by the majority of the Florida populace.... the wraths of impoverished workers and chronically unemployed will soon be expanding into your backyard.

[DailyJournalist]

Originally Posted by Lilybeans

Whether or not people choose to patronize a business is their own choice. If I am paying the bills, no one else has a right to tell me how to run my business. If they like the way I do it they can choose to stay;if they don't like it they are free to leave.

"Doing the right thing" means that employees do what the owner tells them to do. They follow the rules. If they don't want to, they are free to leave .


But..employees do not have a right to keep a job just because they are there. If they want to invest their own money and put themselves at risk, then by all means they should start their own business.

This is the type of thinking that will assure that Florida continues to be the low wage capital it is and will always be!

[Lilybeans]

I am curious as to where the idea of entitlement to a job comes from? What investment in the business has an employee made that entitles them to keep a job if the owner doesn't want them there?

[DailyJournalist]

Originally Posted by Lilybeans

I am curious as to where the idea of entitlement to a job comes from? What investment in the business has an employee made that entitles them to keep a job if the owner doesn't want them there?

Fair labor practices like the ones unions demand should be an etitlement.

[Retiredcoach]

Originally Posted by Lilybeans

I am curious as to where the idea of entitlement to a job comes from? What investment in the business has an employee made that entitles them to keep a job if the owner doesn't want them there?

Should monetary gain be the lone driving force of a successful business? Should the lowest valued employee be demeaned to the level of a pawn on the chess board at the whim of the wealthy? Should the employee be re-classified as "indentured" if he/she is unable to pay for the price that society charges him/her to survive?

[annerk]

Originally Posted by Lilybeans

I am curious as to where the idea of entitlement to a job comes from? What investment in the business has an employee made that entitles them to keep a job if the owner doesn't want them there?

Bottom line, happy employees who are treated with respect and don't feel like their jobs are constantly in danger at the whim of their employer are more productive and motivated to see the company they work for succeed.

I used to work for a company who treated employees like dirt. We'd work hard with the dangle of a year end bonus held over our heads if the company met financial goals. The longer you had worked there, the higher that incentive was. Coincidentally the employer just happened to need to let people go as we went into our normal slower months in early December each year. The people who were always the ones let go were the ones who had been there the longest and would get the largest bonuses. They were always let go exactly four weeks prior to paying bonuses. I saw this happen three years in a row. These were fine employees, and the ONLY reason to let them go over newer employees was they made $.50 an hour more--and would have gotten a larger year end bonus.

I quit the day after getting my bonus after my third year. At that point I was on track to be laid off 11 months later, as I had the second highest seniority. I wasn't going to slave all year for a company that didn't appreciate me. With me went over half of the employees--everyone who had a clue how the company operated. We all left. The employer BEGGED us to come back, even offered a $.10 an hour raise. Oh freaking goody, I get an extra $4 a week while he drives a Porsche and lives in a McMansion. Guess what, treating employees like dirt hurt him. He no longer had people who knew how to run his business. Mistakes made by the new replacement employees cost him several major accounts. Two years later he was bankrupt. I didn't lose sleep over it.

[Lilybeans]

Originally Posted by Retiredcoach

Should monetary gain be the lone driving force of a successful business? Should the lowest valued employee be demeaned to the level of a pawn on the chess board at the whim of the wealthy? Should the employee be re-classified as "indentured" if he/she is unable to pay for the price that society charges him/her to survive?

If employees do not like where they work, then they are free to go elsewhere. If conditions are bad, then they are free to go elsewhere. If enough leave, then the business will go under.

If they are treated well then they will stay.

It's called capitalism.

Have you ever owned a business and had employees? I do. I'm not in business for social welfare. I do it to make money.