How come today, mixed-race 'Native Americans' look 'Irish' or 'German' or 'European'?? (Polish, government)

[Bluesmama]

Originally Posted by Time and Space

Seems like now days, every one I meet who says their 'Native American' or 'American Indian'...looks...well...looks 'white'...

What's up with that?

I'm not in the mood to read all the posts but I'll add what I do know.

I grew up in Central California where many of the "Okie" migrants settled during the Depression. In the 60's I grew up in a very interesting area that had many "Okie" descendants, and something that didn't take me long to notice is that most of the kids said that they had Indian in their mix. Of course, most didn't look Native Indian, although some had eyes shaped as such, or had high cheekbones. While many of today's Native Indians look a little more "blended", many whites have some Indian in them and don't particularly show it.

Depending on which parts of the nation, there were mixes of Indian with Irish, some with Creoles, some with blacks, and in very early American history, some with Nordics.

[City Boy Columbus]

I Like to say this to all Native Americans on this forum and to all Whites. Do you know of the Olmec discussion that is going on today. Yes those poor ol Olmecs who everybody say are Native but look like west africans. Now I am not trying to be funny but why is it that we associate every culture by it's near territory, like Indians from India with asians even though they look nothing alike. All the asians races look oriental and the Indians dont have any slanted eyes but they are grouped with the Orientals. Now natives aren't free from racism either like I said I am not tryna be a conflictive to everybody but I notice on the Olmec discusion you had some natives saying Blacks were stealing history. Now if you are getting mad at something claiming your culture that looks nothing like you why would natives and whites of all people get mad at blacks claiming Olmecs which have similar features to blacks. Olmecs even bared some cultural similarities to today western Africans. If we weren't Olmec which I not saying we are or we are not at least unbiasly prove it and not only that compare a native american face that look similar to that of that person. I didnot see one native face in all of the whole discusion that looked likthe the Olmec. Not only that the Olmecs don't even have those mongloid looking eyes as do most natives. To me seems like there is a lot of stolen or lost history out there that is too sensitive for people to discuss.

[City Boy Columbus]

Originally Posted by Time and Space

Not by me it hasn't...

I just also notice with the 'whitening' of American tribes, their hostility towards 'dark skinned' peoples, begins to reflect that of the original invadors or settlers...

Tribes that once shielded and protected escaped slaves, and had no sense of color value in them, are no longer like that...

Infact, in Oklahoma, there was a large tribe that was expelling members who had to much 'negroid' features to them, but weren't doing the same for those who had to much 'Caucasion' features...

Native Americans reflected neither caucasions, nor negroids...but today, they seem more comfortable with 'caucasion' featured members...

Obviously there's something phycological behind that...

And I suppose in another 100 years, there will be no genetic trace left at all of how the original natives of this continant looked...except in paintings...

Those tribes are not native americans they are whites that is why they did that. Like we beeen saying all along why have whites mainly irish looking whites have been claiming native american. I belive they are a white supremisist group cause they seem like they definately want to feel more american than the blacks claiming native.

[City Boy Columbus]

Originally Posted by Padgett2

I read a book about this very thing years ago. I wish that I could remember the name, but I dont. What happens is that the "native american" genes that give them the skin coloring, etc. is a recessive one. It may disappear after the first "cross" with a white. It will be completly gone after the fourth.

It's the same thing with the asian and black genes. The asian is the quickest to go and, I think, the black recessive gene hangs on for 6 or 7 generations. That said, a couple with both carrying a recessive black or asian gene could have a child with the genetic traits of an ancestor, even though the parents or white.

I begg to differ on that look at Mexicans there are dark ones which are the biracial mix of native and white. I saw a white and mexican which mixed with white and the genes or traits of the Mexican was still there but true enough the skin coloring was gone. I also say this how is a gene that hangs on 7 generation recessive. Black genes are dominate if anything because it would more than likely take you about seven or even eight genarations before you wipe out the gene. Most african americans are not the real deal so you can't base your study on them we are a little watered down some of us a lot.

[Angelic_Avalon]

I have a non-related aunt that is Cherokee that look very native american although dont get anything from the gov which I find it strange that some whites claimed to be native and get it LOL


I'm not Indian I'm Assyrian/Babylonian

[ColombianaBoricua]

Originally Posted by City Boy Columbus

Most people on that cherokee reservation aint native belive me they did a scientific study of certain tribes who were on that land claiming native/jew. These people were found out by genetist not to be natives or jews at all. I saw this on nat geo which is sometimes reliable. But anyway me and my brother use to say the same thing why is that so. I also once live with a cambodian who my brother was going with and end up having a baby with she thought for years native americans were white due to paintings and those people who claimed it. ijust think those who claim native american who are white or any other color maybe trying to feel more american than others who don't have it in them or who do but don't claim it.

Yeah I read about that too. They're frauds and they know it. SMH.
In some Native American reservations, all you have to do is be able to find an ancestor that was enrolled in that reservation to be legally recognized as a "Native American", even though many of these people are white and have no more than 15% Native blood. Most of the "Native Americans" in the US aren't native at all, they're just white people or mixed bloods (pred white). Pure/nearly pure Native Americans (Real Americans as I call them) are south of the American border.

[LeeLee77]

All I can say is....(i am from the appalchian mountains) half my family look hawaiian or mongolian and the other half within the same family look russian or slavic. I am constantly mistaken for a russian girl , even by russians. The reason my family actually look asian, is because they are american inidan mixed. I am only 5% in a blood test, my grandmother who looks half korean or mongolian obviously would be more. I can only guess the reason people mistake me for russian , is because of the asian looking genetics (indian genetics) that I have. Even tho 5% is not alot, I guess it can still show up in light colored face. go figure. if anyone has a better guess how mongolian looking people with green eyes are living in appalachia mountains, please let me know!

[Time and Space]

A Freedman, is a Cherokee member who has slave ancestry....

Cherokee Nation Expels Descendants of Tribes' Black Slaves

Here's some interesting facts I learned today...

1. The Cherokee tribe use to inhabit the SE...Florida, Missisippi, Alabama ect ect...

They were forcibly moved, marched, out west to the Oaklahoma territory to make room for 'white settlers'...known as the 'march of death'...cause so many died on the way out there...

2. Some of the Cherokees living in that region at the time owned 'black' slaves...and these slaves marched with them...their owners, out west...
Later on, when civil war ended...the slave decendants were made members of the tribe...

Well today or yesterday...the Cherokee council voted to strip all such slaves of their membership to the tribe...

With the Europeanization of more and more tribes...I guess it's only natural for that whole color scale, ancestry scale...mentality to start to rear it's head...

I find it sad and revealing how the tribe doesn't seek to expel other people of Irish or German or Britian decent...only those of African decent are getting expelled...

It's so obvious where that 'spirit' comes from...

Many of these 'freedman'...only know indian culture...it's who they are...and now they're being told in essence, to get lost...

I can only imagine the pain of how that must feel....to be stripped of the only identity you've ever known...

Boy..the legacy of the whole slave trade thing just continues to hurt and wreck peoples lives, even today...

[yarddawg]

You need to do a little more reading up.

1) The Cherokee tribe used to inhabit the southern Appalachians. Eastern Tennessee, northern Georgia, northern South Carolina, Western North Carolina and a sliver of southeastern Kentucky and southwestern Virginia.

2) The controversy of which you speak has been going on for years and originated with the decision to base membership in the Oklahoma Cherokee Nation on descent from an ancestor listed on the Dawes roll as Cherokee By Blood. It does exclude the descendants of African slaves listed as freedmen on the Dawes who have no Cherokee ancestry as well as the descendants of intermarried whites on the Dawes who have no Cherokee ancestry and descendants of Cherokee who were not on the Dawes roll. The Dawes was not an exhaustive census of Cherokee people, it only included those who were living on the Oklahoma reservation between about 1898 and 1902 and were in a family which applied for a land allotment and were eligible based on themselves or their ancestors being listed on previous qualifying rolls. This decision does not exclude anyone of African ancestry who also had an ancestor listed as Cherokee By Blood on the Dawes, it doesn't throw all the black people out of the tribe.

Originally Posted by Time and Space

A Freedman, is a Cherokee member who has slave ancestry....

Cherokee Nation Expels Descendants of Tribes' Black Slaves

Here's some interesting facts I learned today...

1. The Cherokee tribe use to inhabit the SE...Florida, Missisippi, Alabama ect ect...

They were forcibly moved, marched, out west to the Oaklahoma territory to make room for 'white settlers'...known as the 'march of death'...cause so many died on the way out there...

2. Some of the Cherokees living in that region at the time owned 'black' slaves...and these slaves marched with them...their owners, out west...
Later on, when civil war ended...the slave decendants were made members of the tribe...

Well today or yesterday...the Cherokee council voted to strip all such slaves of their membership to the tribe...

With the Europeanization of more and more tribes...I guess it's only natural for that whole color scale, ancestry scale...mentality to start to rear it's head...

I find it sad and revealing how the tribe doesn't seek to expel other people of Irish or German or Britian decent...only those of African decent are getting expelled...

It's so obvious where that 'spirit' comes from...

Many of these 'freedman'...only know indian culture...it's who they are...and now they're being told in essence, to get lost...

I can only imagine the pain of how that must feel....to be stripped of the only identity you've ever known...

Boy..the legacy of the whole slave trade thing just continues to hurt and wreck peoples lives, even today...

[glass_of_merlot]

Originally Posted by Time and Space

Seems like now days, every one I meet who says their 'Native American' or 'American Indian'...looks...well...looks 'white'...

What's up with that?

Not that there's anything wrong with that...but I remember how the original native American people looked, from the northern tip of what is now Canada, to the South most point of South America...this whole hemisphere consisted of brown or golden skin natives...

Same with American tribes...they were not 'white'...they were 'red' or 'brown' or 'copper' in color...with jet black shiny hair...

But now days, it seems everytime someone tells me their American Indian...the look 'lilly white'...

And again, there's nothing wrong with that...(human is human)...

But as far as distinct Indian features, color and tone, where did it go?

Thats a hard question. My guess....they made babies with white people....just a wild guess!