U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics > Frugal Living
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 02-04-2011, 03:39 PM
 
1,096 posts, read 3,987,394 times
Reputation: 1093

Advertisements

Would someone close this thread already!!!

 
Old 02-04-2011, 04:20 PM
 
12,671 posts, read 20,496,910 times
Reputation: 2618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
Not much like an apartment at all. You can't turn around and sell an apartment. In the ledger book:
Vehicle=Credit
Apartment=Debit
House=Credit
Mortgage=Debit

You seem to be strictly talking about Accounting terms.
 
Old 02-04-2011, 04:21 PM
 
12,671 posts, read 20,496,910 times
Reputation: 2618
Quote:
Originally Posted by rfr69 View Post
Would someone close this thread already!!!
May I know why?
 
Old 02-04-2011, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Moscow
2,078 posts, read 2,906,095 times
Reputation: 2523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas User View Post
You seem to be strictly talking about Accounting terms.
Yes. When one is talking about money-how it is accounted for, utilized, etc-accounting terms do provide a good common reference point. Accountants don't tend to be wishy washy on whether something is an asset, debt, etc.
 
Old 02-05-2011, 03:00 AM
 
5,483 posts, read 8,168,244 times
Reputation: 7307
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
Not much like an apartment at all. You can't turn around and sell an apartment. In the ledger book:
Vehicle=Credit
Apartment=Debit
House=Credit
Mortgage=Debit

Apartment rent is not a debt, it IS a expense/liability however.

MY 'next months motorcycle insurance' is not a debt. I can cancel it and leave them parked if I wish. (Similar)

It IS an expense however... One I will pay. (Actually have... I stay ahead on all my bills)

House is not automatically credit (Hell, it's not credit unless you have an open line of home equity period.)

Vehicle is not an asset if it's worth less than is owed, and a (However poor) asset if it's worth more than you owe.

-If it's a lease... it's NOT a credit...

Seems you need to join the real world.
 
Old 02-05-2011, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Moscow
2,078 posts, read 2,906,095 times
Reputation: 2523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
Apartment rent is not a debt, it IS a expense/liability however.
I did not say it was a debt. I said it went on the debit side of the ledger. That's as opposed to the credit side of the ledger...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
MY 'next months motorcycle insurance' is not a debt. I can cancel it and leave them parked if I wish. (Similar)
Insurance was not referred to. A vehicle was. The vehicle goes on the asset side of the ledger. Any associated vehicle loan, of course, goes on the debit side.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
It IS an expense however... One I will pay. (Actually have... I stay ahead on all my bills)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
House is not automatically credit (Hell, it's not credit unless you have an open line of home equity period.)
Unless you have no equity built into your house (assuming you own and don't rent), it goes on the credit side of the ledger. Any loans on the house go to the debit side. Renting is totally on the debit side of the ledger.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
Vehicle is not an asset if it's worth less than is owed, and a (However poor) asset if it's worth more than you owe.
The vehicle is an asset-even if you owe more than it is worth. You can sell it and lessen your obligation on the loan. Again, vehicle on asset side of ledger, balanced by loan against it on debit side.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
-If it's a lease... it's NOT a credit...
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
Seems you need to join the real world.
As I said earlier: Accountants don't tend to be wishy washy on whether something is an asset, debt, etc.

I do try to spend most of my time in the real world. You are invited to join me.
 
Old 02-06-2011, 06:51 AM
 
Location: Miami
410 posts, read 672,597 times
Reputation: 215
I work at a world class resort, in accounting. I see what "rich" people spend, and I can assue you, they are not all frugal. Many think nothing of dropping $200.00 on Sunday Brunch.
 
Old 02-06-2011, 10:21 PM
 
5,483 posts, read 8,168,244 times
Reputation: 7307
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname
Apartment rent is not a debt, it IS a expense/liability however.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post

I did not say it was a debt. I said it went on the debit side of the ledger. That's as opposed to the credit side of the ledger...
Please allow me to refresh your memory:



Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim
Not much like an apartment at all. You can't turn around and sell an apartment. In the ledger book:
Vehicle=Credit
Apartment=Debit
House=Credit
Mortgage=Debit
It seems you DID.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
Insurance was not referred to. A vehicle was. The vehicle goes on the asset side of the ledger. Any associated vehicle loan, of course, goes on the debit side.
I referred to it.
I understand 'which side of the ledger' each goes on.

Thing is... try to sell that car, without eliminating the 'car debt side of the ledger'... IN THE REAL WORLD... it just don't work that way.
Just like the $50K underwater house... they go hand in hand. (While the math is divided for the purposes of keeping overall track.)

But we're not talking net worth here. (Which is why you divide it)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
Unless you have no equity built into your house (assuming you own and don't rent), it goes on the credit side of the ledger. Any loans on the house go to the debit side. Renting is totally on the debit side of the ledger.
Which is precisely the scinario being discussed ($50K underwater)... Next question please.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
The vehicle is an asset-even if you owe more than it is worth.
It is COUNTED as an asset. If it COSTS you more than it's worth... it drags you down... Debt. (Indeed, that's the term for a car loan is it not?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
You can sell it and lessen your obligation on the loan. Again, vehicle on asset side of ledger, balanced by loan against it on debit side.
Actually you can't. Unless you have good personal credid (Good name) or other assets to post as bond in order to sell the car.
THIS IS HOW YOU KNOW IT IS NOT YOURS.
-THe Truck and 2 bikes infront of my front door are mine. I can give them away, sell them, donate them etc without asking anyone's permission. Financial or otherwise.
When you cannot do this (Like when you only own PART of it (Or none of it if upside down) YOU DO NOT OWN IT.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
As I said earlier: Accountants don't tend to be wishy washy on whether something is an asset, debt, etc.
Not wishy washy... just the difference between the theoretical and the actual.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
I do try to spend most of my time in the real world. You are invited to join me.
Tell you what. GO sell a house or car you owe more than it's worth WITHOUT using something else to cover the debt... and then get back to me.

I believe we'll see your 'real world' fall apart.

I say again, excepting with lines on paper (For the sole purposes of keeping track) you cannot separate the two.
 
Old 02-06-2011, 11:10 PM
 
Location: Moscow
2,078 posts, read 2,906,095 times
Reputation: 2523
All you have done is shown that either 1. you don't know basic accounting practice, or 2. are unwilling to accept that it is a real world practice. The ledger has two sides-debit and credit. Loans and all expenses go on debit, assets go on credit. Even if the loan attached to the asset is more than the asset is worth, the asset still goes on one side of the ledger, the debt on the other. Argue real world all you want, of course the creditor has legally linked the debt you owe to collateral-your creditor also views it as a potential asset! They are still two entries in the ledger book. I'm talking basic accounting practices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname View Post
Tell you what. GO sell a house or car you owe more than it's worth WITHOUT using something else to cover the debt... and then get back to me.

I believe we'll see your 'real world' fall apart.
Can't-don't have anything that fits that description. I make it a point to live debt free.
 
Old 02-06-2011, 11:51 PM
 
5,483 posts, read 8,168,244 times
Reputation: 7307
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keim View Post
All you have done is shown that either 1. you don't know basic accounting practice, or 2. are unwilling to accept that it is a real world practice. The ledger has two sides-debit and credit. Loans and all expenses go on debit, assets go on credit. Even if the loan attached to the asset is more than the asset is worth, the asset still goes on one side of the ledger, the debt on the other. Argue real world all you want, of course the creditor has legally linked the debt you owe to collateral-your creditor also views it as a potential asset! They are still two entries in the ledger book. I'm talking basic accounting practices.



Can't-don't have anything that fits that description. I make it a point to live debt free.

(Sighs) I have stated SEVERAL TIMES that I understand the way it is broken down (as you say) FOR BASIC ACCOUNTING PRACTICE...

My point (AGAIN):
That's numbers on a page, and, while VERY important for 'balancing the books' and 'knowing where you stand' is (Again) Theoretical, vs actual.

-You recite this in an attempt to draw attention from the FACTS... just as your last line attempts to circumnavigate the FACT that I am right, and what I say is the way it REALLY IS. (Wether your debt free or not)

If you Owe $100 on something you can sell (IF there si a buyer) for $50...

You've taken a $50 LOSS!

That's loss... not a gain/asset.

When you CAN'T EVEN SELL IT unless someone else says "ok"... it's not yours.

Disagree? Tell that to the people who got foreclosed on.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics > Frugal Living
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top