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My most shocking thing has to be that despite being White I have African slave ancestors. Never had an inkling of it, stories of it, or any suspicion that this would be the case. DNA has revealed that I actually have two sources of African ancestry and cousins of one ancestors have African male Y DNA, meaning one of my African ancestors exported as a slave out of Africa was an African male (so that was another surprise). Somewhere long ago descendants started passing for white and kept it hidden.
My most shocking thing has to be that despite being White I have African slave ancestors. Never had an inkling of it, stories of it, or any suspicion that this would be the case. DNA has revealed that I actually have two sources of African ancestry and cousins of one ancestors have African male Y DNA, meaning one of my African ancestors exported as a slave out of Africa was an African male (so that was another surprise). Somewhere long ago descendants started passing for white and kept it hidden.
That is really interesting.
There is a book about a mixed-race family in which some members passed for white while others lived as black people. I always meant to read it.
My most shocking thing has to be that despite being White I have African slave ancestors. Never had an inkling of it, stories of it, or any suspicion that this would be the case. DNA has revealed that I actually have two sources of African ancestry and cousins of one ancestors have African male Y DNA, meaning one of my African ancestors exported as a slave out of Africa was an African male (so that was another surprise). Somewhere long ago descendants started passing for white and kept it hidden.
One of my newly found cousins was shocked as well to discover this. Her dad was the cousin of my great grandmother and she turned out to be 10% Sub-Saharan African. She started a tree and discovered our family. She was upset because she never knew us when we lived in the same city. Her father didn't "pass" per se, but he looked white to most people (even though he didn't really to me, he reminded me of my great grandmother, but she, honestly did look like a brunette white woman to most people). He also married a white woman. He got into an argument with some prominent members of the family and they never spoke to each other again back in the 1960s, so it wasn't about passing, it was about a fight over money and the family business.
Shocking is a strong word, I guess, for what I found. A murder and acquittal, a few suicides, someone with a made-up past, gangsters, and slave ownership in an odd situation. I had a distant cousin who was an SOB and was murdered by a female relative in front of witnesses. The jury let her off. The suicides were on one side of the family and all within two generations. A gr-grandfather changed his name and concocted a story about where he came from...the country...he wasn't Bavarian as he claimed on his naturalization papers but was on the run from Czarist Russia/Ukraine. I have a bunch of Ukrainian cousins...but I still don't know the whole story. My Irish grandmother's brothers were gang members and involved in all sorts of stuff. Both died quite young of TB and are buried in the same hole.
The slave story happened in New York state around 1800. My family is mostly all northerners from Massachusetts, Connecticut and New York and I didn't expect to find slave ownership. My ancestor was a plaintiff in a civil case and won. The defendant couldn't pay so the judge awarded my ancestor ownership of one of the defendant's house slaves...not what he wanted, but what he got. I don't know what happened to the slave but there was a stipulation that the defendant could buy her back when he could raise the money.
Thanks for sharing, will have to check that out. I remember watching a genealogy show that talked about a family with children of mixed skin colors, some light enough to pass others not and how it created some awkward situations where some siblings were being treated poorly wit others passing.
My DNA is quite small though, so it's 200-300 years ago or so (all sources)... It's been hidden for a long time. Though obviously sometime back there must have been a situation similar.
I do have a sort of hint of one of those towards my African male ancestor. The furthest known ancestor up that line is a John Busby from South Carolina, probably born around 1730. Through multiple male descendants we know he was paternally descended from an Sub-Saharan African male. What's interesting is though he's White in all records we know of he was in the back country and tied to other Busbys that were obviously considered to possibly not be fully White. The earliest record of him is giving a statement that two Busby men (likely his nephews) were White, that their mother was White.. .meaning someone was questioning. Now it was up their maternal line so not his line and he was giving the statement so he must have been considered "White" enough to give the statement, but it's definitely interesting since I know he wasn't fully White. Additionally in a nearby county is a free colored family of Busbys. No known connection but knowing the DNA I suspect they are related, probably a branch that couldn't pass. Relations to Busbys, some intermarried lines, neighbors etc in that backcountry area were likely tri-racial (mostly white with some African and a bit Native) so what they considered "White" was probably not the same in some other areas.
Researching are a bit unsure where it goes from there. The multiple Y DNA tested modern male Busbys also match multiple Iveys very closely, to the point they like relate here in the US probably not long before John Busby. They share the same Sub-Saharan African Y DNA. Interestingly there are some mixed race Iveys to be found in North Carolina with an unknown but likely relation to the Ivey families (after the DNA researchers obviously started to consider a real connection to them a lot more, they share a similar naming pattern but no known documented connection). What's interesting is the Iveys and Busby surnames do meet up on families in a region of Virginia along Chippokes Creek where the Ivey line believed their line lead... it just so happens that some mulengeon and lumbee lines lead back to that same area. It seems there was a cluster of mix raced descended people from that region who then spread through North Carolina and South Carolina... one of the candidates for my Busby ancestor is a servant to someone on that Creek who is referred to as Thomas Busby an indian servant. He was likely named for someone else on that Creek a Thomas Busby an indian interpreter to the crown who also sold indian slaves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007
One of my newly found cousins was shocked as well to discover this. Her dad was the cousin of my great grandmother and she turned out to be 10% Sub-Saharan African. She started a tree and discovered our family. She was upset because she never knew us when we lived in the same city. Her father didn't "pass" per se, but he looked white to most people (even though he didn't really to me, he reminded me of my great grandmother, but she, honestly did look like a brunette white woman to most people). He also married a white woman. He got into an argument with some prominent members of the family and they never spoke to each other again back in the 1960s, so it wasn't about passing, it was about a fight over money and the family business.
Very fascinating, thanks for sharing. So many families separate for those reasons, money, business, or just arguments and not liking each other sometimes. It's sad because the split can be so easy but re-uniting can be so much harder.
Though nothing quite so specific (and no racial component) I know 1st cousins on my mother side but have only one 2nd cousin since my mother's father had only one sibling who had only one child and have never met any 3rd cousins etc (except via e-mail after genealogy work). There being only two children from my great grandparents created a bottleneck though also it turns out my grandfather was just plain a jerk, after he died my mother and family discovered he was a notorious cheater and made up stories with his friends and coworkers that my grandmother was just someone who took care of his children (a nanny or a sister). He probably was abusive (people are understandably not very verbal about that though I've gotten that impression) and his sister (my great aunt who is awesome and had a really good relationship with my mother and her siblings as well as myself, unfortunately who passed away within the last couple years) apparently didn't like him. I've gotten the impression that he probably wasn't liked by most family/people and that is part of why more distant relations weren't very known.
Unfortunately that means my mother, her generation and mine aren't connected to that family. One break down can sever it for a long time. I've fortunately have talked to some more distant relations after doing genealogy work.
Thanks for sharing, will have to check that out. I remember watching a genealogy show that talked about a family with children of mixed skin colors, some light enough to pass others not and how it created some awkward situations where some siblings were being treated poorly wit others passing.
My DNA is quite small though, so it's 200-300 years ago or so (all sources)... It's been hidden for a long time. Though obviously sometime back there must have been a situation similar.
I do have a sort of hint of one of those towards my African male ancestor. The furthest known ancestor up that line is a John Busby from South Carolina, probably born around 1730. Through multiple male descendants we know he was paternally descended from an Sub-Saharan African male. What's interesting is though he's White in all records we know of he was in the back country and tied to other Busbys that were obviously considered to possibly not be fully White. The earliest record of him is giving a statement that two Busby men (likely his nephews) were White, that their mother was White.. .meaning someone was questioning. Now it was up their maternal line so not his line and he was giving the statement so he must have been considered "White" enough to give the statement, but it's definitely interesting since I know he wasn't fully White. Additionally in a nearby county is a free colored family of Busbys. No known connection but knowing the DNA I suspect they are related, probably a branch that couldn't pass. Relations to Busbys, some intermarried lines, neighbors etc in that backcountry area were likely tri-racial (mostly white with some African and a bit Native) so what they considered "White" was probably not the same in some other areas.
Researching are a bit unsure where it goes from there. The multiple Y DNA tested modern male Busbys also match multiple Iveys very closely, to the point they like relate here in the US probably not long before John Busby. They share the same Sub-Saharan African Y DNA. Interestingly there are some mixed race Iveys to be found in North Carolina with an unknown but likely relation to the Ivey families (after the DNA researchers obviously started to consider a real connection to them a lot more, they share a similar naming pattern but no known documented connection). What's interesting is the Iveys and Busby surnames do meet up on families in a region of Virginia along Chippokes Creek where the Ivey line believed their line lead... it just so happens that some mulengeon and lumbee lines lead back to that same area. It seems there was a cluster of mix raced descended people from that region who then spread through North Carolina and South Carolina... one of the candidates for my Busby ancestor is a servant to someone on that Creek who is referred to as Thomas Busby an indian servant. He was likely named for someone else on that Creek a Thomas Busby an indian interpreter to the crown who also sold indian slaves.
Very fascinating, thanks for sharing. So many families separate for those reasons, money, business, or just arguments and not liking each other sometimes. It's sad because the split can be so easy but re-uniting can be so much harder.
Though nothing quite so specific (and no racial component) I know 1st cousins on my mother side but have only one 2nd cousin since my mother's father had only one sibling who had only one child and have never met any 3rd cousins etc (except via e-mail after genealogy work). There being only two children from my great grandparents created a bottleneck though also it turns out my grandfather was just plain a jerk, after he died my mother and family discovered he was a notorious cheater and made up stories with his friends and coworkers that my grandmother was just someone who took care of his children (a nanny or a sister). He probably was abusive (people are understandably not very verbal about that though I've gotten that impression) and his sister (my great aunt who is awesome and had a really good relationship with my mother and her siblings as well as myself, unfortunately who passed away within the last couple years) apparently didn't like him. I've gotten the impression that he probably wasn't liked by most family/people and that is part of why more distant relations weren't very known.
Unfortunately that means my mother, her generation and mine aren't connected to that family. One break down can sever it for a long time. I've fortunately have talked to some more distant relations after doing genealogy work.
On your Busby and Ivy lines, have you checked out the site by Paul Heinegg?
[CENTER]BUSBY/ BUZBY FAMILY[/CENTER]
1. Thomas Busby, born about 1674, was an "Indyan boy" servant to Mr. Robert Caufield of Surry County, Virginia, in July 1684 when his age was adjudged at ten years (in order to know when he was tithable) [Haun, Surry County Court Records, 1682-91, 444]. His descendants may have been related to the Hawley/ Holly and Scott families of North and South Carolina. On 12 March 1754 a "mulatto boy Busby alias John Scott" was recovered in Orange County, North Carolina, after being stolen from his mother. He was the son of Amy Hawley and grandson of John Scott of South Carolina. The Orange County court appointed Thomas Chavis to return the child to his family in South Carolina [Haun, Orange County Court Minutes, I:70, 71]. White members of the Busby family were taxables in Bladen County, North Carolina, from 1768 to 1789 [Byrd, Bladen County Tax Lists, I:2, 68; II:44, 45, 72, 206].
Members of the family in South Carolina were
i. Mary Buzby, head of a Beaufort District household of 10 "other free" in 1790 [SC:11] and 5 "other free" in 1800 [SC:104]. In 1790 Mary was living in the same district as Moses Scott, head of a Beaufort District household of 8 "other free" [SC:11]. ii. John Busby, born before 1776, head of a Barnwell District household of 2 "other free" in 1800 [SC:62] and 2 "free colored" in 1820 [SC:3a]. He enlisted in the 3rd South Carolina Regiment on 18 July 1778 and was discharged on 1 July 1781 [NARA, M246, roll 89, frame 379]. He was nearly eighty years old on 23 October 1829 when he applied for a pension for his services in the Revolution while resident in Barnwell District, South Carolina. He stated 1779 on the Savannah River under Captain that he entered the service in Daniel Green until the end of the war, "being a colored man, the duty assigned him was to remain with and protect the baggage and provisions of the company." He received a pension for his services on 5 June 1830 [S.C. Archives series S108092, reel 17, frames 157, 166].
Wondering if the blue John Busby is your ancestor?
There is also an Ivey portion of this website in case you haven't checked it out.
It has been helpful for me on a lot of my free "colored" lines.
I also have some colonial ancestry in NC/SC and VA in regards to the Morgan family. Some of them were labeled as "white" on various documents. I've read things that they are also a "tri-racial" family but I honestly believe they are just European and African.
The cousin mentioned above though is related to me through a paternal great grandmother who does come from a "tri-racial" family, multiple tri-racial families actually on her paternal side. My new cousin is a cousin via this great grandmother's maternal line where there is rather recent European ancestry that dominates, but granny's father was from a community of free people that had been living there since the early 1800s after they migrated away from specific communities in VA and NC.
Wondering if the blue John Busby is your ancestor?
There is also an Ivey portion of this website in case you haven't checked it out.
It has been helpful for me on a lot of my free "colored" lines.
I also have some colonial ancestry in NC/SC and VA in regards to the Morgan family. Some of them were labeled as "white" on various documents. I've read things that they are also a "tri-racial" family but I honestly believe they are just European and African.
The cousin mentioned above though is related to me through a paternal great grandmother who does come from a "tri-racial" family, multiple tri-racial families actually on her paternal side. My new cousin is a cousin via this great grandmother's maternal line where there is rather recent European ancestry that dominates, but granny's father was from a community of free people that had been living there since the early 1800s after they migrated away from specific communities in VA and NC.
Hey, thanks for haring. Absolutely love Paul Heinegg's work. The John Busby he refers to their is part of the family I mentioned in a nearby South Carolina county. That John is too young to mine, mine was born in the 1730s or so, his son (my ancestor) was born in 1762.
I highly suspect they are related.
Additionally Heinegg's research on the the Busby/Scott kid has been very interesting to me. It points out that in North Carolina a Thomas Chavis was assigned to take the kid to his family in South Carolina (Thomas Chavis being mixed race as well), it turns out his like brother Phillip Chavis had land right next to another John Busby, likely a nephew of my John Busby.
So it seems likely both families are related to my Busbys.
Not "shocking" but interesting finding through DNA today, my first match who is from Spain with all ancestors from Spain. It is a 13 cM segment that is shared with a lot of other matches, indicating it has been in the US since early colonial times. Many of these matches have ancestry from southeast North Carolina, with surnames like Chavis and Driggers (which were Chavez and Rodriguez before they were Anglicized). Common names from the Lumbee area. I have several ancestors from that area back in the 1700's but lots of dead ends, so I don't know how I'm related to those matches. But it's cool to imagine that I may have a remnant of DNA from early Spanish traders or settlers in the area.
Biggest shocker on my side: My great grandfather died from an opium overdose.
Biggest shocker on my husband's: his ancestor was a double agent in the revolutionary war.
Opium was used medicinally, as well as recreationally, in the past. Perhaps this was an accidental medicinal overdose.
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