[Need_affordable_home]

I have considered Ocala but the jobs there pay so little, it doesnt help the situation. Houses there are about half the price of Palm Beach County but the jobs in Ocala pay less too.

I believe we are due for a 30% correction, thats what realtors have been saying. California is also due for a similar correction, although one realtor believes itll be only 10% because California is so much more desirable, jobs pay better, taxes are lower, theres so much entertainment, the weather is great, no hurricanes. I guess time will see how far prices drop. From indicators, the year 2007 will be worse than 2006.

[Liberty911]

Originally Posted by Need_affordable_home

I believe we are due for a 30% correction, thats what realtors have been saying. California is also due for a similar correction, although one realtor believes itll be only 10% because California is so much more desirable, jobs pay better, taxes are lower, theres so much entertainment, the weather is great, no hurricanes. I guess time will see how far prices drop. From indicators, the year 2007 will be worse than 2006.

I was born and raised in Southern California. I moved to PBC last May after researching the housing market, cost of living and wages for a little more than a year. California is desirable if you have money. Lots of money. 500k in california will get you a OK condo but you will be no where near the beach. Forget the SFH unless you want to live in a getto and even then you better have $600k+ to buy into a starter home. There is lots of entertainment in Ca, but things are very spread out and located outside of areas where you would want to live. A nice house in a nice suburb in So Cal is easily $900k. Even then, I now people who spend 2-3 hours each day stuck in traffic to go to work.

So Ca. traffic is also terrible. The 405/5 interchange is the most congested interchange in the country. Florida has NO traffic compared to Ca. Weather is great in So Ca, but it is cold in winter. Even in summer, the So Ca ocean is lucky to reach 70 degrees. Hurricans? Whell I have lived through earthquakes and you do not want to do that. Earthquake insurance is right up there with churricane insurance.

Re wages, Ca minimum wages is only .50 more per hour than Florida. Taxes are also higher in Ca considering Florida no state income tax. If you are a teacher, police officer or construction worker in Florida, you will NOT make any additional income in Ca to compensate for the increased housing. Professionals will make about the same. The difference is Florida is much cheaper. The house I just purchased in the Jupiter area would have easily been 600% more for the location in So Cal.

I guess it is all perspective. For me Florida is what So Ca used to be 20 years ago. For native Floridians, NC or Georgia is what Florida used to be. If you think it takes alot of money to live in Florida, wait until you try California.

[Need_affordable_home]

Your experience provides me insight. What job(s) did you have and how much did the salaries differ from the two locations? Is it true one reason to live in Cali is because of salaries higher than anywhere else in America? Its easily 1.5x higher than most other states/cities. Could you have stayed in Cali, enjoyed the high salaries and rented a 1 bedroom apartment or buy a mobile home, both a cheap option?

The traffic issue is a big problem, they need to build more roads! Or maybe provide public buses! Alternativately, I could try to live a couple miles from work and just bike there.

As for earthquakes, they suck just like hurricanes do, but here we get alot more canes than you get quakes.


Minimum wage isnt an issue since I wont be moving there unless I get a good job wage offer significently higher than what I get here. Ok Cali state tax is 9.3% for the high bracket. My income would pass thru 6 brackets and whatever over 42k will be taxed 9.3% My federal IRS tax would also be higher but id have more money left. Its complicated math, but lets say someone makes 40k/year in s. Florida and 72k in s. California. How much would be left after taxes in both scinerios?

As for Jupiter vs. s. Cali being 600% more(7 times) are you comparing apples to apples regarding equal size house, equal size land, equal location? Can you give me a numerical value, how much did that Jupiter house set you back, what is it worth now and would the exact same thing be 7x more in s. Cali?


Question: Would I be any better off in Cali even if I avoided high house costs by purchasing a mobile home for $100k with 700/month lot fees? Mobile homes here are considerabily cheaper, just like houses are. But still with the large Cali salary, a nice 100k mobile should be affordable!


What made you decide to move to Florida and not a cheaper place like Georgia?

[Bubba on my mountain]

Being a homeowner in Florida since 1988 - don't forget about the new codes for construction. The new codes have also added to the cost of housing. Many of the new codes will not necessarily provide any better safety for the house. It is just another way for government (local, county and state) to get into your pocket. By the way, I have a home in Baker county, locted just to the West of Jacksonville. The cost of insurance will increase only 4% this year. When interest rates turn down and the cost of gas stabilizes, houses will begin to sell again. Regards

[Liberty911]

I'll try to respond the best I can.

To start, it all depends on where you want to live. If you want to be < 10 miles from an ocean it will cost. I had sold 2 of my homes in Newport Beach, both about 6 miles drive to the sandy beach, in 2004 and 2005. 700 sq ft for $575k and 1500 sq ft. for $730k. 1 bedroom apartments in that area started at $1,900 per month (about 1 year ago). in no so good areas, or away from the ocean the cost drops to between $1,300 to $1,600. The apartment I left was on a golf course, 800 sq ft, and ran $1,560. The 1400 sq ft townhouses next door were selling for $899k when I left. Mobil homes are pretty much non-existent, or at least I did not know of any. My only experience with trailor parks are based upon an aunt living in one 30 years ago and my newpaper delivery route wabout the same time. Based upon my limited observation, the "lower end affordable" trailor parks around are in run down areas and really away from any neighborhood amenities that would bring someone to So. Ca. I am familar with "manufactured homes" on leased land in nice areas. However, even these would still run $400-500k with a $500 per month land lease.

There is no room to build new roads in the meaningful areas. Development in So Ca pretty much carpets the land from the coast inward about 40-50 miles. The rule of thumb is live within 5 miles to work. I did, but on some days a 7 minutes drive would take 45 minutes during rush hour. And I was no where near Los Angeles. On days my job required me to be in LA by 8:30 a.m. I would have to be on the road by 6:15 a.m. to get there in time. (31 miles drive.)

Re comparing Jupiter area to So Cal: I am comparing the lot size, location to the ocean / intercoastal, and general appearance of the neighborhood. There are some large lots in So Cal near the ocean, however, zero lot lines are common. The lot size and proximity are what increase the value exponentially. I paid < $325k for a fully remodeled pool home in Tequesta with a little more than a .25 acre. ( I think that is what the house is worth in at this time.) The house on one side is Zillowed at 2.4 million (granted it is much larger and on about 1.25 acre) and on the other side Zillow estimates at $499k. Nonetheless, we share the same ocean access is about 50 yards from my house. I can drive to Jupiter "dog beach" in about 5-7 minutes. Taking these SAME elements into consideration a similar house in So Cal would be easily be in excess of 2-5 million for a tear down home. It is VERY difficult to compare So Ca to Florida because they are simply very different. Similar areas I am refering to in So Ca would be similar to Corona Beach (Orange County) or La Jolla (San Diego County).

For me the value of dollar for the type / location / lot size for a Florida was a major issue in relocating. (.25 acre anywhere near the ocean is a large lot for someone in So Cal.) So Ca is also cold in the winter. Think 40 night time in winter. June and July are plagued by the "June Gloom."

As for the money left after taxes, that is difficult question. Overall I spend less in Florida not taking into consideration housing. Almost everything is less expensive in Florida except for fruit / vegtables. For me the value I receive for the dollar is greater in Florida. I guess it comes down to where you are happy. The same issues present in Florida are also evident in So Cal: immigration, insurance, housing, gas, political corruption, etc. Just on a different level.

I hope this helps.

[Need_affordable_home]

"To start, it all depends on where you want to live. If you want to be < 10 miles from an ocean it will cost."


Thats one reason why houses cost so much here! I may be about 10 miles from the ocean but I havent been to the beach in forever and I certainly cant see the ocean from here! The cost does increase alot if you are walking distance from the ocean, even more so if you can see the ocean from the 2nd floor(oceanview) and very expensive if you are right in front of the ocean(oceanfront)


"Mobil homes are pretty much non-existent, or at least I did not know of any."


I guess you wont find many, if any by the ocean or intracostal. I heard of one by the ocean that got sold for so many millions to a developer! Florida and California have tons of mobile parks and in some areas, cheaper non deed restricted land where you can put a mobile on it till you can afford to have a house built or sell the land to someone else who can.


"Based upon my limited observation, the "lower end affordable" trailor parks around are in run down areas and really away from any neighborhood amenities that would bring someone to So. Ca."


If I decide to live there, id want to be in a good mobile park neighboor in a good location close to many amenities. We have some parks that meet this requirement here in s. Florida.


"I am familar with "manufactured homes" on leased land in nice areas. However, even these would still run $400-500k with a $500 per month land lease."


The ones I searched for were more like 1/4 million with $700-$1000 lot fees.
but they are really beautiful and youd be hard pressed to differnate them from real houses! Fairly affordable California living for the middle to upper middle class that arent rich millionares.

"There is no room to build new roads in the meaningful areas. Development in So Ca pretty much carpets the land from the coast inward about 40-50 miles. The rule of thumb is live within 5 miles to work. I did, but on some days a 7 minutes drive would take 45 minutes during rush hour."

They can still do something about the traffic, like make it off limit to cars during rush hour, youd only be able to take a bus. One bus can transport much more people. Instead of thousands of cars on the road, youd have hundreds of buses. It would be nice to find a house close to work but may be very expensive!


"I paid < $325k for a fully remodeled pool home in Tequesta with a little more than a .25 acre. ( I think that is what the house is worth in at this time.) The house on one side is Zillowed at 2.4 million (granted it is much larger and on about 1.25 acre) and on the other side Zillow estimates at $499k."


Ok, I am confused. If the lot is much bigger, its not apples to apples. 325k is a good price back then, I guess an apples to apples comparsion would be something like 800k for the same in Cali?


"Nonetheless, we share the same ocean access is about 50 yards from my house. I can drive to Jupiter "dog beach" in about 5-7 minutes. Taking these SAME elements into consideration a similar house in So Cal would be easily be in excess of 2-5 million for a tear down home."

Who is going to tear down a house they spend millions for it plus the lot? Unless the house is such an eyesore, but then treat it the same as a vacent lot of your just gonna tear the house. When you say 50 yards, your 2 blocks away from the ocean? Just walk past 2 houses and you are by the ocean? Do you have oceanview this close? So your house would be worth what now? 500k? 600k? The price you mention in Cali would be anywhere from 5x to 8x more!(wow I wonder who can afford)


"For me the value of dollar for the type / location / lot size for a Florida was a major issue in relocating."


Why not Georgia, TN, NC or some other much cheaper state?

"So Ca is also cold in the winter. Think 40 night time in winter."

It can get that cold here too!


"As for the money left after taxes, that is difficult question. Overall I spend less in Florida not taking into consideration housing. Almost everything is less expensive in Florida except for fruit / vegtables. For me the value I receive for the dollar is greater in Florida. I guess it comes down to where you are happy. The same issues present in Florida are also evident in So Cal: immigration, insurance, housing, gas, political corruption, etc. Just on a different level."


Yea thats a good point to consider. One needs to decide if the quality of life would be better at any state/city before deciding to move there. I am far from making any decisions, but I have some options on my list, but that could change anytime.

Thanks for your reply, looking forward to more I have rated your post positive, please do the same

[Muggy]

Florida, had more than 16,533 properties in foreclosure in August.
http://money.cnn.com/2006/09/13/real...sures_spiking/


Unbelievable!

If you have not voted, please take a moment to cast your vote. Thank you!

[baily]

i think it's a real shame .this whole market. look at all the people who though they flip house after house some did .but i see that market over.also many brought with no money down or little how long can that kind of stuff go on really .the taxes are so high now . when the rates go up in time . i bet will see more changes . never buy a house not to live in i feel.

[Prichard]

Condos will crash HARD! Single family residential has already corrected, will stagnate for 6-8 months, and then increase modestly over the next few years.

Townhome resales will stagnate, but new townhomes will sell modestly over the next few years. These are being driven by the absolute dearth of modest-priced houseing.

[SunshineState]

The market is going down the tube fast! We bought our second home a little over 2 years ago in a neighborhood we had been trying for years to find a home in. We would get a call from our real estate agent and by the time we got to see the house (within a day or two) it was already sold. Now there are 18 houses that have been sitting for sale for over a year just on my street! The whole neighborhood is clearing our, between the property taxes (ours doubled the first year) to the homeowners insurance (ours had more than doubled in the last year)

Originally Posted by Muggy

Enough talk. Place your vote!

Sorry, I just realized that some people will want a timeframe. So I'll say this is for the next 1-3 years.