Why is downtown hollywood soo skeevy? (Miami, Kissimmee: condo, crime, living)

[Wild Style]

Originally Posted by fauve

yeah, but there'll be twigs and berries, man...

I am down in Miami at least two to three times a month (on weekends) I have never encountered that level of degenerates over there like I saw in Hollywood. I also have a co worker and a personal friend that lives in the north lake area. They told me they don't even go to the publix downtown or the cvs on dixie because of the weirdos. Why would I want to live in a place like that? Urban living is one thing, like I said many times before I am from Brooklyn so urban living is what I am used to. But we didn't have degenerate and mentally disturbing behavior on that level like that in the areas I lived in up north.

[fauve]

Personally, I've never seen that in Hollywood, or even degenerates for that matter - I grew up in NYC too, and maybe I just have blinders built in, but honestly, I don't see them. I'd be surprised if it was more than a once in a lifetime experience for you. The only time I ever saw something like that was along the Long Island Expressway about 30 years ago. But, I sure could see how it could color your feelings about a place! The skeeviest I've seen in Hollywood are the old barflys who hang out in some of the bars along the beach, and I get a kick out of them - they love to dance to 60's music - put a little neil young on the jukebox and enjoy the show

Btw, I'm really not trying to deny your view of Hollywood. I'm sure the reality lies somewhere closer to in between what we both have seen. I know in NYC there was an increase in the homeless and the mentally ill on the streets during the budget crisis in the 70's. Instead of treating uninsured patients, the facilities were dumping them on the street. I wonder if something like that may be happening here now.

[Wild Style]

Originally Posted by fauve

Personally, I've never seen that in Hollywood, or even degenerates for that matter - I grew up in NYC too, and maybe I just have blinders built in, but honestly, I don't see them. I'd be surprised if it was more than a once in a lifetime experience for you. The only time I ever saw something like that was along the Long Island Expressway about 30 years ago. But, I sure could see how it could color your feelings about a place! The skeeviest I've seen in Hollywood are the old barflys who hang out in some of the bars along the beach, and I get a kick out of them - they love to dance to 60's music - put a little neil young on the jukebox and enjoy the show

like i said, its not just me who says it. My co worker and the person I know personally who both live in/near downtown Hollywood said that place has a lot of odd balls. Also the sun sentinel did a piece not even three weeks ago about that area in downtown hollywood. The residents are starting to get furious because of the ridiculous amount of half way houses, re hab places and what not in their area. And they end up having to deal with these odd balls. This is far from a once in a life time thing. That place has issues. If you like it then salut, have at it. For me, I pass.

[runswithscissors]

Originally Posted by fauve;9563273
I know in NYC there was an increase in the homeless and the mentally ill on the streets during the budget crisis in the 70's. Instead of treating uninsured patients, t[B

he facilities were dumping them on the street.[/b] I wonder if something like that may be happening here now.

Fauve, actually that had nothing to do with any budget crises.

It was the era of de-institutionalization..It was JFK...because of his sister primariy.The Community Mental Health Act of 1963...closing the state hospitals/warehousing the mentally ill in favor of the belief that they could all live happily ever after in small housing units. And of course realizing that using straight jackets and lobotomies were not nice. Yes the politicians love the lower budget possibilities of closing institutions but that wasn't why it happened.

It happened almost overnight and all of a sudden the public had to learn how to coexist with the mentally ill. Because the community housing/treatment never really seamlessly happened as planned.

Problem is you still couldn't get a schizophrenic to take their meds if they didn't want to.

This still exists today and has been that way since the 70's. It's not for absence of help it's because the mentally ill have different rights now. The right to live under the bridge if they so chose. I mean seriously. HOW the heck is it ok to let sex offenders out of jail and register them as "bridge" in FLL??? LOL ok, different topic but still...

I worked in a state hospital = Eastern State Hosp for children in the 70's and remember it quite clearly. In Phila we still have Byberry Hosp standing empty on acres and acres whereas it was full to the brim until the "act".

Philadelphia State Hospital (Byberry) History - Abandoned Photography : opacity.us

In 1980 my father witnessed his lawyer get shot by a schizophrenic daughter of a client, he was sitting at a picture window inside and as the lawyer walked up to the door the girl called him and shot him in the chest. His 50 year old briefcase, a law school grad gift from his father saved his life slowing down the bullet as he held it up.

He was scheming with her dad to have her committed and she found out. She knew "her rights" and took action herself. At the time she was not "required" to take advantage of any "community based services" even though they existed then AND now. Probably 2/3 of the homeless are mentally ill and refuse help. In Philly you can't get them on the bus during 5 degree temps to go to a shelter they'd rather go down in the sub.

Mental illness.drugs and the breakdown of the family into apathic selfish individuals.... Not budget cuts

So what we have now is re-institutionalization but not in mental hospitals but prisons .....with mentally challenged galore in them.

[runswithscissors]

Originally Posted by Wild Style

Urban living is one thing, like I said many times before I am from Brooklyn so urban living is what I am used to. But we didn't have degenerate and mentally disturbing behavior on that level like that in the areas I lived in up north.

ditto in Philly. random ween shakers in cars passing high school girls to get a reaction but not like the guy in hollywood....

I did see a guy on the sub in NY though... in 7th grade ha...going up to my friend's house in Spanish Harlem, I was horrified... she was laughing ...he wasn't crazy though, he was your routine flasher...she was all professional about planning our escape out of the subway door before he could follow us.

[fauve]

Originally Posted by Wild Style

like i said, its not just me who says it. My co worker and the person I know personally who both live in/near downtown Hollywood said that place has a lot of odd balls. Also the sun sentinel did a piece not even three weeks ago about that area in downtown hollywood. The residents are starting to get furious because of the ridiculous amount of half way houses, re hab places and what not in their area. And they end up having to deal with these odd balls. This is far from a once in a life time thing. That place has issues. If you like it then salut, have at it. For me, I pass.

Well, I was referring to the indecent exposure being a once in a lifetime thing, but hey if your co-workers have seen it too, I imagine it's the same guy and someone needs to call the cops. Then, sadly as runswithscissors laid out, he'll be re-institutionalized in prison.

There was a lot of ugliness in Greenwich Village, in Miami Beach, in the East Village, and the Design District you like now, before there was gentrification. Hollywood imo is another place like those. It attracts the same kind of people who loved those places before they became famous. And, it's those people who will make Hollywood truly special, and whom I believe will make it bloom.

The problem is that once these places are on the map they become REALLY expensive. The people who put up with the ugliness now I believe will be rewarded. But in choosing a home you have to do just that, choose a home, not an investment. You have to choose what's right for you. Miami Beach was right for me in the late-80's because I was 25. I can remember avoiding certain streets and back alleys when leaving clubs at 2 in the morning. There was certainly danger in the air. But it sure was fun and I liked Miami Beach then more than now. People who are looking for that kind of edge will like Hollywood more than anywhere else in South Florida right now. It's interesting.

[fauve]

Originally Posted by runswithscissors

Fauve, actually that had nothing to do with any budget crises.

It was the era of de-institutionalization..It was JFK...because of his sister primariy.The Community Mental Health Act of 1963...closing the state hospitals/warehousing the mentally ill in favor of the belief that they could all live happily ever after in small housing units. And of course realizing that using straight jackets and lobotomies were not nice. Yes the politicians love the lower budget possibilities of closing institutions but that wasn't why it happened.

It happened almost overnight and all of a sudden the public had to learn how to coexist with the mentally ill. Because the community housing/treatment never really seamlessly happened as planned.

Problem is you still couldn't get a schizophrenic to take their meds if they didn't want to.

This still exists today and has been that way since the 70's. It's not for absence of help it's because the mentally ill have different rights now. The right to live under the bridge if they so chose. I mean seriously. HOW the heck is it ok to let sex offenders out of jail and register them as "bridge" in FLL??? LOL ok, different topic but still...

I worked in a state hospital = Eastern State Hosp for children in the 70's and remember it quite clearly. In Phila we still have Byberry Hosp standing empty on acres and acres whereas it was full to the brim until the "act".

Philadelphia State Hospital (Byberry) History - Abandoned Photography : opacity.us

In 1980 my father witnessed his lawyer get shot by a schizophrenic daughter of a client, he was sitting at a picture window inside and as the lawyer walked up to the door the girl called him and shot him in the chest. His 50 year old briefcase, a law school grad gift from his father saved his life slowing down the bullet as he held it up.

He was scheming with her dad to have her committed and she found out. She knew "her rights" and took action herself. At the time she was not "required" to take advantage of any "community based services" even though they existed then AND now. Probably 2/3 of the homeless are mentally ill and refuse help. In Philly you can't get them on the bus during 5 degree temps to go to a shelter they'd rather go down in the sub.

Mental illness.drugs and the breakdown of the family into apathic selfish individuals.... Not budget cuts

So what we have now is re-institutionalization but not in mental hospitals but prisons .....with mentally challenged galore in them.

Hmmm...you may want to lay this on Kennedy, but I honestly never saw the homeless in Manhattan at least, before 1973 or so. All the talk in the paper and in school at the time was about the budget crisis being the cause. I'm just guessing, but maybe they were dumped on the street by these community homes when they stopped receiving their funding.

[Wild Style]

Originally Posted by fauve

Well, I was referring to the indecent exposure being a once in a lifetime thing, but hey if your co-workers have seen it too, I imagine it's the same guy and someone needs to call the cops. Then, sadly as runswithscissors laid out, he'll be re-institutionalized in prison.

There was a lot of ugliness in Greenwich Village, in Miami Beach, in the East Village, and the Design District you like now, before there was gentrification. Hollywood imo is another place like those. It attracts the same kind of people who loved those places before they became famous. And, it's those people who will make Hollywood truly special, and whom I believe will make it bloom.

The problem is that once these places are on the map they become REALLY expensive. The people who put up with the ugliness now I believe will be rewarded. But in choosing a home you have to do just that, choose a home, not an investment. You have to choose what's right for you. Miami Beach was right for me in the late-80's because I was 25. I can remember avoiding certain streets and back alleys when leaving clubs at 2 in the morning. There was certainly danger in the air. But it sure was fun and I liked Miami Beach then more than now. People who are looking for that kind of edge will like Hollywood more than anywhere else in South Florida right now. It's interesting.

I didn't say the people I know who live in Hollywood saw some guy exposing himself. I said they have seen odd balls (other than the guy I saw) all over the downtown. It just goes to show that entire area is a problem. As for your comparisons of a 2009 Hollywood to 1980s Miami and New York City, that doesn't work. Again, those places had far more to offer even with the blight than Hollywood Florida ever does or will. What does Hollywood have economically that makes it viable? Everything people try to name about what Hollywood has is nothing that other places that are FAR more viable and becoming more affordable (and will continue to). Those small areas in the city of Miami like the design district or Miami beach have greater Miami to draw from to make it a place someone would want to be in. Also, the expense argument doesn't work seeing as how prices are falling (both rent and mortgage) and will not be stopping for years to come. Hollywood has none of what Miami or New York City had to offer in the 80s as compared to 2009 Hollywood. It is a city of blight.

They tried to revive the downtown and it failed. The city officials had to give all sorts of money to get businesses into the downtown and it was just throwing good money after bad. They would give money to these businesses and in months those same businesses would be out of business. Just go look at the sun sentinel they wrote two articles on the subject.

[fauve]

Originally Posted by Wild Style

I didn't say the people I know who live in Hollywood saw some guy exposing himself. I said they have seen odd balls (other than the guy I saw) all over the downtown. It just goes to show that entire area is a problem. As for your comparisons of a 2009 Hollywood to 1980s Miami and New York City, that doesn't work. Again, those places had far more to offer even with the blight than Hollywood Florida ever does or will. What does Hollywood have economically that makes it viable? Everything people try to name about what Hollywood has is nothing that other places that are FAR more viable and becoming more affordable (and will continue to). Those small areas in the city of Miami like the design district or Miami beach have greater Miami to draw from to make it a place someone would want to be in. Also, the expense argument doesn't work seeing as how prices are falling (both rent and mortgage) and will not be stopping for years to come. Hollywood has none of what Miami or New York City had to offer in the 80s as compared to 2009 Hollywood. It is a city of blight.

They tried to revive the downtown and it failed. The city officials had to give all sorts of money to get businesses into the downtown and it was just throwing good money after bad. They would give money to these businesses and in months those same businesses would be out of business. Just go look at the sun sentinel they wrote two articles on the subject.

We can agree to disagree, but I do believe you're discounting the draw of a cheap well-kept beachfront area in a city in the middle of S Florida commutable to Miami & Ft Lauderdale that has youth, entertainment, a walking downtown and a decades-old history of tourism. The future will tell.

[Wild Style]

Originally Posted by fauve

We can agree to disagree, but I do believe you're discounting the draw of a cheap well-kept beachfront area in a city in the middle of S Florida commutable to Miami & Ft Lauderdale that has youth, entertainment, a walking downtown and a decades-old history of tourism. The future will tell.

hasnt helped in the past and it wont help it in the future. History is the best guide.