U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics > Frugal Living
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-10-2008, 08:02 AM
 
Location: western East Roman Empire
6,112 posts, read 10,150,825 times
Reputation: 4850

Advertisements

I did my own calculations about 2 1/2 years ago and, with my driving needs, the Prius hybrid didn't make sense, even with the tax rebate and assuming gas at $5 over a seven-year period. I bought a Toyota Matrix instead, manual transmission (stick shift), supposedly gets 30 MPH (this decreases with use).

The hope is that over the next seven-ten years hybrid engines, perhaps including advanced lithium or other such batteries, will have improved, also in terms of cost, thereby making them more accessible and sensible to a much larger swathe of the market.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-11-2008, 04:45 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,388 posts, read 42,713,043 times
Reputation: 11465
Couple of points about hybrids - first, they actually get better mileage in stop and go traffic than at cruise, provided you don't stop so suddenly that the brakes rather than the electric motor acting as a generator do most of the stopping. Any gas engine is more efficient when accelerating than at throttled cruise. This is why the mileage marathon guys accelerate say from 20 to 30 at full or nearly full throttle in high gear, then cut the engine off, coast down from 30 to 20 and then bump-start for another cycle. The hybrid does sort of a modified version of this that's more practical for actual driving.

Another thing about hybrids is that they need to be driven at the very least about 2X per week, or the main battery will have problems and need replacing (so I am told, by local cabbies who drive Priei (Plural of Prius must be Priei, right - it's basically a Latin word, masculine gender...Stimulus, Stimuli, therefore Prius, Priei - but I digress) Not certain what exactly happens with the battery.

Third point, ask any EMT or fireman - a Prius that's been involved in a major wreck can be right scary, if it's getting down to "jaws of life" time they can't work as quickly as they would on a conventional car, since shorting the battery out could cause a fire or explosion -

So you have to be OK with these points for a hybrid to be right for you.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2008, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Earth
1,442 posts, read 3,569,857 times
Reputation: 844
I think the hybrid price point is way too high, so high that not enough people can buy them to make a difference. Longevity is in question, as is replacement costs when those batteries start losing their punch.

I'd just assume buy used, pay cash, and rely on alternatives to get around as much as possible, and save the vehicle for consolidated errands, trips, etc. Gas prices become less important when you drive less, and when you buy used, you pay less on insurance, taxes, etc.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2008, 02:32 AM
 
3,853 posts, read 11,422,302 times
Reputation: 2503
Personally I think the hybrids are a good idea but right now the price is still too high for the extra cost. Any money you save from gas will just go to paying the higher sticker price. For example, the 08 prius runs about 21k or .48 cents per mile according to yahoo auto. If you compare that to some of the cheapest new cars in the US.

toyota yaris (11.5k) = .41/mile
Chevy aveo (10.2k) = .43/mile
Kia Rio (10.8k) = .44/mile

Now, the kicker here is that the new prius will be a plug in version. That means you can use electricity from the grid (a lot cheaper than electricity generated from gasoline). Depending on your driving habits you could technically use no gasoline at all, but more realistically the plug in version will get 100 mpg. That could very well make the prius (even at 21k msrp) be the cheapest new car to operate in the US.

If you are looking for the cheap of the cheap in transportation then you should get a high MPG used car like a civic or toyota echo.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2008, 04:11 AM
 
Location: Backwoods of Maine
6,940 posts, read 7,658,930 times
Reputation: 17837
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I buy cars with over 100 k miles for no more than $5,000. I usually get an additional 100k with one major repair. The money I save compensates for the gasoline used.

Buy transport not image or entertainment.
Now there's a lot of common sense here! Anybody remember the 1970's? (If you were even alive back then...). Most people drove used cars - and felt lucky to have one. The SUV hadn't been invented yet. Those old cars went well over 100,000 miles; I had one that went to 250,000 and I ditched it only because I found something better (used).

Today, the idea of buying a used vehicle seems almost unthinkable! Oh, my, how we have been brainwashed by advertising!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2008, 08:02 AM
 
Location: Earth
1,442 posts, read 3,569,857 times
Reputation: 844
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nor'Eastah View Post
Now there's a lot of common sense here! Anybody remember the 1970's? (If you were even alive back then...). Most people drove used cars - and felt lucky to have one. The SUV hadn't been invented yet. Those old cars went well over 100,000 miles; I had one that went to 250,000 and I ditched it only because I found something better (used).

Today, the idea of buying a used vehicle seems almost unthinkable! Oh, my, how we have been brainwashed by advertising!
I do believe the subprime lending fiasco fallout will fix this...no more inflated 'false equity' that folks can pull out of their McHouses to go buy/lease new vehicles. The # of new gas guzzlers on the road went right in hand with the whole housing craze.

The auto makers are offering up 'employee pricing' again, and Toby Keith sure thinks we all need an F-150, "the truck that built America" (WTF does that mean?!...LOL)

Hybrids are a step in the right direction, but I don't see the prices being within reach of the people who need them the most, and then there is a tradeoff in efficiency for safety...if you beef up a hybrid to survive collisions, you lose efficiency. If you minimize the girth, you're screwed in an accident....anybody seen the "Smart" cars? Sure would suck to get plowed over in one of those...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2008, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Apple Valley Calif
7,475 posts, read 19,565,214 times
Reputation: 5575
Quote:
Originally Posted by f_m View Post
You can get tax credits and carpool lane privileges in some places like California. Being able to drive the carpool lane can save a lot of time for some people.
California ended that program a year or more ago. They reached a predetermined limit of vehicles they would give the pass to. If you have a pass, it's still good, but no new ones will be issued.
Used cars that have the special decal on the side command a preimum price for sellers, just because of the pass.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-14-2008, 09:14 PM
f_m
 
2,289 posts, read 7,363,491 times
Reputation: 868
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donn2390 View Post
California ended that program a year or more ago. They reached a predetermined limit of vehicles they would give the pass to. If you have a pass, it's still good, but no new ones will be issued.
Used cars that have the special decal on the side command a preimum price for sellers, just because of the pass.
It's good that they won't allow too many of them. Although there still seems to be the same program for alternate vehicles meeting the super ultra-low emissions.

Clean Air Stickers - High Occupancy Vehicle (HOV) Lane Usage
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-16-2008, 03:06 AM
 
Location: Road Warrior
2,015 posts, read 4,898,363 times
Reputation: 797
Quote:
Originally Posted by ViewFromThePeak View Post
I don't understand why people who are interested in saving money just purchase something like a Mazda3 or Corolla getting 32 and 41 MPG highway, respectively. Both have decent maneuverability and are well rated in safety. Plus, you don't have to plunk down massive amounts of money for a new battery at 100K miles.
Yup I have a Mazda3 that gets 400 miles per 12 gallon tank, it's a lot more mileage than a hybrid SUV, also half the pricetag and half the maintenance.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics > Frugal Living
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top