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Old 01-16-2008, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Oz
2,238 posts, read 8,697,610 times
Reputation: 1368

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kshe95girl View Post
I started this thread to generate a thoughtful discussion. If one stops to think about how cloning has the possibility to narrow the gene pool of all these animals, it cannot be a good thing!
My last paragraph was my ethical statement, not a knee-jerk reaction. I dont believe I have ever had one of those in my life!
They're meat animals. There's millions upon millions of 'em. I think the gene pool is safe

Humor aside, this is really no different than humans who are incapable of producing children going through in-vitro. *shrug* One could make the argument that ethically they shouldn't be doing that if their genes are defective enough that they can't reproduce naturally -- so why do they want to pass those genes on?

Personally, I see no problems with the "interference" of science in things like this. Science is best used for improving the lives of people. Cloning meat could easily mean that we end up with animals that are resistant to diseases, and don't need hormones or antibiotics. How could that possibly be a bad thing?

Last edited by RoaminRed; 01-16-2008 at 12:14 PM.. Reason: Added thoughts...
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Old 01-16-2008, 12:14 PM
 
3,704 posts, read 4,143,311 times
Reputation: 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by kshe95girl View Post
I started this thread to generate a thoughtful discussion. If one stops to think about how cloning has the possibility to narrow the gene pool of all these animals, it cannot be a good thing!
My last paragraph was my ethical statement, not a knee-jerk reaction. I dont believe I have ever had one of those in my life!
Most likely the best animals will be cloned and bred with each other.
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Old 01-16-2008, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Burlington County NJ
1,969 posts, read 5,287,727 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank_Carbonni View Post
Most likely the best animals will be cloned and bred with each other.

great...then they'll have three heads
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Old 01-16-2008, 12:25 PM
 
Location: Oz
2,238 posts, read 8,697,610 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nic529 View Post
great...then they'll have three heads
Head cheese for everyone!
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Old 01-16-2008, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Silver Springs, FL
23,440 posts, read 30,618,996 times
Reputation: 15560
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoaminRed View Post
Head cheese for everyone!
LOL, I'll get the big iron kettle on the boil! Wont eat it, but I'll cook it!

Last edited by kshe95girl; 01-16-2008 at 12:31 PM.. Reason: spell
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Old 01-16-2008, 12:30 PM
 
3,704 posts, read 4,143,311 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nic529 View Post
great...then they'll have three heads
I know you are joking, but that is still completely wrong.

Cloning just means a genetically identical creature, nothing odd or mystifying about it. Like I said previously, think of it as a younger identical twin. Exactly the same thing from a genetic/scientific standpoint.

Oh, and there is nothing wrong with genetic engineering either, but that's a different thread.
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Old 01-16-2008, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Burlington County NJ
1,969 posts, read 5,287,727 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank_Carbonni View Post
I know you are joking, but that is still completely wrong.

Cloning just means a genetically identical creature, nothing odd or mystifying about it. Like I said previously, think of it as a younger identical twin. Exactly the same thing from a genetic/scientific standpoint.

Oh, and there is nothing wrong with genetic engineering either, but that's a different thread.

Yes - Of course I'm joking!

Honestly though - to me this is just a little creepy. Maybe with time I'll change my mind. ....but as for now...thats my story and I'm stickin to it!
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Old 01-16-2008, 06:52 PM
 
Location: a nation with hope
13,155 posts, read 16,879,497 times
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There's some indication that genetically modified foods might not be good for us after all. Some countries don't allow them to be imported. As for cloned meat - if it's all that good for us, why is the government allowing it to go to market without labeling? And how long will it be before we get milk from cloned cows? I remember when hormones were first used in dairy herds, and the farmers who refused to use them were actually prohibited from stating on their milk containers that they don't use hormones.

They eventually found a way around it and just from reading their mission statement on the carton it was clear that they don't use hormones. I always avoided products from those farms that used hormones to increase milk production. We lived in New England at the time and it was a big story there that Cabot farms wouldn't commit to NOT accepting milk from hormone-using dairies. The milk they accepted was a mix of all the area dairies. After that came to light, I stopped buying their products.

Sorry, I digress. If the government says it's OK, it must be.
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Old 01-16-2008, 07:08 PM
 
Location: Maine
5,969 posts, read 11,134,540 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sponger42 View Post
Honestly, I'm fine with cloned, GM, or otherwise improved foods. It's the processing, sugars, pesticides, herbicides, and preservatives that'll kill ya. I like GM foods because they tend to be disease-resistant and hardier, requiring less chemicals during their growth, thus putting fewer chemicals in my body. Plus they're bigger and cheaper.
Super weeds and pests develop as pests become pesticide resistant. They then require a stronger pesticides, and the cycle continues. How does genetic engineering make food bigger? Or cheaper? The cost increases from the start of the production process. Farmers pay a fee for every bag of GE seeds they buy. Seed can't be saved so the cost is perpetual.

Negatives in cloning animals -
It's expensive. As someone else mentioned, it's more expensive that probably any of us can afford. With a success rate of 3% or less a lot of money goes into the tiny percentage of animals that are conceived.

Many offspring die before birth. Those that survive are prone to enlarged organs and die young. If an animal isn't healthy enough to sustain itself is it something you want to eat? We can buy plenty of meat from unhealthy animals for a lot less money already.

Cloned animals have a higher rate of cancer, tumors and infection. Is that something we're willing to eat? Remember, the USDA hasn't been able to control downer cows from going into our food chain. What's a little cancer or pus? The USDA also allowed chicken litter - wood shavings, manure, feathers - to be fed to beef cattle. We can't depend on the USDA to keep cloned animal meat any safer than they keep other meat.

The FDA's own vet medicine panel says there are too many uncertainties to call cloned animal products safe. Our government doesn't agree on the safety issue.

Back to Large Offspring Syndrome - if an animal can't give birth naturally should we be promoting it as breeding quality? LOS causes a high percentage of c-sections. The offspring that survive often have abnormally large hearts that can't support their bodies. They die. Those that survive are prone to enlarged tongues and deformed faces that make it difficult for them to eat. They're prone to diseases such as diabetes and immune deficiencies. Can we as taxpayers afford to support something so flawed and inefficient?

There are a lot more problems involved in cloning. We don't need it. We have no shortage of meat. I don't see what real purpose cloning serves other than to make a few people very wealthy creating meat most people can't afford.

An endangered breed of either sheep or goat was being cloned at one time. I don't know if this is still happening. I hope not. When you're dealing with endangered animals (I do deal with endangered breeds of livestock and poultry) you need to be very careful that you breed only the best. When there are so few you can't afford to screw up what's left.

I hope everyone takes what I've said with a grain of salt and does their own research into the problems of cloning before taking a bite of cloned meat. I'm not an expert, just a farmer who's done a lot of research.
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Old 01-16-2008, 07:21 PM
 
Location: Silver Springs, FL
23,440 posts, read 30,618,996 times
Reputation: 15560
I read something very similar to what Maine stated in the NY Times, thats the link I mentioned that I could not get to work in the original thread post.
Thank you Maine!
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